Login

Register

Member List

RSS Feed

Amanda | Contact

Auguste | Contact

Jesse | Contact

Pam | Contact

Next entry: Friday Genius Ten “Hey, Let’s Give Up Pretending That Anyone Believes This” Edition Previous entry: Marriage strikers, smug marrieds, and a movie review

Former Southern Baptist Convention officer prays for Obama to die

As we ponder the fringe right’s murderous actions in the news, let’s turn to these soothing words from a man of God. Alan Colmes (Faux News Radio) recently interviewed Wiley Drake, pastor of First Southern Baptist Church in Buena Park, CA. Drake was also the running mate of failed presidential candidate Alan Keyes. Anyway, Colmes, who was discussing the pastor’s remarks calling the assassination of Dr. George Tiller “an answer to prayer” probably couldn’t believe his ears when this tumbled out of the pastor’s piehole.

Imprecatory prayer is agreeing with God, and if people don’t like that, they need to talk to God,” Drake told syndicated talk-show host Alan Colmes. “God said it, I didn’t. I was just agreeing with God.”

Asked if there are others for whom Drake is praying “imprecatory prayer,” Drake hesitated before answering that there are several. “The usurper that is in the White House is one, B. Hussein Obama,” he said.

Later in the interview, Colmes returned to Drake’s answer to make sure he heard him right.

“Are you praying for his death?” Colmes asked.

“Yes,” Drake replied.

So you’re praying for the death of the president of the United States?”

“Yes.”

...“You would like for the president of the United States to die?” Colmes asked once more.

“If he does not turn to God and does not turn his life around, I am asking God to enforce imprecatory prayers that are throughout the Scripture that would cause him death, that’s correct.”

As we let that sink in, imagine if Drake was a Muslim cleric uttering this garbage. Do you think the Secret Service, the FBI and Homeland Security would be all over his *ss in a hot minute, bugging the mosque, rounding up his flock for questioning?

***

I think People for the American Way’s call for the Department of Homeland Security to release its “Rightwing Extremism” report is spot-on.

In the wake of the murder of Dr. George Tiller in Kansas and Stephen T. Johns at the US Holocaust Memorial Museum, People For the American Way President Michael B. Keegan called for the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) to finalize and publish its “Rightwing Extremism” report. The report was released by DHS earlier this year, but retracted after its content became the subject of manufactured controversy from Religious Right groups.

“DHS is charged with protecting the security of all Americans,” said Keegan. “And in order to do that it needs to be working with the best available information and analysis. When the ‘Rightwing Extremism’ report was released earlier this year, rightwing groups found it politically convenient to feign outrage. Since then, the essential findings of the report have been tragically confirmed. The killings of Dr. Tiller and Mr. Johns are domestic terrorism, and they should underscore the urgency of addressing the threat of politically motivated violence. Secretary Napolitano should publicly announce the current status of the report and expedite its final release.”

Read Keegan’s letter below the fold.

  June 11, 2009

  Secretary Janet Napolitano
  Department of Homeland Security
  U.S. Department of Homeland Security
  Washington, DC 20528

  Dear Secretary Napolitano:

  In the past two weeks, our nation has experienced two significant instances of domestic terrorism.  The murders of Dr. George Tiller, an abortion provider, and Stephen T. Johns, a security guard at the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum, were intended not only as horrific acts of violence directed at innocent individuals, but as efforts to terrorize and intimidate specific groups of Americans.

  In April, the Department of Homeland Security released a valuable report entitled “Rightwing Extremism: Current Economic and Political Climate Fueling Resurgence in Radicalization and Recruitment.”  The report was met with outrage from right wing groups, many of whose activities were not mentioned or alluded to in the report, but who found protesting the report to be a convenient political stunt.  With the support of sympathetic media outlets, these groups managed to exaggerate and distort the report’s findings.

