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Anti-gay Americans not off the hook for this one

LGBT

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I realize it’s early in the morning to deal with the sociopathic levels of dishonesty that characterizes the leadership of the religious right, but I have to highlight this excellent piece of reporting in the NY Times on the responsibility that American evangelicals have for the Ugandan “death penalty for gays” bill.  Of course, what said evangelicals were counting on was the relative indifference the America press has towards foreign countries, especially developing nations.  The evidence on hand suggests that the Americans involved in encouraging and writing this bill figured that the press would blame the Ugandans solely—-under the assumption that they’re living in a backwater, etc.—-and not look into the role that Americans played.  And they would have gotten away with it, if it weren’t for that incredibly appealing lesbian show host on MSNBC!  Maddow refused to let this story go, and now the NY Times is coming forward and demonstrating how the cries of protestation from the evangelicals with ties to the Ugandan anti-gay movement are basically dishonest. 

Like this dishonest piece of shit:

“I feel duped,” Mr. Schmierer said, arguing that he had been invited to speak on “parenting skills” for families with gay children. He acknowledged telling audiences how homosexuals could be converted into heterosexuals, but he said he had no idea some Ugandans were contemplating the death penalty for homosexuality.

“That’s horrible, absolutely horrible,” he said. “Some of the nicest people I have ever met are gay people.”

Except, of course, that Schmierer was there to do a talk on how homosexuality is a choice and that people leave the lifestyle behind, which is a belief promoted by the religious right in order to justify throwing people in jail for being gay.  (He calls this “parenting skills”.)  Like with the anti-choice movement, you have to ignore their claims about what they’re doing, and look at the big picture, especially legally.  A lot of legal justice for gays and lesbians has come about as people start to see it as an identity, like race or class status—-and you can’t arrest people for what they are, just what they do.  By claiming it’s a choice, the religious right hopes to get homosexual sex reclassified as a choice that can be criminalized. 

As Rachel Maddow showed, the religious right putting forward “ex-gay” people as shield against criticisms that describe them as hating gay people isn’t working.  The implication of having “ex-gays” around has always been, “Hey, we let them use the toilet even though they’ve sucked a cock, what more do you want?”  But of course, the real reason to have ex-gays around is to give the hateful lies about gay people some authority, the implication being that those who actually did the deed know for a fact that gays are the evilest evil to ever evil.  When an ex-gay claims that gays recruit by raping children, wingnuts can feel good about themselves, because they say, “Hey, he should know.”  But of course, that’s simply not true, because the religious right has created huge incentives for so-called ex-gays to lie about their previous (and often ongoing) sexual behavior and habits, in order to keep the esteem and the paychecks coming.  And to get all expense paid trips to Uganda to do seminars on how gay men want to rape your children.  Here is the description given by the NY Times:

For three days, according to participants and audio recordings, thousands of Ugandans, including police officers, teachers and national politicians, listened raptly to the Americans, who were presented as experts on homosexuality. The visitors discussed how to make gay people straight, how gay men often sodomized teenage boys and how “the gay movement is an evil institution” whose goal is “to defeat the marriage-based society and replace it with a culture of sexual promiscuity.”


The denunciations of the anti-gay bill are easy enough to demonstrate as disingenuous.  It’s not just that the organizers presented gay people as child rapists who rape as an organized movement to make your wife stop cooking dinner for you and turn your daughter into a prostitute.  It’s that some of them actually helped write the bill.

But the Ugandan organizers of the conference admit helping draft the bill, and Mr. Lively has acknowledged meeting with Ugandan lawmakers to discuss it. He even wrote on his blog in March that someone had likened their campaign to “a nuclear bomb against the gay agenda in Uganda.”

It was only when he was caught that he started backpedaling, and lamely at that. 

One of the more interesting and terrible things that came out of this “conference”—-I’d describe it as a hate rally against gays and lesbians—-is that it worked like rallies do, to create a cultural trend for exhibiting violent hatred of gays and lesbians.  Gay activists in Uganda that the reporter spoke to report on rapes and the fear of lynching as repercussions of exciting already-existing homophobic sentiments. Zambian reverend Kapya Kaoma, who went undercover for 6 months to investigate the role American evangelicals are playing in the anti-gay movement, suggests that these leaders underestimated how Uganda would react to a conference about how gays are assaulting “the family”. 

