Login

Register

Member List

RSS Feed

Amanda | Contact

Auguste | Contact

Jesse | Contact

Pam | Contact

Next entry: Bamboo Review: The Social Network Previous entry: CSA Week #16: Whither Organic?

Breaking up with “The Office”

As you can probably tell from my post where I broke up with “Glee”, Marc and I DVR a lot of our shows and watch them some time after air date.  I don’t mention this because I think that’s uncommon or anything, but to note that we have a lot of shows we like and a DVR box with a very small hard drive.  This makes us even more critical than normal of stuff sucking, since we don’t want to waste precious DVR space on shows that aren’t worth our time. Which is why last night we decided to stop taping “The Office”. 

In all honesty, it’s been a long time coming.  Every week we watch the show, and every week we ask ourselves, why are we watching this show?  It’s basically out of nostalgia, because “The Office” used to be the funniest thing on TV, back when it was a dark satire of life inside the modern American economy.  Over time, however, it switched genres and is now a rather pointless romantic comedy that valorizes the characters that it used to viciously mock.  The show used to offer up a searing critique of the way that modern corporations are ruining the American dream for ordinary working people, but now that those particular chickens are really coming home to roost in the real world, the economic fortunes on the show have turned inexplicably sunny, with the threat that they are all going to show up and find their jobs have disappeared evaporating. In fact, the company seems to have an unlimited budget for just hiring new people.  They didn’t even put up more of a fight when Pam basically created a whole new job (and salary) for herself.  The actors increasingly seem to be phoning it in, and worst of all, it’s sentimental for no good reason.  Plus, for some reason, they seem to think that the audience should think Pam and Jim are awesome, when, if you look at it objectively, Pam and Jim are assholes.  The pranks they’d play on Dwight used to have meaning and purpose, for instance—-Dwight was a suck-up and pointlessly competitive at a job that Jim thought he was too good to do, so he took his frustrations out on Dwight, who had it coming.  Now Dwight seems to just be the weird guy, and Pam and Jim are the cool kids picking on the weird guy because he’s weird.  And we in the audience are supposed to think well of them because of all this, even though they’re actually pretty pathetic.  And the capper of it all is they steal jokes from viral videos on YouTube done by non-professional people that I’ll bet they never give a dime to. 

As Marc noted, it’s the same trajectory as “The Simpsons”—-it started off as a vicious satire, but the writers grew fond of the characters and started to change up their motivations and their fates so that we like them more. The most recent episode was a really good example of how the show has lost its way. 

To start off with, Michael Scott.  As usual, Michael got into trouble and embarrassed himself.  But they pulled their punches by having most of the horrible stuff that happened to him be accidental.  Letting go of the balloons and dropping the bottle so it rattled around?  That honestly could have happened to anyone.  Even the booing bit was a pulled punch.  Back in the day, they would have had Michael be horrible to Andy because Andy has a part at all, and he was jealous.  But they want you to like Michael some, so instead they show him being nice to Andy by going to the show, praising his performance, and comforting him when he was down. They don’t even have the heart to put Michael through the romantic horrors he’s lived through in the past.  The last bad girlfriend plot was limp and dispensed with quickly. 

Pam and Jim, as noted before, are now assholes.  But we’re supposed to like them and think they’re awesome because they’re “normal” compared to the weirdos they work with.  In the past, the smallness of their lives and their inabilities to achieve their ambitions gave them depth, but now they’re just smug married people who sneer at people they think are below them, instead of yearning to be more than they are.  In this episode, they sit in their car drinking Irish Cream and orange juice and we’re supposed to be charmed by how cute and in love they are, instead of appalled at what wankers they’re being.  I don’t care about them, their marriage, or their baby.  They should have written them off the show. 

Meanwhile, this last episode made it clear that they’re actually recycling the Pam/Jim arc with Andy and Erin—-the salesman loves the receptionist, but he’s too cowardly to tell her, and she’s dating someone else in the company.  We didn’t even get to see Gabe steal Erin from Andy, presumably because they don’t have the courage to make Gabe a real asshole or Erin stupid enough to be dating someone that’s bad for her.  So you’re left with this storyline where you’re expected to feel bad for Andy, but instead you’re thinking, “I don’t know.  She seems happy.  He should just move on.”  I fail to see why we should root for them outside of the fact that they’re both characters that we’ve come to know on this show. 

Back in the day, the show did a bang-up job of portraying the awkwardness of working with people that you don’t particularly like that much.  The socializing events outside of the office were awkward and forced, and many of the characters couldn’t wait to get home and live their real lives.  Now, it seems like the people in the office don’t have lives outside of it at all.  They only socialize with each other.  The episode where Jim and Pam got married really epitomized this.  Their office mates reconstruct the viral video wedding aisle dance.  Except in real life, the people that did this were the couple’s actual friends, not their coworkers they have little in common with and feel so superior to.  That’s because this is something that your actual friends do for you, not your coworkers.  Plus, what was the point of doing that?  It was amazing to watch it on YouTube, because it was original and it was awesome to see a bunch of non-professionals pull it off in one shot.  A bunch of professional actors doing it in a situation where they have multiple takes to get it right?  It was like an inverse of everything that made the video they ripped off cool. 

So, we’re also done with “The Office”.  There’s way too much good stuff on TV to waste your time on a show that’s jumped the shark. 

 

------

Registration is now required! We're still in the process of getting it all squared away, so for the moment don't forget to Login or Register using the links in the upper left menu before starting to write your comment.

Posted by Amanda Marcotte on 02:16 PM • (71) Comments

The problem with making the transition from the British version to the American version is that the American program requires too many episodes.  The British version went on a good story arc where the asshole boss actually got fired, while the American version had to find some reason for the boss to stay around.  That made it impossible for him to really be as much of a jerk as Gervais got him to be, while the American version had to make the boss into a character who was actually good at his job to some degree while being just cluelessly inept in harmless ways that others could cover or shrug their shoulders around.

The British series was mean, while the American version suffers from an unwillingness to make the lead character as awful as he is capable of being and the thrusting of the minor characters into Important Roles.  Pam and Jim are the ones the audience is supposed to relate to as they go about their shitty work environment, not the people to fulfill the American Dream.  If I want to live vicariously, it sure as hell isn’t going to be in an office.