  Although the report was withdrawn with the intent of being rewritten, the events of the last two weeks show that its core findings are fundamentally correct:  “The economic downturn and the election of the first African American president present unique drivers for rightwing radicalization and recruitment.” The Department of Homeland Security is charged with protecting the security of all Americans, and it is essential for the American public to have the unvarnished truth about the rise of dangerous extremism in this country.

  I urge you to expedite the approval of the “Rightwing Extremism” report and release a final version as soon as possible.  Moreover, the report should offer the best available assessment of possible threats from far-right groups and individuals, no matter how politically inconvenient the findings might be to some groups.  If the report can not be released immediately, please announce publicly the current status of the report and when you expect it to be published.

  Ensuring that law enforcement agents and the public have the best possible information about the threat posed by the far right is a crucial step in helping to contain the violence we are now experiencing.

  Sincerely,

   

  Michael B. Keegan
  President
  People For the American Way

 

------

Registration is now required! We're still in the process of getting it all squared away, so for the moment don't forget to Login or Register using the links in the upper left menu before starting to write your comment.

Posted by Pam Spaulding on 10:52 PM • (48) Comments

Thank Allah prayer don’t work, then.

P.S. I do love the targeted Google ads that accompany this post.

Comment #1: norbizness  on  06/11  at  11:03 PM

Can you point me to a link to the currently withdrawn report?  I didn’t download it when it was first floated/discussed, and of course it’s no longer on the official website.  Thanks.

Comment #2: Nora Carrington  on  06/11  at  11:12 PM

I’m not a terrorism supporter. I’m a vengeance of god supporter. Nice.

Comment #3: chingona  on  06/11  at  11:17 PM

These right wingers are nucking futs…

Comment #4: Arakiba  on  06/11  at  11:43 PM

“God said it, I didn’t. I was just agreeing with God.”

...the ventriloquist said the same thing about the puppet on his lap…

(Some of these fundies sound like they are just around the corner from strapping explosives around their waists and doing suicide bombings to achieve their goals.)

We’ll show those IslamoTerrists what it’s all about.  When we set our minds to it, we can achieve anything.  We can produce the best damn religious nuts ever!

America!  Are we great or what?...

Comment #5: MikeEss  on  06/11  at  11:50 PM

Well Mr. Drake, that’s mighty white of ya!

Comment #6: Ms Kate  on  06/12  at  12:34 AM

And we all know that Sean Hannity is going to condemn Pastor Drake on his Fox News program, right?

Remember how bent out of shape Hannity got with Christopher Hitchens after Hitchens remarks about Jerry Falwell AFTER Falwell had died?

Comment #7: Tommykey  on  06/12  at  12:37 AM

failed presidential candidate Alan Keyes

Pam, I think you need to expand on that a little.  Try this:

“serial failed presidential and senatorial candidate Alan Keyes.”

Comment #8: Tommykey  on  06/12  at  12:40 AM

Actually we could go shorter on that, Tommykey and just say, “epic failure, Alan Keyes…”

Comment #9: TheRealistMom  on  06/12  at  01:09 AM

“If he does not turn to God and does not turn his life around, I am asking God to enforce imprecatory prayers that are throughout the Scripture that would cause him death, that’s correct.”

This means exactly one of two things:
Either he is admitting that prayer does nothing and is a waste of time, or he is guilty of attempted murder.

If I point a gun at someone believing it is loaded and pull the trigger, I am guilty of a felony, even if nothing happens. I can go to jail.
If I ask someone repeatedly, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE KILL THIS GUY, and they do it I’m guilty of murder. He doesn’t even have the excuse of “I didn’t really mean kill him” because you don’t get to fuck around with prayers of death.

So either God has will beyond any human intervention, and no matter how much you pray, things will happen completely independently of it, and therefore even if you get lucky and what you want happens, all prayers are unanswered. That’s assuming god has agency and would be a third party involved in said murder.