He’s far too generous.  Right now, Rick Warren and company’s slow-moving denunciations of this law are due strictly to their desire to stay in the mainstream of American society, and have nothing to do with actual moral outrage.  After all, it’s an article of faith for the religious right that gay people “recruit” children because they can’t have their own.  There are so many assumptions bundled up in that—-that gay people don’t have children, that children can be considered carbon copies of their parents, that homosexuality is something taught at the knee instead of a genuine expression of sexual desire—-but I’d like to point out that what the accusation is, at its base, is a 21st century version of the blood libel.  The traditional blood libel that was a big deal in medieval Europe was to accuse Jews of killing and eating Christian children.  Nowadays, the accusation has changed somewhat—-now it’s that gays rape and recruit children—-but the structure is basically the same, which is to say that the hated group is constructed as a cult that feeds on your children.  And the religious right believes this stuff.  One of the books mentioned in the Times article is by Scott Lively, and it’s called “7 Steps to Recruit-Proof Your Child”. 

The point is that the blood libel exists to justify extreme violence against the targeted group, painting them as child-thieves who inflict a society’s most dreaded crimes (molestation, cannibalism) on the children, and by doing so, take them away from the parents.  So when the people who perpetuate this myth about gays and lesbians play innocent, we shouldn’t let them get away with it. 

 

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Posted by Amanda Marcotte on 11:19 AM • (39) Comments

There’s actually an even bigger win-win with using ex-gays.

As long as they are towing the line, they can be used as you say, as people who should know exactly how evil gay people are, and how necessary the saving power of Republicans is for society.

And if they get discredited as backsliders, or just plain liars, well, hey, they’re liars, right, and gay ones at that - even more proof that they were evil to begin with.

Comment #1: Lymis  on  01/04  at  11:26 AM

I wrote about this story this morning as well, though not in the same detail you did. An analogous situation, I think, to these men is that of anti-abortion groups which call abortion providers mass-murderers and then express surprise, even dismay when someone takes them at their word and kills a doctor. If you juggle flaming torches in the middle of an open ammo dump, you can’t claim to be surprised when shit explodes.

Comment #2: Incertus, Nacho Daddy  on  01/04  at  11:28 AM

And give the media a teeny, tiny bit of credit for not buying into the usual patriarchy where countries in Africa are usually concerned. They aren’t framing this as “the white people duped those poor, unsuspecting, naive black folks in Africa” for once. The media is actually calling “bullshit” on the fundies and it’s about time.

This is also another in a long string of failures by fundies to truly understand technology and that we live in a global world. Audio and video from camera phones (not to mention the massive number of emails these idiots send without thinking) cannot be erased from every computer in the world that it gets forwarded to.

Comment #3: DC Fem  on  01/04  at  11:59 AM

I saw that story this morning, and was horrified, though not exactly surprised, unfortunately. It’s just one more piece of evidence on the pile; American fundamentalists do not deplore the abuse of human rights and life in distant, poor (“backward”) nations like Uganda, they admire it. It’s like living in a fundamentalist and colonialist fantasy world for them; they can take up the white man’s burden and shepherd the poor dark folk of a distant continent toward God, enacting the hate legislation there that they wish they could here. They are in every way despicable and empty-hearted bastards.

Comment #4: grolby  on  01/04  at  12:00 PM

”...that homosexuality is something taught at the knee instead of a genuine expression of sexual desire…”

...well there’s you’re problem right there.  “Sexual Desire” is something those Dirty Hippies (and Bill Clinton) invented in the ‘60s. 

God’s People™ know that there is no desire involving sex that isn’t Evil and Wrong.  Sex is an obligation, used only to perpetuate the next generation of Shiny Happy (and white) Christians.

So remember Boys and Girls:  Get married and keep thy quiver full for the Glory of God, but thou must not enjoy any of the process or thou must surely burn in the fires of Hell…

Comment #5: MikeEss  on  01/04  at  01:00 PM

Would this be the same Uganda whose government and pre-eminent Christian terrorist organization have been recruiting child-soldiers to fight in their wars for the past 25 years?

Comment #6: Sarcastro  on  01/04  at  01:01 PM

“Would this be the same Uganda whose government and pre-eminent Christian terrorist organization have been recruiting child-soldiers to fight in their wars for the past 25 years?”

In the minds of many of these Christianists (at least their mindless followers) Uganda isn’t even a real place, not in the way that America is a real place.  Hell, all of Africa isn’t real — it’s just some place that gets mentioned when you are in school, where everyone is colored and starving.  There aren’t any real people over there, just brown stick figures whose “lives” are theoretical at best…

Comment #7: MikeEss  on  01/04  at  01:09 PM

merican fundamentalists do not deplore the abuse of human rights and life in distant, poor (“backward”) nations like Uganda, they admire it.

