Mullah Giuliana = Muffuletta

“Oh, that’s right - it’ll be Muslims’ responsibility. As Sarah Palin has said, it’s an ‘unnecessary provocation’.  Which, of course, it is, because this is America and the people who deserve the most protection are the ones who are the most crazily xenophobic and prone to say and do insane shit because of a brutal lack of understanding of history or the proper functioning of civilization.”

Fuck!! I hate this kind of ignorant bullshit and all the dumbasses that buy into it. Ground zero is not “sacred ground” and the rec center isn’t even actually at ground zero. Its around the corner and down the street I think (Can’t find a map of the site. My googling skills are off today). There will probably be threats made against the company that gets the constrction contract before they even break ground.

“Ground zero is not “sacred ground” and the rec center isn’t even actually at ground zero. Its around the corner and down the street I think…”

It doesn’t matter.  If it was on Manhattan at all they’d have their panties in a bunch.  But it’s important to realize they really don’t have any pseudo-religious fervor, it’s just politics.  As usual.

The Reichwing thinks it can score points by making something ordinary into a Big Deal!  They think somehow this will translate into more votes in November.

What I can’t figure out is why all these efforts to get The Base to vote the way The Base always votes.  It’s not like the same bigoted idiot who hates Obama, hates Hillary, hates Pelosi, hates Muslims, hates immigrants, hates libruls, etc., gets to vote multiple times based on each hatred they harbor.  If Bubba Bigot votes, his vote counts once, just like anybody else’s. 

Am I missing something here?...

There’s a Shinto shrine just down the road from Pearl Harbor.  Not as close as this will be, but nothing, at least in this country, is as close as things are in Manhattan.

One of the most telling things though, was a comment I saw on Guiliani’s statement.  I wish I could find it, but it compared the Muslim mosque to a Shinto shrine at Pearl Harbor (again, ignorant to the existence of one), to a Nazi memorial at a concentration camp.  Wait, what?  Islam, a religion.  Shinto, a religion.  Nazi, a political affiliation.  Ok, besides pointing out the obvious that right-wingers conflate religion and political affiliation all the time, mostly because they themselves can’t separate the two, this is just twisted.  The Nazis were, by and large, Christians.  Not Christ-like (Gandhi’s famous quote comes to mind), but Christian.  But this commenter couldn’t go there.  He couldn’t say, “A Christian chapel at a concentration camp,” because Christians are forever blameless.  Only the ‘other,’ be they Muslim or Shinto or atheist or anything in between can be condemned on the basis of their faith.  When a Muslim does something bad, it’s because he’s a Muslim.  When a Christian does something bad, it’s because he wasn’t really a Christian.  Fucking hypocrites.

Be respectful. His name is spelled with those special diacritical characters:

Mullah 9ui11ani

I find it fascinating how the precious rights of the Constitution only seem valid for those lucky enough to be of the correct ‘hue’ or the right ‘religion’ (‘right’ being an interesting word as well, all things considered). For anyone else who happens to be living within the borders of the United States, regardless of whether they were born there or are naturalized citizens it doesn’t seem to matter, if they go against the flow of the perceived ‘cultural flavor’ that has been established as being acceptable, they are in the wrong no matter what they do. Nothing they do can mitigate the fact that they are ‘foreign’ and that they ‘pose a threat’ by virtue of the fact that they are different from the rest of us. Well, that’s just too damn bad, Mr Giuliani, and to all the rest of the bigots that oppose this ‘Islamic Center’ being built ‘so close’ to the ‘hallowed’ grounds of ‘Ground Zero’ - America has to come to grips with the FACT that, if it wants to demonstrate that the terrorists have NOT won, they MUST allow this center to be built. In fact, it is an imperative for this center to be built. Not only will the construction demonstrate that the petty hatreds of a few closed-minded individuals won’t be allowed to control the thinking of the majority, it would demonstrate that the American people - and the people of New York in particular - hold the Constitution and what it stands for to be more important and of more vitality than the hate filled rhetoric being spouted by the irrelevant air-bags like Giuliani or Half-Governor Sarah Palin who measures everything according to whether or not she can shoot it or if she thinks it’s being taxed too much. People who have no connection to reality clearly demonstrate that lack of connection when their arguments against a ‘cultural center’ enter the realm of the sublime when they begin making up new words to bolster their arguments.