If, however, Prayer is effective, even 1 time out of 100, but your expression of your wishes and desires to go makes something happen that otherwise would not? then god’s agency is irrelevant. It is the expression of “please lord make him die” that was the act that caused something to happen, not god’s will. In which case, it’s just firing an extremely unreliable gun. And is therefore attempted murder if nothing happens, and I’d argue first degree premeditated murder involving a (celestial) murder for hire if in fact it results in someone’s death.

Comment #10: karpad  on  06/12  at  01:29 AM

What stuns me is the complete inability to see how a preacher saying “God wants him dead” isn’t any different from an iman saying “Allah wants him dead.”

Oh, right—their religion is a bunch of mythology, but mine is real.

That’s the difference. Riiiight.

(Wow, clicking “blaspheme” seems ever so appropriate today…)

Comment #11: JCfromNC  on  06/12  at  02:16 AM

quote:
“Will no one rid me of this troublesome Priest?”

that’s what he’s saying, right?

and, for the eightylillionth time, OBAMA IS A CHRISTIAN

gods, i swear that is the thing that pisses me off the most. not their delusions of theocracy - i can fight that. it’s the insistance that Obama (or anyone, really) i NOT CHRISTIAN for no fucking reason! WHY do they think Obama isn’t Christian?! because his father wasn’t? but ALL Christians are decended from people who WERE NOT CHRISTIAN. read the fucking Bible.

i mean… if someone converts from, say, Hinduism to Christianity, is the Christian Coalition going to claim for FOREVER that that person isn’t *really* a Christian because he was something else BEFORE he was a Christian?
(in this case, i am speaking specifically, of course. but if Jindal can become a Christian, why the FUCK can’t Obama?)

Comment #12: denelian  on  06/12  at  02:58 AM

All True Christians (tm) are right-wingers, hence anyone who claims to be a Christian but doesn’t oppose abortion/support Iraq/hate “welfare”/love tax breaks for the rich/fight stupid wars is by definition an atheist Muslim socialist Communist fascist One-World-Government-Loving antichrist.

Comment #13: fmitchell  on  06/12  at  03:19 AM

Rrrgh, I mentioned the war twice and forgot Teh Gay ...

Comment #14: fmitchell  on  06/12  at  03:23 AM

I just don’t get how people can sit in church and listen to someone spewing this crap without either busting out laughing or getting very, very annoyed.

But then, I managed to get an education and am reasonably sane…

And the sanctimony!  I guess that’s why people like this stuff.  They get to all sanctimonious and holier-than-thou and better than the other guy.  They just don’t realize that with this philosophy, some other church could be doing the same thing against them..

HEY!  I know!  Church gang wars!  If they all pray each other dead due to being blasphemers, maybe we can rid ourselves of the problem?  Drive by imprecatory prayers!

Comment #15: speedbudget  on  06/12  at  08:46 AM

Ummm. Hey, guy? God is not your hit man.

Comment #16: KMac  on  06/12  at  08:51 AM

Ummm. Hey, guy? God is not your hit man.
KMac on 06/12 at 03:51 AM

These people think they own God.

However, as long as they are just trying to recruit God into being their hit-Man, it’s mainly an amusing kind of crazy. The scary thing is, it elides rather easily into psyching themselves up to be God’s hit-men.

Comment #17: Mark Foxwell  on  06/12  at  09:25 AM

“God said it, I didn’t. I was just agreeing with God.”

Well, God told me that Drake is an idiot.  I am just agreeing with God.

Comment #18: bananacat  on  06/12  at  09:46 AM

Pam, I think you need to expand on that a little.  Try this:

“serial failed presidential and senatorial candidate Alan Keyes.”

Tommykey on 06/11 at 11:40 PM

I’m thinking let’s just cut to the chase:  Epically failed proto-human.

Comment #19: MosesZD  on  06/12  at  10:03 AM

I love People for the American Way, but thus far their conception of the American Way doesn’t include wide-ranging, unaccountable national police agencies like the Department of Homeland Security, or lazy prosecutorial shortcuts like USA PATRIOT.