Comment #1: 3letterjon  on  10/10  at  03:28 PM

All serial fiction has this problem—while the show’s purpose for existing is at first its premise and its themes, what happens it that the people watching it become attached to the characters.  While that creates enduring viewership, it also means that the show’s purpose drifts from whatever it was originally about to “being nice to its characters and having them do the things which the show’s characters do.”

Most TV shows have a kind of natural run; they tell the story they wanted to tell and examine the themes they wanted to examine, and they’re done.  B5 had four good years and a couple good episodes.  Star Trek: TNG had a couple good years in the middle when it looked seriously at the End of Scarcity.  Buffy was awesome for five years, then struggled terribly (though still put out some good stuff).  Heck, even Star Trek TOS really was only great for two years. 

I generally don’t worry about it.  It’s like reading Huck Finn; accept that American culture requires writers to put sucky codas on the end and don’t worry about it.

Comment #2: Punditus Maximus  on  10/10  at  03:40 PM

I’ll follow you on Glee, but I’m not ready to quit the Office yet.  Pandering to religion is far worse, in my mind, than cheesing up originally interesting characters. 

The worst example, for me, of a good show going bad was McLeod’s Daughters—completely unwatchable after Season 3.

Comment #3: Raenelle  on  10/10  at  04:07 PM

They actually used to have a clever little out for why Michael didn’t get fired, 3letter.  On the British version, David was both an asshole and incompetent.  On the American version, they at least used to occasionally remind the viewers that Michael couldn’t be fired—-he was running the only branch of the company that was actually profitable.  He was, you know, good at his job.  Or at least perceived to be.  Now they don’t even bother with that.

Comment #4: Amanda Marcotte  on  10/10  at  04:19 PM

Amanda wrote:

There’s way too much good stuff on TV to waste your time on a show that’s jumped the shark.

Boy, do we disagree there!  I’m amazed how we can have 200 channels and there’s still nothing decent to watch.

It might be interesting for you to run a “what TV shows do you watch” thread.

Comment #5: Dana  on  10/10  at  04:39 PM

Dana, your problem is what those in the tech business would call a user error, not a systems failure.  There’s lots of good stuff on TV…..for people smart enough to find and appreciate it.

Comment #6: Amanda Marcotte  on  10/10  at  04:44 PM

Amanda wrote:

Dana, your problem is what those in the tech business would call a user error, not a systems failure.  There’s lots of good stuff on TV…..for people smart enough to find and appreciate it.

Oh, so now personal tastes depend upon your perception of how “smart” people are?  I guess I really should have known that.

Comment #7: Dana  on  10/10  at  05:37 PM

I can’t find a link, but I read a really good article about half a year ago where the author interpreted the current iteration of The Office as really dark and despairing because Jim and Pam are assholes who’s dreams have been unfulfilled.  I don’t watch it very often, so I guess the execution has been lacking.

The episode where Michael renegs on his promise to pay for college to the inner-city high school graduates seemed pretty dark, and that wasn’t too long ago, right?

Comment #8: NY Expat  on  10/10  at  05:40 PM

Amanda,
What do you enjoy? I think sometimes it is possible to overanalyze comedies!

Comment #9: Neil C.  on  10/10  at  05:40 PM

I’m definitely in Dana’s situation here. There’s very few shows that I find good enough to be worth watching. The Daily Show and Colbert Report, obviously. Always Sunny in Philadelphia. Doctor Who. Um…  Mythbusters. Actually, that’s about it.  Other than that I usually wind up watching reruns of Seinfeld or something.  Part of the problem is that its really, really, REALLY rare for me to like dramas. I mean, I can get, objectively, while they’re ‘good’, but I have no interest in watching them.

I’d chime in with the ‘Ask Amanda What She Watches’, but I think its pretty clear the answer is going to be Mad Men. I watched like 3 episodes of that based on all the talk about the show here, and I have absolutely no interest in ever seeing another minute of it.  Apparently I’m just too stupid to appreciate it, though…

Comment #10: Drocket  on  10/10  at  05:55 PM

Jesus, is there anything worse than men who can’t take a joke?  Dana and Drocket, if you’re too sensitive to laugh at yourself, maybe you shouldn’t comment on a blog post about something as stupid and irrelevant as tv.  (Not to knock on tv, but come on.)

I checked out of The Office once Jim/Pam kissed.  The best thing about the show was the sexual tension that made working there bearable for them, but with them hooking up, that’s gone.  I made it a rule years ago to quit watching shows that put the lead hetero characters in a relationship and I don’t think that rule has ever let me down.

Comment #11: stubbles  on  10/10  at  06:10 PM

In the past, the smallness of their lives and their inabilities to achieve their ambitions gave them depth, but now they’re just smug married people who sneer at people they think are below them, instead of yearning to be more than they are.

Well, they’re married, so they figure “mission accomplished.” Kind if makes sense as a character arc.

I don’t watch a lot of TV, but complaining how “there’s nothing good on” doesn’t make a lot of sense: it’s more dignified simply to admit that you don’t have the time or inclination to find a bunch of TV shows that you like. But that would mean admitting you’re getting old, and no one wants to do that.

I’m clueful enough to admit that the local music scene hasn’t gotten lamer: I am sure it is pretty good: I just don’t send my time looking around for good new local bands, anymore, and I’d sound like an idiot if I said otherwise to someone praising some local music acts and instead claimed that everything sucks these days.

Comment #12: Tyro  on  10/10  at  06:20 PM

Trying to convince me that you’re smart by suggesting taste and intelligence have no relationship, Dana, is not going to work.  In fact, intelligence—-both analytical and emotional—-are big factors in being able to really grasp the nuances of fictional works, even if they’re just well-made sitcoms.  You lack both, and thus I’m not surprised that even a silly show like “30 Rock” flies right over your very thick head.

Comment #13: Amanda Marcotte  on  10/10  at  06:23 PM

Great post.  I can’t believe how poor The Office has gotten.

Not sure why people are having trouble finding stuff to watch on TV.  There are a lot of decent shows on right now.  Mad Men and Rubicon on AMC.  Boardwalk Empire, Bored to Death and Eastbound and Down on HBO.  Dexter on Showtime (though admittedly the first two eps of this season were pretty weak).  Caprica on SyFy.  Sons of Anarchy, Terriers, Sunny in Philly and The League on FX.  30 Rock is having a great season. 