Actually, I think the word you’re looking for is “envy”.  It wasn’t long ago when you could throw a sodomite in prison if you caught him(or her) in the act, in the United States.  Those days might be waning in the US, but they have a bright future in impoverished and easily corrupted third world countries.

This isn’t even really about gays anyway.  It’s about asserting police powers over a nation’s people.  Just another excuse for fascism.  Legislation like this lets you end a rival’s life with a few well placed insinuations about his or her sexuality.  It turns the police force into an inquisition force, and generally gives license to kick down a person’s door and steal shit on suspicions of violating a religious taboo.

I mean, how the hell do you defend yourself from allegations of homosexuality?  It’s just a license to lynch mob.

Comment #8: Zifnab  on  01/04  at  01:34 PM

how the hell do you defend yourself from allegations of homosexuality?

The same way you defend against allegations of not being a virgin: make up some proof that you have the right kind of sex.  Bloody sheets, children, public het fucking, etc.

Comment #9: bomberE  on  01/04  at  01:41 PM

More evidence of how this lot would love a third world America they could spew their bullshit in. 

That said, there is substantial resistance to this nonsense amongst the Ugandan-Americans who I know and their families.  For many who fled the strife of Amin and returned, and saw the genocides in Rwanda, this is a major backward step.

Comment #10: Ms Kate  on  01/04  at  01:56 PM

Uganda took the anti-gay message to its logical extreme and now that they potentially have blood on heir hands, the bigots are appalled. You’ve spent the last 30 years demonizing a class of people, what did you think was going to happen?!

Comment #11: Keith  on  01/04  at  01:59 PM

More evidence of how this lot would love a third world America they could spew their bullshit in. 

It’s no coincidence, I think, that this lot is also in favor of “reduced government,” given that the smallest governments you’ll find are in third world countries led by strongmen.

Comment #12: Incertus, Nacho Daddy  on  01/04  at  02:00 PM

One thing we hear from the Christian Right to distract us from their homophobia is that they hate Muslims and Muslims kill gays, so they hate people who kill Muslims and that makes them better than liberals on gay rights, bla bla bla.  Now we see a direct link between the Christian Right and institutional gay killing, so it puts to death that myth that they just dislike homosexuality, they want gays dead.

Comment #13: Albert Cirrus  on  01/04  at  02:07 PM

In the minds of many of these Christianists (at least their mindless followers) Uganda isn’t even a real place, not in the way that America is a real place.

Mike, in the minds of many of these Christianists the rest of the world isn’t even a real place, not in the way that America is a real place. Since I happen to live in part of that rest of the world, I’d appreciaste it if these rabid dogs were kept muzzled.

At least the worst I have to face is irritation due to my home being continually confused with Narnia and Middle Earth.

Comment #14: Phoenician in a time of Romans  on  01/04  at  02:18 PM

Uganda took the anti-gay message to its logical extreme and now that they potentially have blood on heir hands, the bigots are appalled.

...and yet, strangely aroused.  Turgid even…

Wait for the videos of the executions of gays to show up, and the furvitive fap-fap-fapping from the wingnuts…

Comment #15: Phoenician in a time of Romans  on  01/04  at  02:20 PM

Lure Ted Haggard to Uganda.

Comment #16: mnsr  on  01/04  at  02:27 PM

Signals got crossed somewhere.

Being gay doesn’t make you prone to sodomizing children.

Being Republican does.

Comment #17: Propagandhi  on  01/04  at  02:30 PM

What’s fascinating and sickening about this is that everyone involved is pretending to be a poor sap that’s been duped by the other side.  The American fundies are pretending they didn’t know the logical result of their actions, and Ugandan fundies are pretending that they took seriously the bullshit claims to science that the “ex-gay” motherfuckers trot out.  Everyone is full of shit.  Lesson: being a fundie leads directly to having a very casual relationship to the truth.

Comment #18: Amanda Marcotte  on  01/04  at  02:34 PM

MikeEss @ 7 - You are exactly right.  I’d even take it a step further.  Gay people are also, in some ways, theoretical in that many folks on the Christian right (think that they) don’t know any.  Combine those 2 fuzzy, slightly unreal categories, African + gay = what must be a totally imaginary, ridiculous category.  Like Robocop on a unicorn or something.  Makes it that much easier to push extreme legislation like “kill the gays” in those areas ideologically.  Also, I agree with Amanda/Rachel Maddow that another factor that made it easy for them to commit this atrocity is that they figured that no one would notice.

Comment #19: madavis4  on  01/04  at  02:41 PM

He acknowledged telling audiences how homosexuals could be converted into heterosexuals, but he said he had no idea some Ugandans were contemplating the death penalty for homosexuality.