The report should be published and released, of course. But calls for that by American liberals should be accompanied by calls for the dissolution of DHS (or, at the very least, its reduction to an inter-agency info clearinghouse), the repeal of abominations like PATRIOT, and a return to active and focused investigations of terrorist activity by violent religious fantasists (of any stripe) as what they are: criminal acts.

Comment #20: Gracchus.  on  06/12  at  10:36 AM

“These people think they own God.”

Exactly. And because they believe people of color aren’t actual thinking, feeling human beings they don’t realize they are outnumbered. African Americans have a better attendance record at church than even the farthest right wing evangelical douchebags and I have to believe that their prayers for Obama are the complete opposite of this religious terrorist and his ilk. Plus, add in the prayers of the entire nation of Kenya and a large number of intelligent believers in America and around the world. Do the math and you’ll see how outnumbered these lunatics really are. Even though the amount of press they get is way out of proportion to their numbers (because of their despicable actions), there is some solace in the fact that most of the world isn’t like them.

Comment #21: DC Fem  on  06/12  at  10:51 AM

“Will no one rid me of this troublesome Priest?”

Aaaah, Becket had it coming to him.

Comment #22: seeker6079  on  06/12  at  11:02 AM

WHY do they think Obama isn’t Christian?!

That’s easy.  Because the sheriff is a ni-[DOONNNNNGGGG!!!!!!!].

Comment #23: seeker6079  on  06/12  at  11:04 AM

”So you’re praying for the death of the president of the United States?”

“Yes.”


This guy doesn’t have a FUCKING CLUE what it means to be a christian. If they were telling me the truth in Sunday School when I was a kid, he is the one who’ll be burning in hell.

Comment #24: Mark  on  06/12  at  11:37 AM

“This guy doesn’t have a FUCKING CLUE what it means to be a christian.”

...careful, Mark, or he’ll be praying for your death too.  And since God knows who you really are, and not just your blog name, if he decides to take you (or me, or anyone) out, you’re toast…

Comment #25: MikeEss  on  06/12  at  12:13 PM

Pam, I think you need to expand on that a little.  Try this:
“serial failed presidential and senatorial candidate Alan Keyes.”

Unelectable, epic failure, Alan Keyes.

Comment #26: Caren-Sun-blocking Creator of Animorphic Pancakes  on  06/12  at  12:43 PM

“Unelectable, epic failure, Alan Keyes.”

Isn’t that redundant?

Comment #27: Lymis  on  06/12  at  12:50 PM

LOL Mike. If it hasn’t happened by now… ;->

Comment #28: Mark  on  06/12  at  12:52 PM

Imprecatory prayer!!!???


Hey, maybe we could give it a shot.  *makes list*

Starting with you Limbaugh…I pray your boils return.  I pray an elephant caresses you with his toes.  I pray you get a zit for every lie you’ve ever told.  I pray your drug supply dries up.  Etc., etc., etc.

Mostly, Lord, I pray that every hater gets exactly what they deserve, no less, no more.

Comment #29: Magis  on  06/12  at  01:30 PM

What stuns me is the complete inability to see how a preacher saying “God wants him dead” isn’t any different from an iman saying “Allah wants him dead.”

Especially since the “God” in both situations (and in the Jewish faith) is the same God who made a covenant with Abraham.

Jews are waiting for their messiah.  Christians believe Jesus was the Messiah and gave them the “New Covenant”.  Muslims believe Jesus was a good guy and a prophet, but Mohammad was the Messiah and gave them the Koran.

But it’s the same deity.  Seems to me you’d be better off praying for Yaweh to attack Buddhists or Wiccans, and not his fellow worshippers.  But then Yaweh is a jealous little war god, so maybe he plays favorites.

“Unelectable, epic failure, Alan Keyes.”
Isn’t that redundant?