Frontline and NOVA are nearly back with new episodes.  PBS will also be showing Steven Moffat’s Sherlock starting on the 24th.  Walking Dead premieres on AMC on Halloween. Burn Notice comes back in November.

If anything there’s almost too much to watch this fall.  My Tivo has been working overtime.

Comment #14: dead souls  on  10/10  at  06:23 PM

Yes to all of the above. 
Pam trying out New York and then being happy to come back to Scranton was fairly believeable but disappointing.  If anything,  it would have been a good way to write them both out of the show.
But I guess they had to have the wedding.  If anything the only way to save those characters is to have Pam go slightly crazy and to have Jim cope with that.  (There have been hints down this road) Pam made up her job last week.  The next episode was should have dealt with that job.

I keep telling myself not to watch on hulu,  but im mildly curious as to how theyre going to write michael scott out of the show.  Im also trying to break up with Bones due to the sloppy writing and terrible product placement.

Comment #15: pasteymachine  on  10/10  at  06:25 PM

I love how squirmy people get when someone, especially a Vagina-American, feels like she has a right to be critical.  The automatic response is to demand that I be sunny and upbeat and optimistic, put on that cheerleading outfit and go for it! I’m going to suggest that there’s not really any interest in what I like—-after all, from this post alone, you can tell I used to adore “The Office”.  It’s a cover for shaming me for thinking I have a right to be critical of a TV show.  The insinuation that I’m just a meanie bear who doesn’t like anything is disproved by the content of the post, where I note up front that I enjoy so many TV shows that there’s not enough room on my DVR to store them all.

Comment #16: Amanda Marcotte  on  10/10  at  06:28 PM

Well, they’re married, so they figure “mission accomplished.” Kind if makes sense as a character arc.

That’s how it’s written, but I’m disappointed by that.  Getting married was never the ambition that got them out of bed in the mornings.  Before they got married and had a baby, they were both portrayed as people whose main daily frustration in life was lack of creative fulfillment at work—-but also as people who brought this on themselves by being lazy and timid.  They scapegoated their jobs because of their own unwillingness to get out of Scranton and do more interesting things.  Now they have even more obstacles.  We’re supposed to believe that they succumbed to a fate they openly hated in seasons past—-being stuck in Scranton, having no ambitions, having no prospects—-and that it makes them happy?  I mean, I guess I can believe it.  Maybe there’s peace with giving up dreams you weren’t ever going to pursue. But I don’t like how the show tries to make them heroes instead of losers.

Comment #17: Amanda Marcotte  on  10/10  at  06:34 PM

especially a Vagina-American


Birth Certificate!
SHOW US.

Comment #18: pasteymachine  on  10/10  at  06:35 PM

Couples on the Office:

Jim and Pam
Dwight Angela Andy Triangle
Andy Erin Gabe Triangle
Kelly and Ryan (look we all know the reason these characters have to be included)
and even Stanley has an out of office love triangle. 

At this point Im hoping creed hooks up with Meredith.

ugh.

Comment #19: pasteymachine  on  10/10  at  06:43 PM

We’re supposed to believe that they succumbed to a fate they openly hated in seasons past—-being stuck in Scranton, having no ambitions, having no prospects—-and that it makes them happy?  I mean, I guess I can believe it.  Maybe there’s peace with giving up dreams you weren’t ever going to pursue.

Based on my family, high school friends, parents, siblings, and just about every Tea Partier who defends small town America, I would say it’s completely believable that people decide to love what they’re stuck with.  How else could you get through the day without killing yourself?  Interestingly, the same people I know who are married with kids and have a miserable existence are the same people who think The Office is a great show, probably because, like you said, it shows people like them as heroes and not losers.

Comment #20: stubbles  on  10/10  at  06:45 PM

Internet Critique always has the bonus that somebody somewhere will take offense and feel the need to defend something. I wonder when it became so outrageous to suggest that a long running TV show begins to have problems with its coherency the longer it runs?

Frankly, the biggest problem with The Office is the conceit that makes it all possible: Who the hell funds a documentary crew to follow the inner workings of a small-ass paper company for seven years. Ultimately, the show probably should’ve wrapped up after four and just…ended. No real resolutions, just putting it out of our misery.

Frankly, they could’ve avoided the moment that really should’ve turned everybody off: When they transferred Holly to wherever to it was and neither character seriously considered quitting to be with the other. In the end, all we have is Scott’s statements that she was the love of his life and yet he was too damn selfish to go and be with her. He later steals a file off her computer that supposedly is a love e-mail to him and then the season ends with his miserable pining for her at the picnic.

At least Jim and Pam, however it turned out, developed as characters. Practically nobody else has* and I cringe when ever Michael starts acting like an ass because if he ever grew as a character, the show might suddenly fall apart. And we wouldn’t want that since otherwise there’d be some other show to try and sell ad revenue for.

When this version of the show started, I’d said to some folks that as soon as they put Pam and Jim together, it would essentially ‘break’ the show. After that, they’d have to pull all kinds of ridiculous crap to keep people and characters on the show.

Like any sudden success TV show, it’s far outstayed its welcome because the network has no faith in developing anything new in its place. For all the good that might be out there, there’s an awful lot that just fills up space in an effort to generate income until the next big thing comes along.


*The only people who have had any kind of development are those listed in the main credits. And Andy. But then Ed Helm’s name is separate from the rest of the cast, so he really is the exception that proves the rule. Michal’s development consists only of whatever has created the last six or seven years of memories and backstory. Everything else is a sit-com reset button away from the status quo.

Dwight had some development with the Angela thing, Ryan was promoted to New York, and Andy went to anger management and was a part of the Angela thing. Only Oscar had anything of note happen to him that didn’t really involve the main cast but all it’s done is placed a floating ‘By the way, he’s GAY!’ sign over his head which only change the tone of his one-note character.

Comment #21: Santa Claustrophobia  on  10/10  at  07:00 PM

Santa, it was all answered in this article  from about a year ago.

Like Amanda, I hardly watch anything when it’s actually on.  My sons and I watch Adventure Time (a fun, poorly-drawn version of D&D;-related stuff that couldn’t possibly begin to take itself seriously,) and that’s about it for scheduled programming.  When I have insomnia I try to catch some of the Adult Swim stuff that doesn’t bug me to death: Metalocalypse and Venture Brothers are consistently fun, while Childrens Hospital is a new favorite.  I tend to watch shows when I get the seasons from the library or buy them in sets, since I’m too busy to watch the commercials and haven’t gotten around to seeing the value of the Netflix account (though I’m getting over that, thanks to the IT Crowd episode la sig otra forced me to watch and find wonderful.)