Can’t shake the Devil’s hand and say you’re only kiddin’ - TMBG

Comment #20: Ms Kate  on  01/04  at  02:43 PM

That smug, smiling jackass…Did anyone else feel he was consciously lying through that interview.

Comment #21: Daniel-138  on  01/04  at  02:46 PM

Taken at their word, the white Christians only provide information but it’s the Africans who are bloodthirsty savages who don’t quite understand.

I notice they aren’t back in Africa trying to fix things to show them what they really meant, unless of course the need to change the misunderstanding is just a domestic issue.

Comment #22: 3letterjon  on  01/04  at  02:49 PM

The same way you defend against allegations of not being a virgin: make up some proof that you have the right kind of sex.  Bloody sheets, children, public het fucking, etc.

Assuming those bits of evidence are accepted into whatever kangaroo court or demagogue media Uganda is running, that might work.  More likely, they’ll just drown you or burn you to check if you’re a witch as straight as you say you are.

When you set up legislation like this, generated by a mandate by crazy, people are going to want to see heads roll.  That means sacrificing a lot of scapegoats.  The state isn’t going to allow for many people to escape conviction, once accused.

Comment #23: Zifnab  on  01/04  at  02:49 PM

“I feel duped,” Mr. Schmierer said

Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do.

Comment #24: rea  on  01/04  at  02:57 PM

Conservatives must be shitting themselves that Maddow got her own show. I can hear them now, crying and wringing their hands in terror: “She’s not supposed to actually call us on our bullshit…. she’s on the TeeVee!”

Comment #25: Mighty Ponygirl  on  01/04  at  03:01 PM

Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do.

Yeah, and would probably never acknowledge that in that story, the person doing the forgiving is the one dying at the hands of the persecutors. In that scenario, Schmierer is far more like Saul, standing in the background watching the stoning. And I doubt he’ll ever have a road to Damascus moment.

Comment #26: Incertus, Nacho Daddy  on  01/04  at  03:50 PM

I like Shakesville’s take on this, which included a bit more information about the existing cultural climate in Uganda.

>Human rights advocates in Uganda say the visit by the three Americans helped set in motion what could be a very dangerous cycle. Gay Ugandans already describe a world of beatings, blackmail, death threats like “Die Sodomite!” scrawled on their homes, constant harassment and even so-called correctional rape.

“Now we really have to go undercover,” said Stosh Mugisha, a gay rights activist who said she was pinned down in a guava orchard and raped by a farmhand who wanted to cure her of her attraction to girls. She said that she was impregnated and infected with H.I.V., but that her grandmother’s reaction was simply, “‘You are too stubborn.’”

Despite such attacks, many gay men and lesbians here said things had been getting better for them before the bill, at least enough to hold news conferences and publicly advocate for their rights. Now they worry that the bill could encourage lynchings. Already, mobs beat people to death for infractions as minor as stealing shoes.

“What these people have done is set the fire they can’t quench,” said the Rev. Kapya Kaoma, a Zambian who went undercover for six months to chronicle the relationship between the African anti-homosexual movement and American evangelicals.

Mr. Kaoma was at the conference and said that the three Americans “underestimated the homophobia in Uganda” and “what it means to Africans when you speak about a certain group trying to destroy their children and their families.”

“When you speak like that,” he said, “Africans will fight to the death.”<

Liss points out that AT BEST these people are totally ignorant of Uganda’s culture and just came in to make money and tell their congregations at home about their glorious international outreach.

Liss continues “At best, they colluded with murderous bigots because they were too uninformed, cavalier, daft, hasty, greedy, eager, selfish, irresponsible, ignorant. Too something to understand what the fuck they were doing.

At worst, they colluded with murderous bigots because deep in their hard, dark little hearts, in places they never reveal in press releases, they don’t much care if gay people die, as long as their names aren’t anywhere near the death warrant.”

Czech it out, friends. http://shakespearessister.blogspot.com/2010/01/american-anti-gay-bigots-meddling-in.html

Comment #27: JilliefromChile  on  01/04  at  03:51 PM

It’s no coincidence, I think, that this lot is also in favor of “reduced government,” given that the smallest governments you’ll find are in third world countries led by strongmen.

Those governments are plenty large.  They’re full of the strongman’s family members, clan members, and cronies, sitting on their asses and receiving a paycheck.  The difference is that those governments do exactly nothing in the way of providing basic services or infrastructure.  Notice how there isn’t much squawking among the religious right about the Republicans pulling the same shit:  “Brownie, you’re doing a heck of a job.”

Comment #28: keshmeshi  on  01/04  at  04:11 PM

At worst, they colluded with murderous bigots because deep in their hard, dark little hearts, in places they never reveal in press releases, they don’t much care if gay people die

That’s awfully kind, don’t you think?