It is not ‘hurtful’ to place the center near the site of Ground Zero - EVERYTHING in the Tribeca area is, ostensibly, the Ground Zero area (I just spoke to a New Yorker to confirm this), so having the center 2 1/2 blocks from the site of WTC means absolutely NOTHING and even less to Sarah Palin with her homegrown aphoristic wisdom about ‘refudiations’ and stabbing in the back of the survivors. For now Sarah should go back to her cozy little cabin in Alaska so she can keep an eye out for the Russians ... I hear their aircraft were probing Canadian airspace recently. Maybe she can work as a NORAD spotter and keep a sharp eye out for those enemy intruders. Who knows, maybe some Russkies will try to slip over the border into the United States and enter America from the north.

Maybe she can take Uncle Rudy up there with her. The cool air might do him some good.

If you look hard enough at anything you WILL see a conspiracy theory.

“When a Muslim does something bad, it’s because he’s a Muslim.  When a Christian does something bad, it’s because he wasn’t really a Christian.”

...but, but, but, it’s right there in their “holy” book!  Each Muslim is required by their pagan god “allah” to do bad things to non-Muslims!  (I’ve never even seen a copy of their evil book, much less actually read it - well I wouldn’t, even if I could read - but I listen to Glenn and Rush and Sarah so I know all about it…)

Now the Bible is totally different.  The Bible is just crammed full of love and peace and understanding, and has never, ever, been used to justify doing bad things to non-Christians.  Ever.  And every word of it — written in King James’ own English, just like Jesus spoke — is literally true…

Matt Bors had the best response to the right wing “talking point” 2 months ago.
http://www.mattbors.com/archives/644.html
Done. Game, set, match.

Libdevil @ #4:

Another hipocrisy that should be mentioned is that the Japanese did not attack Pearl Harbor because they practiced Shinto or Buddhism or any other religion - they attacked the United States because of the war they were fighting - it was a government-sanctioned military action against the U.S.  Religion had nothing to do with it.  Building a Shinto shrine near Pearl Harbor shouldn’t mean anything more than building a Christian church or Jewish synagogue near Pearl Harbor.  As for the Islamic community center/mosque that is the center of this childish “debate”, I fail to see why this should be any more offensive to these right-wingers than any other Islamic building in New York.  Somehow, I don’t see them protesting the building of a Catholic church because some Catholic clergymen molest children.  To me, it’s the same argument - hating an entire religion because of what some members of that religion did something terrible.

Sorry - that last sentence has a superfluous “of what” in there.

MikeEss, Bubba Bigot might hate everything, but he might just be content with seething on his couch. They are hitting as many of his prejudices as they can, in hopes of finding that one thing that’ll get his ass off the couch and into the polling booth. Or, you know, if he still refuses to vote, encouraging him to go out and shoot someone is Plan B.

I grew up in NYC and went to college walking distance from WTC. Everything in the area is walking distance. The right can classify everything around there as “ground zero,” if it suits their political needs. You know what is actually right there, overlooking the site? Century 21 Department Store. Should there be discount high-end fashion shopping on “sacred ground”? I’m not saying there should or shouldn’t, I’m just saying the questions have to be asked.

Ground Zero (ie, all of lower Manhattan) is “holy ground” that should not be “desecrated” by a rec center, and is also inhabited by all those “East Coast liberal elites” who are trying to bring down all that America stands for.

Uh huh.

Does Rudi get extra points for lying about the guy who has been working toward this center, who has in fact repeatedly called out violent extremists and is envisioning Cordoba House in part as a nucleus for interfaith cooperation?