Comment #22: 3letterjon  on  10/10  at  08:21 PM

“In fact, intelligence—-both analytical and emotional—-are big factors in being able to really grasp the nuances of fictional works”

Meh. I know Harvard law grads who like “Two and a Half Men” And third tier toilet grads who like “Arrested Development.” Never impressed by those who define themselves by tastes

Comment #23: John Joel Glanton  on  10/10  at  08:23 PM

ho the hell funds a documentary crew to follow the inner workings of a small-ass paper company for seven years.

Heh, I bet “Jersey Shore” runs that long.

Comment #24: Amanda Marcotte  on  10/10  at  08:47 PM

Santa, they did do one thing with Dwight’s character in terms of development: he grew a spine.  He used to be a spineless suck-up who worshiped Michael, and now he sees Michael as weak and contemptuous.  Now, instead of being a nervous toady, he’s a self-confident and is becoming more of a self-made man.  The problem with that is that it makes him a lousy comic villain.  He was more fun as a toady.

Comment #25: Amanda Marcotte  on  10/10  at  08:53 PM

Amanda wrote:

In fact, intelligence—-both analytical and emotional—-are big factors in being able to really grasp the nuances of fictional works, even if they’re just well-made sitcoms.  You lack both, and thus I’m not surprised that even a silly show like “30 Rock” flies right over your very thick head.

Well, it might have, if I had ever watched it; since I haven’t, there’s no way to know.

But what you’ve missed is the fact that, whether I have a thick head or not, I do have a thick skin; for some odd reason, your insults haven’t caused me to abandon the site.  And considering that you have said that you always “feel bad” every time you pick on me, perhaps that makes us both masochists!  smile

Comment #26: Dana  on  10/10  at  09:07 PM

I understand where the post is coming from but I can’t give up on the office yet. The bit at the end where they all rallied around Andy when he sings I Try made me remember too many good things about the office and the bit where Dwight boasts to the guy he knows Andy but can’t help adding he’s a terrible salesman because he doesn’t know how to be a human was hilarious

Also Pam and Jim were always kind of jerks. We were just on their side before. And if they are ok with their lives I’m alright with that because most people have to compromise on what they want professionally for what they want personally. That’s just true to life.

Comment #27: pharmakos  on  10/10  at  09:18 PM

I was kind of relieved when Carell announced that he’s leaving.  It means they will either be forced to seriously revamp a show that has gotten pretty tired, or they will be forced to end its run.  The show simply isn’t as good as it was during its second and third seasons.  Season four was shortened by the writer’s strike, and of that season the “Dinner Party” episode was the highlight.  The series was already sagging by that point, IMO.

The British version had an ending, and a followup showing where the characters ended up in the year after their “documentary” had aired on television.  Remember that?  The American version doesn’t even acknowledge that these folks are being followed by a documentary film crew anymore.  The talking head segments are the only nods to it.  This film crew has been documenting the goings on in a dying paper company for the past six years now, with no end in sight!

Comment #28: Blitzgal  on  10/10  at  09:23 PM

man, I barely watch TV at all.

My ribs be touchin’ yo…

send up better sci-fi plz.  Or mebbe some really interesting drama.  Not interested in Mad Men.

Comment #29: shah8  on  10/10  at  09:28 PM

Speaking of disappointing television, Always Sunny isn’t as great as it once was. I fear those guys may be putting their paychecks up their nose, if you catch my drift.

Comment #30: John Joel Glanton  on  10/10  at  09:49 PM

What do you enjoy? I think sometimes it is possible to overanalyze comedies!

Turn off some popcorn and eat your brain

Comment #31: Dan  on  10/10  at  09:50 PM

Meh. I know Harvard law grads who like “Two and a Half Men” And third tier toilet grads who like “Arrested Development.” Never impressed by those who define themselves by tastes

Instead we should define people by which law school they graduated from, and how much money they make.

Comment #32: Dan  on  10/10  at  09:52 PM

Santa, they did do one thing with Dwight’s character in terms of development: he grew a spine.  He used to be a spineless suck-up who worshiped Michael, and now he sees Michael as weak and contemptuous.  Now, instead of being a nervous toady, he’s a self-confident and is becoming more of a self-made man.  The problem with that is that it makes him a lousy comic villain.  He was more fun as a toady.

That’s true. But whether or not it works for the show to have him to hate, it’s better he develops as a person, if only slightly. Otherwise, he ends up like Major Frank Burns (or Michael Scott). I never hated Dwight as much as I hate Michael.

And that Onion article? I’m pretty sure if the Onion tells you you’re done, you’re done.

Comment #33: Santa Claustrophobia  on  10/10  at  10:10 PM

I broke up with Mafia Wars on Facebook a couple of months ago because of the complete lack of RP and the excessive level grinding.

Nothin to do with nothin. I just figured I’d tell a breakup story. I’ll show myself out now…

Comment #34: BrianX  on  10/10  at  11:19 PM

Be honest. Did you lift most of these points from an ONTD (of all places) thread from a few days ago? Not that I disagree with any of it. But, in light if your criticisms about the show recycling internet memes, I just had to ask.

Comment #35: MsFoo  on  10/11  at  12:36 AM

PBS will also be showing Steven Moffat’s Sherlock starting on the 24th

I grabbed the 3 episodes that have been made so far via BitTorrent and I love it.  Having been introduced to Martin Freeman in the UK Office, I’ve followed his career and he’s brilliant as John Watson.  High quality writing and acting and it’s appropriately moody and dark.  Highly recommended to anyone who is not a Conan Doyle literalist.

TV shows, like rock bands, have a lifespan and one thing I like about British TV is except for their longrunning soaps like Eastenders etc. they generally don’t over stay their welcome.

Two shows I really like these days:

The Event: yeah, it’s another attempt at LOST Part 2, but so far they’ve avoided most of the annoying tics of LOST like taking years to reveal answers, stupid romance subplots etc.

Him & Her: A Britcom starring my favorite lust object, Russell Tovey, that was originally called Young, Unemployed and Lazy, which describes it perfectly.  A 20-something M/F couple sit in their flat doing not a whole lot but it’s well written and Russell Tovey is wonderful as Steve.