Comment #29: Aaron  on  01/04  at  04:14 PM

Isn’t it wonderful to see a voice from the left (maddow) pressure a story onto the front page of the Ny Times?  It sure beats Cheney planting them there.  That’s the good news in this.  Hats off to Rachel!

Comment #30: JennyLI  on  01/04  at  06:05 PM

I found a passage at the end of the article interesting: A Ugandan observes that the standard American anti-gay rhetoric, that gays are destroying people’s family and chilren, provokes such rage in Uganda and other African societies, because there in those countries, those words mean to local people what they actually mean: Gays are destroying families in children.

And why wouldn’t they? In the USA, people are accustomed to these kinds of hyperbolic, self-righteous rhetorical attacks, because breathless outrage, self-righteousness and hyperbole are basically the signature tactics in American political discourse, on everything from health care to gay rights. Thus Americans should know to filter out the actual meaning of the evangelicals’ words and understand “gays are anti-family and anti-children” as a mere totemic invocation, meaning little more than “gay people BOO” whereas in Uganda, it obviously wouldn’t be understood this way.

So add myopia and complete cultural ignorance to the list of these hateful anti-gay evangelicals’ sins.

Comment #31: Luke  on  01/04  at  06:58 PM

“So add myopia and complete cultural ignorance to the list of these hateful anti-gay evangelicals’ sins.”

Never forget that these are virtues to Real Americans™.  One of the many reasons they love Sarah Palin: she’s ignorant and proud of it…

Comment #32: MikeEss  on  01/04  at  07:26 PM

This isn’t even really about gays anyway.  It’s about asserting police powers over a nation’s people.  Just another excuse for fascism.

Why don’t you just go fuck off? Not everything is about your pet issue, and it fucking well IS about gays, anyway. The fact that such a law can be used to fascist ends doesn’t mean that it was invented. Thousands of people are harassed, abused and murdered every day for being gay and no other reason, but thanks for minimizing that by explaining to us how it’s actually about fascism, not that people actually are happy to murder other people for having the wrong lover.

Comment #33: grolby  on  01/04  at  07:28 PM

Excuse me, doesn’t mean that it was invented for the purpose of serving fascist ends. But as long as I’m correcting myself, let me take the opportunity to repeat my invitation to Zifnab.

Comment #34: grolby  on  01/04  at  07:29 PM

#28:
Yeah, historically, this bunch has been more than happy to back increased government intervention (so long as the benefits could be restricted to the ‘worthy’), and their current anti-authoritarian stance is just an artifact of a two-party system that makes some weird fucking bedfellows.

That’s not to say they aren’t shitbags, just that the specific manifestations of their shitbaggitude are constrained by who they have to play nice with to indulge their fantasies of theocracy.

Comment #35: Soren  on  01/04  at  08:06 PM

  “I feel duped,” Mr. Schmierer said, arguing that he had been invited to speak on “parenting skills” for families with gay children. He acknowledged telling audiences how homosexuals could be converted into heterosexuals, but he said he had no idea some Ugandans were contemplating the death penalty for homosexuality.

  “That’s horrible, absolutely horrible,” he said. “Some of the nicest people I have ever met are gay people.”

I wonder what would happen if somebody played videos of these backpedalings for the Ugandan parliament.  If it would at all undermine some of their these-guys-provided moral justifications for the bill, or lessen their influence by making them seem two-faced.

And I wonder how the men who made these disclaiming non-apologies would react if that were to happen—-some entertaining amount of fury that their words were used for that purpose of actually fulfilling the disclaimer they made, and frustration at not being able to express that anger without revealing how full of shit they are.

Comment #36: Kyra  on  01/04  at  08:52 PM

Grolby, you ought to know by now that according to Ziffy, nothing is really about sexism or homophobia. Because they don’t affect his smug, glib dudebro self, so obviously they can’t have much of a real effect in Reality™.

Comment #37: Nobody in Particular  on  01/04  at  11:55 PM

These guys falsely shouted fire in a crowded theater, and they’re trying to defend themselves from beling blamed for the panic by saying they thought the Ugandans would file out in an orderly fashion.

I would also add, “Do they think that not bearing false witness against their neighbors is not a Christian value?”

Comment #38: Judge Moonbox  on  01/04  at  11:56 PM

Gypsies are supposed to steal children as well. It’s a bigotry meta-theme. Of course the *real* child thieves and murderers are all establishment: Catholic priests, African witch doctors etc.

Comment #39: MarinaS  on  01/06  at  12:28 PM
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