They just want to bitch about something, anything, don’t they?

BTW, does he realize that several denominations of Protestants don’t have a thing for nativity scenes?

Did anyone apply to put up a Nativity scene?  If Bill Donahue’s so upset about it, can’t he apply for one and pay for it?

Does this guy do anything other than whine about how “oppressed” his majority is?

Maureen, that’s the critical question.

I suppose the best answer to why there’s no Nativity scene would be that Mary and Joseph didn’t show up at the inn until the night before Christmas, not on friggin’ Halloween!

“shows tremendous sympathy for Jews and Muslims at the expense of the majority Christians.”

he keeps using that phrase. I do not think it means what he thinks it means.

There is nothing that is being not-done to show that inclusiveness. It is not the case that they are not putting up a nativity because there’s a menorah.

and just because he doesn’t believe a christmas tree is a religious symbol doesn’t make it not, as terminology and definitions are not set based on his personal word usage. It is a christmas tree, which means it is explicitly, by name, a religious symbol.

Caren: He’s whine that people weren’t following him - I mean, his personal choice of religion.  What else?

The thing is not a “Christmas tree”, nor a “Holiday tree”, nor a “Hanukkah bush”.  It is a Yule tree, once a symbol of a religion that is no longer widely practiced, now thoroughly secular.

Have you ever seen any of these ever-so-Christian families do anything to make their “Christas tree” distinctive?  Like, hang one little flippin’ cross on it amongst all the pretty ornaments and lights?

Actually, I’d like to see a Yule tree with a cross on it.  And a Mogen David.  And a crescent.  And a teeny chart marking the winter solstice.

“Have you ever seen any of these ever-so-Christian families do anything to make their “Christas tree” distinctive?”

To be fair, yes. It is long tradition in many families to top a tree with either an angel or a star (the latter an obvious allusion to the Star of Bethlehem). Ornaments are often representative of aspects of the Nativity story in the gospels. Lots of herald angels singing, some manger scenes, and so forth.

Yule decorations have been pretty well thoroughly co-opted by Christians; in central Europe for some centuries. (Though in Scandinavia “Jul” is only barely Christianized, and for all real purposes retains its pagan spirit.)

(I don’t keep a tree or really observe Christmas at home. My wife is Jewish and I am in personal revolt against the totalitarian character of the whole season; i.e., the bullshit that it’s an “American” holiday and not a religious one, and that you must love—or else you’re just a horrible person—a season that revolves around some heinous worship of Victorian domesticity.)

Foxwell: There’s a perfectly wonderful peri-Solstice observance that celebrates friendship, community, this blasted temporal life, and is open to everyone: New Year’s Eve. (Yes, technically, it’s the Christian calendar turning over, but still.) What you propose sounds like a kinder, gentler version of the nauseating but-it’s-really-for-everyone argument that defensive non-Jews like to make every December.

And at this point, in the US, it’s the shopping season we’re talking about.
Incertus, Nacho Daddy on 12/14 at 06:03 PM

Someone else on here (I forget who) hit the nail on the head when he suggested that the “War on Christmas” is just a giant distraction for the fundies so they won’t realize just how secularized their religious holiday has become.

Yet another example of how Christians are “oppressed” as soon as they don’t get to force their views on everyone else. Wa wa wa wa.

Oh my God, I love it. I fucking love it. If they don’t put up a Christmas tree in the town square, they’re anti-Christian. If they do put a Christmas tree in the town square, they’re anti-Christian.

I think Ben D. phrases it perfectly in the first comment: “They just want to bitch about something, anything, don’t they?”

Being from Oregon, where even the fundy-infested cow towns seem to manage to avoid the whole city owned nativity scene thing, I was always shocked at the displays I saw in MA and couldn’t believe they were legal. I’m always amazed at the lengths east coast catholic types will go to to enshrine their sacred manger scenes on the public dime.

If it means so goddamn much, do it at your CHURCH or at the KofC and have them pay for it.

I was always shocked at the displays I saw in MA and couldn’t believe they were legal. I’m always amazed at the lengths east coast catholic types will go to to enshrine their sacred manger scenes on the public dime.

Heh, and being from the rural (Baptist) south originally I can just imagine how the fundies from my hometown would be aghast at such “Papal idolatry"like a lavish nativity scene!

Tolerance: it’s a zero-sum game.

I’m just glad the reporter bothered to get an opposing quote from a normal Catholic so readers don’t think Bill Donahue’s hatemongering represents typical Catholic thought.  The religion I was raised in has a lot of problems, but I hate seeing it associated with this showboating asshole.

Good for Bill Donahue….don’t let these dirty SOBs get away with their Christian bashing. Tell them to find their own holiday instead of trying to undermine ours.

Yeah, and those of us who celebrate Mithra’s birthday or Osiris’ birthday ( December 25th ) would like all of you to just leave our holiday alone.

Robert: Very funny.  Really.  But I know you’re not for real.  You must try harder before you can fool me.

Donohue’s priest needs to sit down with him and remind him that it’s not Christmas.  Christmas doesn’t begin until Dec. 25th, and it continues on until Jan. 6th with the Epiphany.

Before Dec. 25th, it’s Advent, not Christmas.  I’m becoming embarrassed at how few public “Christians” seem to understand their own religion.  I’m guessing Donohue doesn’t even remember in what order the candles on the Advent wreath are supposed to be lighted.

Speaking of creches, I’m getting all excited about the neighborhood Episcopal church’s Living Creche next week—or, as I like to call it, the Holy Petting Zoo.  I like to see what new animals they have—last year they had a very sweet burro who loved having his ears scratched—and G. likes to watch the crowd and figure out which 12-year-old boys have a crush on the 12-year-old girl playing Mary that year.  Fun for all, plus there’s now a Cuban restaurant down the street, so we can pet the animals and then go have a mojito, fulfilling the long-time Roman Catholic tradition of church followed by booze.

(Hey, I’m Italian and he’s Irish—I think we’re required by law to be Catholics, at least in Illinois.)

Actually, I’d like to see a Yule tree with a cross on it.

That would make sense, DEMONcrap idjut, as J*sus was nailed to a Chr*stmas tree!!!!!

Ah the War on Christmas. It’s a great late-twentieth century holiday tradition. Like Charlie Brown and LSD-induced stop-motion animation. Except with warmth and entertainment value.

Of course I meant without the warmth and entertainment value.
(must remember to read post before hitting send, not during…)

Mnemosyne, you make a good point. For the past few weeks, our priest has been emphasizing the fact that Advent is a time of solemn preparation and that the exuberant extravagance starts Christmas Day. For Armonk to put up a big Christmas display would actually be a sacrilege and an assault on Donohue’s deeply-held beliefs.

Which would give him something else to bitch about. And I think I’ve answered my own question.

It’s a great late-twentieth century holiday tradition. Like Charlie Brown and LSD-induced stop-motion animation.

Do not fuck with my “Rudolph the Red-nosed Reindeer.”

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