I can’t heap enough praise on Being Human from the BBC, it’s easily one of my favorite shows ever.  The fact that Russell Tovey takes his clothes off a lot is an added bonus.

I actually think we’re going through a really good time for TV shows, add in stuff that you can get via BT from England to the stuff on HBO, Showtime and the other cable channels and there’s some really good things to choose from.

Comment #36: Henry Holland  on  10/11  at  01:29 AM

Amanda is too young to remember M*A*S*H. But it set the template for what she is complaining about.

M*A*S*H started out as really powerful war satire. (It was also really sexist, which I will NOT defend. One of the few good things that happened over the course of the show was that “Hot Lips” went from a buffoonish sex object to an actual character with real motivations. Nonetheless, despite the sexism, it was a very powerful show in the early seasons.) Vietnam was still going on when it started (in 1972), and even though the show was ostensibly about Korea, it was a great statement about how pointless war was, especially in a far-off land against an enemy that is no threat to the US and where the people who are fighting the war have no idea what they are fighting for.

In order to make a show that was realistic and powerful, the creators of M*A*S*H created characters that weren’t all that likeable. Hawkeye and Trapper were certainly mischeivous and understood that the war was crap, but they were also mean, misogynistic, uncaring about the consequences of their action, drunk, and disobedient of legitimate rules and authority as well as illegitimate rules and authority. They were clearly not heroes—they were anti-heroes.

Within a few years (specifically, after McClean Stevenson and Wayne Rogers left the show), the Vietnam War was over and, except for the far right, most of America agreed that it had been a bad idea. So the show lost its edge, and the producers made the characters more likeable, into practical jokers instead of misanthropes, and turned them from assholes who were willing to screw over the military and act with great self-entitlement because they hated the war into friendly doctors just placed with a bad situation but pursuing the best out of life.

They probably felt they had to do this because otherwise they didn’t have a show. And they were wildly successful. But nonetheless, it destroyed what made the show important and biting. The whole original point was that war was bad in part because it made assholes out of everyone. There was nobody to root for. But of course, you can’t sustain a hit series for a decade on the premise that there is nobody to root for.

The Simpsons and The Office are just the latest examples of this.

Comment #37: Dilan Esper  on  10/11  at  01:47 AM

Henry @ 36 Oh yes for BBC Sherlock! And I’ll have to check out the rest of Being Human and Him and Her. I tend to enjoy the BBC shows more than the US shows, since they tend to be smart and funny and interesting without too much cliche. The short seasons also leave the viewer panting for more—at least I’m anxiously looking forward to the Doctor Who Christmas special!

What annoys me is when a perfectly good British show needs to be Americanized for the US audience. I understand why they do it, but the British vs. US versions of “Life on Mars” showed the difference quite clearly, and the US version lost. I never saw either version of “The Office” and so can’t comment on that. I just have to believe that smart, well-written shows will find an audience, even though experience has proved that most US audiences want “Jersey Shore”.

Comment #38: Bethynyc  on  10/11  at  02:28 AM

I thought everyone knew that orange juice + irish cream makes you vomit in under 30 minutes?  I kind of liked this joke for this reason.  It made me feel like maybe the writers know Jim and Pam are making us puke.  I hope they get some tension soon.  I would like to see one of them resent the other. 

I kind of liked it when they didn’t get the daycare they wanted because Jim thinks he is universally charming and he totally screwed up the interview.  Also when Pam was too chicken to pursue the career she thought she wanted.  I thought it was great groundwork for later conflict when Jim bought the house without asking Pam first.

Comment #39: raspberryjamba  on  10/11  at  04:01 AM

Most TV shows have a kind of natural run; they tell the story they wanted to tell and examine the themes they wanted to examine, and they’re done.  B5 had four good years and a couple good episodes.  Star Trek: TNG had a couple good years in the middle when it looked seriously at the End of Scarcity.  Buffy was awesome for five years, then struggled terribly (though still put out some good stuff).  Heck, even Star Trek TOS really was only great for two years.

While I tend to agree that most shows overstay their welcome because how many major story arcs can one universe have before they repeat or it simply gets old but the actual examples put the whole argument into a subjective tailspin that there is no recovery from.  Most dramas either are episodic or continual, thus the episodic shows (comedies and comedic sitcoms) tend to have a longevity that exceeds their continual counterparts because they aren’t telling a story.  Episodic shows are giving you characters that are placed in a series of situations that may or may not be interesting. 

Continual shows like “The Office” suffer from that eventual story arc repeat or simple unbelievability, the tapestry of the shows existence simply runs out of room to grow or pulled apart in attempts to keep it fresh.  I have seen both versions of Life on Mars and frankly both made perfect sense in short-run format.  Trying to stretch what works as a single-season or extended-season idea into a several season program is extremely hard and tends to work out poorly.  American programming really has a fallacy in the belief of long-term syndication, that is a show needs a relatively large number of episodes to be considered “successful (usually 100 though sometimes less if longer.)  The idea that a short 16 episode run is somehow a dismal failure when it could be quite the opposite.

Also, nobody would understand Life on Mars if it hadn’t been Americanized, I watched it just to avoid having to suffer through a boring documentary on the time, it was interesting to see another culture revisit the recent past.  There was a similar show where a female detective went back into the 1980s (though she was clearly time-traveling in a strange non-mechanical way) and it wouldn’t work for American audiences because the vast majority of us in the 1980s were living in the US so the cultural cues don’t make sense.


Television just like Music is a subjective animal, trying to judge people by it is incredibly pathetic.  I abhor Mad Men because it is both a throwback to a bygone era talking only of the dominant whites in the highest of places but it also utterly boring to me.  Does it make me a bad person?  Not really, probably less interesting to talk to if you like Mad Men but no worse for wear then anybody else.

Comment #40: Xeranar  on  10/11  at  07:04 AM

I’m not much a TV watcher but a lot of this has to do with how American television shows on network or cable generally try to go for as having as many episodes and seasons as possible. Outside the US, or at least in the UK and Japan, this really isn’t the goal. This means that its capable for television shows to have proper beginnings, middles, and ends without having to compromise to much of the original vision. Japanese television shows will go long if they are popular enough though and are prone to this sort of thing to though. On American TV, HBO series tend towards the short run and are generally less likely to fall prey to said phenomenon.