Wish so, but W proves not so much.

Comment #30: Caren-Sun-blocking Creator of Animorphic Pancakes  on  06/12  at  02:33 PM

One wonders why the suspected killer of Dr. Tiller, his family, his associates and his clergy are not being harshly interrogated to identify other domestic terrorists plotting to kill more doctors and women.

May Allah forgive the Reverend Wiley Drake.

Comment #31: mnsr  on  06/12  at  02:53 PM

Not that the law applies to wingnuts, but calling for the death of the president or vice president has a special status in law. Want to bet that this wanker comes back screaming bloody murder after the feds drop by for a polite visit and ask him if he knows about anything more concrete than god’s wrath…

Comment #32: paul  on  06/12  at  03:04 PM

“Not that the law applies to wingnuts, but calling for the death of the president or vice president has a special status in law.”

But, don’t you see?  Barry Soetaro is not, and never could be, the legitimate President of the United States of America.  That job has been reserved exclusively for white males, and for the last 40-years has only been legitimately occupied by white male Conservatives.

So when a fine upstanding example of American white maleness like Pastor Wiley Drake says something about The Usurper, he isn’t actually talking about the President, who, of course, is now John McCain… Unless it’s Rush Limbaugh or Newt Gingrich…

Comment #33: MikeEss  on  06/12  at  03:34 PM

Yeah, well, God told me Wiley Drake owes me $100,000.  I’m just agreeing with God.

Also, God told me…

This is kind of fun. smile

Comment #34: human  on  06/12  at  04:38 PM

What stuns me is the complete inability to see how a preacher saying “God wants him dead” isn’t any different from an iman saying “Allah wants him dead.”

Yup.  The simple fact is, this Pastor Drake is simply a Christian version of Osama bin Laden, at least in terms of the tenor of his message.

And no, I’m not speaking hyperbolically.

Not that the law applies to wingnuts, but calling for the death of the president or vice president has a special status in law.

I agree, though I’m not sure anything can or will actually be done about this.  Pastor Drake has phrased his words in such a way that he has given himself a likely constitutional out on First Amendment grounds.  I’ll be honest - there were times during the Bush Presidency where I publicly expressed a wish that Dick Cheney would die.  But I carefully avoided using the word “assassinate” or phrases like “I hope someone kills him”.  I simply said that I wished he would die.  And I genuinely felt that way.

Much the same, Pastor Drake isn’t directly calling for someone human to kill the president or explicitly encouraging someone to take actions that would result in his death.

I have little doubt that this vile shitstain hopes that something like that happens, but he’s choosing his words in a way that keeps him just inside the lines of protected free speech.  It is vile, hateful, evil free speech, but it is likely just free speech.

I do hope that the FBI is watching this guy very, very closely… but I don’t think that he can actually be arrested or charged with anything for what he has said here.  What would you charge him with specifically, aside from being a hateful dickhead with vile thoughts?

Anyway, all that said… I hope some sky fairy decides that a bus needs to run over Pastor Drake and drag his carcass down the streets for a few miles so he feels agonizing pain as the skin is slowly ripped from his body until he dies.

There, I said it.

Comment #35: DTG in STL  on  06/12  at  04:57 PM

Maybe there are enough of us praying the other way, and to enough deities, that we have Drake out-gunned, theologically speaking.

There are days when I am sad to be a believer. I’ll go dance naked for Pastor Drake’s soul. Maybe that will help.

Comment #36: Angelia Sparrow  on  06/12  at  05:12 PM

It always looked like clear and obvious proof –to me– that people created"God”, not the other way around.  That’s why they’re always telling “Him” what to do. They can call it a prayer, but really! Bossing around an All-Powerful All-Knowing entity?

I recall a store I was shopping at where a customer scolded/badgered a clerk, telling her:  “You just Tell your boss..blah blah…this & that..”

She was going on and on, till the clerk retorted: “Listen, Lady! I don’t tell my Boss what to do, SHE tells ME!”