  I also have to kind of disagree about the Simpsons. The characters were at their most likable in the mid seasons, about seasons three to eight, and become more cartoonish and exaggerated from season nine on.

Comment #41: Lee  on  10/11  at  08:33 AM

Dilan those are great points about MASH.  Often when I can’t sleep, I put on tv land and MASH is on.  I also used to watch it on the on the local FOX station who ran it for years.  I am always disappointed when I see that it’s an episode after Rogers and Stevenson left.  It’s really not the same show at all.

Comment #42: JennyLI  on  10/11  at  08:54 AM

I have heard some good things about a lot of tv shows, but I just don’t watch much of it.  I would rather read in my downtime, which I just don’t have that much of.  Between running a business, spending time with my bf, and family obligations (all good, for instance by baby brother got engaged this weekend! and I am already busy making celebration plans with her family), I just don’t have the time or interest.  My bf is a big reader too.  We both prefer the quiet.  Though we do watch Rachel together, and I guess that has to count as watching tv.

I won’t miss Dexter or Madmen, but that’s really it.  I do want to get 30 Rock on dvd and am planning on doing that this winter when I do tend to spend more of my weekends indoors.

I have lots of friends and family members who dvr a lot of stuff.  I don’t think one lifestyle is better than the other.  It’s just different strokes.

Comment #43: JennyLI  on  10/11  at  09:02 AM

I love how people bemoan American television and bring up Jersey Shore as an example without knowing that the reality television thing started in Europe.  Big Brother and similar shows were done in Europe for the same reasons they have taken off here: they’re cheap to produce, the stars get famous from a tabloid culture, and the ratings are good enough to pay for the cheap production or they are very high and make for very good profits.

Much of it is like an extended game show.  And Idiocracy didn’t invent “Ow My Balls”, that was a Japanese game show: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdFW-hrGX7g

Comment #44: 3letterjon  on  10/11  at  09:44 AM

As mediocre as the show is now in its late period decadence, I do think that Jim and Pam’s development is halfway interesting in that they’ve gone from one sitcom trope to another in a fairly untypical way. Usually, the main love interests are either Typical (or Wacky With Warm Gooey Center) Couples facing mundane problems, or the drama comes from the Will They Or Won’t They Hook Up angle, and nothing ever changes from this steady state.

If the characters begin in Will They Or Won’t They box, usually the writers come up with increasingly more ridiculous ways to break the couple up after they’ve finally started going out, just to string the audience along and avoid any real structural changes. I kind of like it that the Office doesn’t rely on Jim and Pam’s breakup of the week and instead turned them into total boring schlubs.

Although it’s pretty lame that they simply switched Jim and Pam’s old story with Andy and Erin’s.

Comment #45: Dr. Locrian  on  10/11  at  09:51 AM

I stopped watching a few years ago and haven’t really missed it.

Isn’t this the last season of 30 Rock?

Comment #46: Mighty Ponygirl  on  10/11  at  10:38 AM

Be honest. Did you lift most of these points from an ONTD

That’s a heady accusation, damn.

What’s ONTD?  Can you really accuse me of stealing from a site that I have no idea what you’re talking about?

Comment #47: Amanda Marcotte  on  10/11  at  11:10 AM

But what you’ve missed is the fact that, whether I have a thick head or not, I do have a thick skin; for some odd reason, your insults haven’t caused me to abandon the site.

Is that the same odd reason that you almost have nothing to say about a given topic at hand when you do deign to comment here?

Why don’t you start a thread about what little programming you do watch, Dana, on your blog?

Comment #48: Dark Avenger Guardian Chow Mein  on  10/11  at  12:05 PM

I’ll just post a list of what I’m watching for anyone who likes to take recommendations from people on the internet who don’t actually explain why they like a show, then go and get ready for college (my excuse for the lack of blurbs).  Note I’m several seasons behind on some of these shows, but they are currently airing and last time I checked they were good.

30 Rock
Mad Men
Star Driver Kagayaki no Takuto
Symbionic Titan
True Blood
The World God Only Knows

I wouldn’t claim that TV shows have gone down in quality, I think the fact that there’s so many of them makes it harder to keep up.  Plus, seeing as how I’m 21, I’ve got a lot of catching up to do on TV that either aired before I was born or when I was too young to appreciate/access it.  Pretty much, the way it works with me is that a lot of the time: yes I’ve heard of that show, yes I know what it’s about, yes I know what the critical response was and I am either planning to watch it or avoiding it like the plague, but have I actually seen it yet?  Quite likely no.  I actually don’t have TV broadcasts in my room because the license fee is too expensive so I mostly buy stuff on DVD (and watch streaming anime, and I do also buy anime on DVD, as anyone who’s seen my room will tell you), meaning I often see it after it’s initial broadcast.  There is a TV in the living room where I live so I do watch a lot of reruns of Scrubs and Veronica Mars.  It would take hours to write a list of all the shows I want to watch but haven’t yet.

As a final point, speaking as someone from the u.k., it’s not like all our TV is better than the u.s. stuff, if nothing else we have an extremely lacking animation industry and virtually all of our live action children’s programming is an embarrassment (actually the only good thing I can think of is Press Gang), at least you guys have Genndy Tartakovsky, DC animation, Greg Wiseman, Craig McCracken and you were responsible for Eerie Indiana (I have The Adventures of Pete and Pete on order, I’ll get back to you on that).  And there’s Daria (which I must watch at some point, having heard pretty much all good things).  And the awesomeness that is Courage the Cowardly Dog.  There’s some great stuff in the u.k.‘s history, TV animation-wise, but for the last two decades it’s like we’re not even trying with the exception of Aardman.  And Rex the Runt (best thing they ever did IMO), hasn’t even been released on DVD in full in the u.k..  Things are similarly dire on the feature film front.

And I can’t stand Doctor Who, not because it’s sci-fi, but just because I really don’t think it’s that good.

Comment #49: RadFemHedonist  on  10/11  at  12:21 PM

“What’s ONTD?  Can you really accuse me of stealing from a site that I have no idea what you’re talking about?”

Clearly it is impossible for people who have been watching the same show for the same amount of time to reach the same conclusions about the current season’s flaws compared to previous seasons.  Clearly.

Comment #50: preying mantis  on  10/11  at  12:44 PM

Amanda, ONTD is Oh No They Didn’t., a popular group on livejournal. I find that there’s too much on TV, personally. I just finished the 1st season of Mad Men and have never seen Buffy. I guess I mean “there’s too much on DVD”  but they were originally TV shows. I think Im maybe two or three seasons behind on The Office.

Comment #51: shannon  on  10/11  at  01:51 PM

As a dedicated Office lover, I can’t quite give up on the show yet, but Amanda’s points do hit home. The show was brilliant through Season 3 (with some minor mistakes), but since then they seem to have lost the theme. Way too many romances within a tiny office and not nearly enough focus on working in America in the 2000’s. Even last year when they had Dunder Mifflin taken over in the middle of a recession they failed to explore what that would mean for the characters and instead everything was puppies and flowers in a single episode. I guess the problem is that in real life half of the characters would have moved on by now, but writing Jim and Pam off would have killed the show. Every once and awhile you can see the brilliance shine through, but those moments are few and far between these days.

Comment #52: Col Bat Guano  on  10/11  at  02:05 PM

Thank god - I thought it was just me who felt that way about The (US) Office.

Comment #53: Danica Lefse Queen  on  10/11  at  02:27 PM

I don’t disagree but I’m not quite as troubled by it. Like “The Simpsons”, there is still a lot to amuse me even if its fallen off its highs and it does pull an excellent episode out of its pocket every once and a while. As much as they had redeemed Michael, for instance, the cringeworthy “Scott’s Tots” was less than a year ago which certainly showed us Michael at his his most awful.

Also, the UK series broke down and gave some heart to David in the Christmas special. Tempered with plenty of horribleness but I felt like we were expected to be rooting for him, too. I think it sort of becomes too tempting for a lot of shows and is largely a response to the audience responding so well to a character.

I will say I’m not especially convinced that there is a glut of good TV right now, but that might just be because I watch a rather lot of TV so my quantities are high. Though its good to see sitcoms on the upswing, I feel like there are far more dramas I’ve stopped watching in the last few years than started, either by ending the run or getting insufferable or both.

Comment #54: BStu  on  10/11  at  03:56 PM

Santa Claustrophobia: Frankly, the biggest problem with The Office is the conceit that makes it all possible: Who the hell funds a documentary crew to follow the inner workings of a small-ass paper company for seven years. Ultimately, the show probably should’ve wrapped up after four and just…ended. No real resolutions, just putting it out of our misery.

Some crazy fanon on Tropes says that “it is not, in fact, a documentary, but rather a documentary course: the taping of Dunder-Mifflin Scranton branch is an ongoing project of some Film professor at the local art school.” Eh, makes enough sense for me.

Comment #55: grendelkhan  on  10/11  at  04:25 PM

The “200 channels and nothing good on” complaint was a pretty sure sign of either A) a tragically unimaginative mind or B) a self-important drama-queen with more money than brains. Seriously, Dana, if you honestly think you can’t find anything to watch in your 200 channels, why are you paying for cable/satellite in the first place? And if your answer is something even remotely related to “my family would flip their shit if I cut it off”, then you need to shut the fuck up because it’s obviously not all about you.

I canceled my cable a couple months ago, and I can still find something worth watching most evenings, just on the networks. And that’s without even NBC, because the signal isn’t quite strong enough to reach my house intact.

Comment #56: Dan, Grand High Emperor of Bananas Foster  on  10/11  at  04:34 PM

“The “200 channels and nothing good on” complaint was a pretty sure sign of either A) a tragically unimaginative mind or B) a self-important drama-queen with more money than brains.”

I’ve been guilty of that complaint before, but it’s always been a “nothing good on right now” kind of thing.  DVD-Rs are coming down in price, but there tend to be some pretty dramatic peaks and troughs in terms of content worth watching if what you want is a steady source of at least moderate entertainment while you’re trying to get some housework done.  There does come a point where you’re all “Really, Science Channel? You‘re doing a marathon of Your Yard Infuriates the Neighbors reruns?  You’ve failed to come through with explosions, cute animals, or things breaking in slow motion for the last time!” and you just start using your computer or X-Box or whatever as your cable.

Comment #57: preying mantis  on  10/11  at  05:11 PM

Sometimes there’s really nothing good to watch, but that only ever lasts a few hours.  Quality shows are rarely played during hours when almost no one is watching TV, for instance.

Except on weekends, when the only thing available seems to be On Demand shows.

Comment #58: Toitle  on  10/11  at  05:14 PM

Psssth! The only shows I watched were “Rachel Maddow Show,” “Daily Show” and “Colbert Report,” but then I realized all tv sucks and it’s all just broad marketing ploys that waste what few precious minutes you have on the earth!I’m not about to waste 1 hour of my 20’s watching some dumb show. I haven’t watched tv for five months (except for 20-30 minute of DVD’s while exercising). Happy I left it and feel better without it!

Comment #59: BeanS  on  10/11  at  06:07 PM

#56 how is not being able to find something good on tv a LACK of imagination? I’d rather read Beauvoir or go hiking any day than sit and watch some cliche, predictable story line. Video games are also much better!

Comment #60: BeanS  on  10/11  at  06:15 PM

I’ll post a DVR list for anyone interested:
Dexter-last season was my favorite, haven’t started this year yet.
Slings and Arrows-Being rerun on Ovation recently
Ninja Warrior-Japanese obstacle course show. Don’t bother watching the American ones. I miss the women’s version, which hasn’t been shown in awhile.
Community-
The Soup-Might be a breakup coming. It seemed like the show used to kick up more than it kicked down. Now, not so much.
It’s Always Sunny-
Treme- I liked it, despite it not being much like “The Wire.”
Friday Night Lights- Gosh, they’re bad at portraying football, but they’re pretty great at drama.
True Blood-Hooray for over-the-top vampires, rather than broody ones. Russell’s appearance on the news was classic.
Dr. G Medical Examiner- The reanactments and voiceovers are often a little grating, but she is very charming when talking about internal organs. My parents were veterinarians who’d discuss interesting surgery at the dinner table and have their kids hang around the clinic, so I’m not squeamish about such things. The gore is almost all off screen.
Metalocalypse- Spent me early teen years owning many Metallica and Slayer albums.
Weeds-I’m a little done with this one, but my wife wants to stick with it, despite really hating Nancy.
Survivor-Didn’t watch this for most of its run, so I’m not as tired of the format as I might be otherwise.
Mythbusters-
Dirty Jobs-
Good Eats-

DVRing, but not watching yet:
Boardwalk Empire, Terriers.