Drake is oblivious to what His relation ship with God should be.  I mean, if he really does believe in god, and isn’t just hiding behind religion in order to incite murder. I’d vote for the second, although Drake does appear incorrigibly stupid, as well as evil.

Comment #37: Kwillow  on  06/12  at  05:55 PM

These nutsos get dispro coverage because they’ve been drafted as foot soldiers for the rich right wing. As Thomas Frank wrote, they’ll work 14 hour days for nothing, knock on doors, picket in the rain over ridiculous things, and vote in their own worst interests, all because the powers that be throw them an anti-choice bone in their speeches once in a while.

It’s a symbiotic relationship, too. The rich get their votes and their loud, honking voices, and the God Ballers get national recognition of their guano-insane beliefs and an invitation to the cocktail party.

If only they’d recognize that the invitation is to a Diner de Cons.

Comment #38: unrelatedwaffle  on  06/12  at  05:56 PM

Was someone praying for the pastor to make an ass of himself in public?

Comment #39: Samantha Vimes  on  06/12  at  06:45 PM

Remember how bent out of shape Hannity got with Christopher Hitchens after Hitchens remarks about Jerry Falwell AFTER Falwell had died?

Hah. Hitchens slagged on Mother Teresa, for heaven’s sake. You think Falwell would ruffle his sensibilities?

Comment #40: Bitter Scribe  on  06/13  at  12:13 AM

seeker…

thanx - i was afraid no one at all would get it smile

Comment #41: denelian  on  06/13  at  01:31 AM

MikeEss,

for all your comments, over the years: I am so very very glad you are on my side(s).

And I don’t *do* guys. Well, not yet anyway.

*hearts*

Comment #42: teac  on  06/13  at  03:26 AM

Ummm. Hey, guy? God is not your hit man.

I believe the proper phrasing is “/G/ is not your personal army.”

Comment #43: Sophist FCD  on  06/13  at  04:09 AM

*hearts*

wink

Comment #44: MikeEss  on  06/13  at  10:08 AM

What an asshole of Biblical proportions….

Comment #45: CHV  on  06/13  at  04:33 PM

Hitchens slagged on Mother Teresa, for heaven’s sake. You think Falwell would ruffle his sensibilities?

Mother Teresa was a terrible person. she’s one of the legendary “people who spend more time being sanctimonious about their faithful devotion than actually doing said good works.”

Her “Hospitals” would be more accurately called “hospices.” Which were run with all the authoritarian discomfort and “pray ON ORDER RIGHT NOW or we’ll make your suffering death even more unpleasant” of a convent. And all they had to do was start dying.

And because she spent so much time self-promoting, people gave to her and promoted her charities and she used it for her personal cult of personality. She robbed from charities which would have done more good, like Doctors Without Borders. And because she was so good at self-promotion, her name has become synonymous with “modest, noble and saintly person, being good to an unbelievable degree.”

Needless to say, I am not a fan.

Comment #46: karpad  on  06/14  at  02:19 AM

” Beware of the man who’s god is in the skies” Geiorge Bernard Shaw, and it says it all

Comment #47: Ex Patriot  on  06/14  at  07:49 AM

I’m sorry.  I really don’t believe prayer is effective in causing anything . If you do, please give me some reasons for your belief. If you don’t, why are you upset ?

Let me allay your concerns, Corwin. No, of course I don’t believe that prayer in and of itself can be effective at doing anything. But I *do* believe that a) there are plenty of reichwing nutjobs out there who will take this as a call to arms - hey, that preacher said murdering Obama is a religious duty, backed with Biblical authority!, and b) that if a Muslim cleric had said similar about Bush back in the day, he’d have been in Guantanamo before he could finish the broadcast.

Plus, it’s vile.

Comment #48: Nic_C  on  06/15  at  10:57 AM
Page 1 of 1 pages
Commenting is not available in this channel entry.