Tried, didn’t even get through an episode:
No Ordinary Family (Come back, late period Heroes. All is forgiven)

Comment #61: witless chum  on  10/11  at  06:48 PM

I have to say, there’s no character on The Office that I really care about anymore. They’re all just becoming unlikeable assholes. Michael was always interesting because he had some fundamentally sympathetic qualities, but had no idea what was actually socially acceptable. Now he’s just knowingly being a dick a lot of the time, like with his treatment of Toby. Jim and Pam were sympathetic “straight men” (in the double act sense); you’d laugh along with their reactions to the ridiculous things that would happen. They were also underdogs, which got me to root for them and care about their stories. But I agree, their characters are now annoyingly smug. They don’t have any real problems. I don’t like them or root for them anymore.

That’s really my current problem with Glee, too. I can handle sentimentality; it’s a musical, and musicals tend to have some maudlin and overdramatic bits. But everyone is acting like such a royal jerk all the time now that it is hard for me to care what happens to any of them. Kurt is the only character I really still like. I’m not quite ready to break up with it, because I’m a sucker for musicals, but I’m not sanguine either.

I don’t have cable TV—just not willing to pay for it, and definitely not the amount it would cost to get HBO/Showtime. The other shows I generally watch are “House” and “30 Rock,” both of which are off their peak but are still worth watching. I’d hoped that “Running Wilde” would partake of a little of the Arrested Development excellence, but after two episodes I gave up because it was hopelessly meh. I hardly cracked a giggle.

So it’s Netflix, generally. But I’m running out of Instant Watch stuff. We just borrowed the Mad Men DVDs from my in-laws, so we’re about to start that.

Comment #62: snowmentality  on  10/11  at  07:05 PM

I’ve never watched the office, but even I could smell skis in the shark tank when NBC ran those “Pam & Jim” ads that used that used Uncle Kracker’s “Smile” unironically.

Comment #63: Cris  on  10/11  at  07:31 PM

BeanS:

how is not being able to find something good on tv a LACK of imagination? I’d rather read Beauvoir or go hiking any day than sit and watch some cliche, predictable story line. Video games are also much better!

There’s lots of good stuff on TV, and some great stuff, but if you never bother to think beyond rote network sitcoms, you won’t find it no matter how many channels you have.

Comment #64: Dan, Grand High Emperor of Bananas Foster  on  10/11  at  09:34 PM

With a caveat that I haven’t seen that many episodes of the US version of The Office, I think the defining difference between UK TV and US TV is that the Brits seems to know when to stop a series. They seem to be able to let a series go while at its peak. They don’t tend to decline into drivel the way that so many of my favourite US tv series have. There are of course exceptions and I’m sure people here can think of quite a few, but as an outside observer of the products of both TV industries it does seem that way to me. This is by no means supposed to be a slur on US TV which produces some excellent and high quality shows (many of which Amanda reviews), just an observation.

Comment #65: JC  on  10/11  at  10:29 PM

Oh also, when I am visiting the US I find it very hard to find anything decent to watch on TV mainly because I have a hard time working out what channel is which and aligning that to any sort of guide I’m able to get my hands on. I don’t doubt that it’s out there but it’s not easy for a visitor to find. That being said, you’d think locals would have a better handle on seeking out the good stuff.

Comment #66: JC  on  10/11  at  10:32 PM

And finally, having just read all the comments, Xeranar come off it please. There is absolutely no reason to remake series like Life on Mars and its 1980s sequel Ashes to Ashes (both supremely excellent - get out and see them if you haven’t already). You might* have that excuse if you didn’t actually live through the 1970s and 1980s but there are global tropes being referenced in both series as well as specifically UK ones. I live and grew up in Australia and I had no trouble understanding either series. Your argument only makes sense if you are also trying to tell me that Americans can never visit a foreign country because they simple won’t ‘get’ all the local references. Honestly, that kind of loony parochialism is what makes us foreigners want to slap you sometimes.

* It’d be a pretty feeble excuse in my opinion but you might say that you can’t connect with the series because you didn’t live through those decades.

Comment #67: JC  on  10/11  at  10:52 PM

Some crazy fanon on Tropes says that “it is not, in fact, a documentary, but rather a documentary course: the taping of Dunder-Mifflin Scranton branch is an ongoing project of some Film professor at the local art school.” Eh, makes enough sense for me.

Sounds more like grasping at straws to excuse the myriad flaws. I don’t know about you, but even if I worked there, there’s no way in hell I let them put a camera in my car. If these are amateurs, I’d expect more shots where we see the film crews getting in each other’s shots. At least reflections in windows, which are surprisingly absent.

And, having just finished up season six, there was the bit where Michael was going to meet somebody at a motel and there’s a camera across the street. Why? Too many times the show falls into standard patterns which include showing people the consequences of things. The Office is staged like typical one-camera TV show with convenient cameras placed wherever they need to be. That might work for Big Brother or something where production controls the environment, but out in the wild, it’s simply too unbelievable.

Also, after six years of having camera crews in their faces, people are still mugging for the camera. They should’ve gotten used to them by now. New people who show up don’t react at all and you never see any evidence that public locations object to their presence.

If they don’t end this by having Christof appear and reveal that it was all just a giant dome in the Hollywood Hills, then they’re just not doing their jobs.

Comment #68: Santa Claustrophobia  on  10/11  at  11:21 PM

If they don’t end this by having Christof appear and reveal that it was all just a giant dome in the Hollywood Hills, then they’re just not doing their jobs.

Heh. Well played.

Comment #69: Dan, Grand High Emperor of Bananas Foster  on  10/12  at  03:27 AM

If you think too hard about how a real documentary would look, then the whole thing falls apart. I think “documentary-like” is the best description for it. In some ways their adherence to the format is one of the problems. Since it has to be semi plausible that a camera crew would be there to film it we get way too much personal stuff like romances confined to the workplace.

Comment #70: Col Bat Guano  on  10/12  at  01:55 PM

Damn!  This is the first blog I’ve read where the poster is the most ill-tempered troll in her own comments section!

Comment #71: dzman_49  on  10/12  at  05:07 PM
Page 1 of 1 pages
Commenting is not available in this channel entry.