Century 21 Department Store. Should there be discount high-end fashion shopping on “sacred ground”? I’m not saying there should or shouldn’t, I’m just saying the questions have to be asked.

Of course there should be!  Didn’t you know America really isn’t a democratic republic it is a Capitalist society?  We should all be so lucky to have a Century 21 department store near our religious centers.  Hell, just move them right into the churches, mosques, synagogues, and temples!  We can pray to Gucci instead of god, it’ll be wonderful!

Honestly, I want to see the zoning board try and prevent the rec center and watch them lose the court battle.  The law is on the side of the rec center regardless of who is funding it.  They need to learn to deal with it, we should all be so lucky as to have rec centers funded by people to give our children places to play.

Or, as Amanda so described the American kids wearing US flags on Cinco De mayo….maybe they are just trying to be assholes.

Once again the specter of the ‘Liberal elites’ - nay, the ‘East Coast liberal elites’ has been invoked in relationship to those who are trying to ‘bring down all that America stands for’ (from comment #12 by ‘NobleEperiments’, an anonymous poster). That’s very interesting since I can’t, for the life of me, think of one thing that ‘Liberal elites’ (from the East coast) have done for the United States.

Well, of course, there was that guy, what’s his name - oh, Roosevelt - that’s right - what did he do for America? Aside from inheriting a depression that had been started by the previous GOP administration led by Hoover and his corporate-owned cabinet Franklin Delano Roosevelt brought the economy out of the worst depression the United States had seen (to that point) AND led them through the second world war, almost to its conclusion.

What else have the ‘Liberal Elite’ done for America? Oh, nothing much - there was that annoying passage of the Civil Rights act, in 1964 (preceded by the passage, in 1868, of the 14th Amendment), and before that the successful defense of the Equal Protection Clause of the aforementioned 14th Amendment in 1954 in a case heard by the Supreme Court of the United States called ‘Brown v. Board of Education’ which was argued for successfully by a future Associate Justice of the Supreme Court by a man named Thurgood Marshall.

The advancements of Civil Rights in America have come at the hands - and the shedding of blood - of these ‘East Coast liberal elites’ that you speak so snidely of. Remember - during the Civil Rights movement that white Jews from the ‘North’ were murdered in the ‘South’ while trying to register blacks to vote - something that was not only entirely legal, but their CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT. They were murdered for showing black people that they had the same rights as the white people that were still treating them as no better as the slaves their grandparents had been.

If that’s what you mean by ‘East Coast liberal elite’ I will gladly embrace anyone wearing the label for they truly stand for the America that I want to see: an America that still maintains the belief in the inscription emblazoned on the Statue of Liberty:
Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles.  From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame,
“Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!” cries she
With silent lips.  “Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore,
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!” by Emma Lazarus, New York City, 1883

Notice the last part, in quotation marks (as per the original): Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses YEARNING TO BREATHE FREE .... America was FOUNDED on immigrants. Save for the Natives, everyone living in America is an Immigrant. The sooner you get over that fact and realize that the only thing special about America is how you conduct yourself - the laws by which you live (your Constitution) the happier you will be.

If you go around changing the Constitution - banning a religious group from having a building on ‘Sacred ground’ because some Wasila political pundit is ‘offended’, then you may as well mail your precious Constitution to Osama bin Laden with the words ‘You Win’ emblazoned over the top. There is only one way to defeat the treachery that you fear so much: guarantee the rights of ALL, without regard for WHO they are. Without equality we are ALL diminished. When one person is treated with inequality we are ALL enslaved.

Ah, Sarah. You’d think someone so proud of being incorrect might have had experience in front of someone, somewhere, who wasn’t clapping for her like a parent at a 5-year-old’s first tee-ball game.

Casp, before I open up a can of WhupTroll, perhaps you can explain your comment so I can determine if I am misjudging you…?

Mullah Giuliani (Mulliani?)

Assholeatollah

The Reichwing thinks it can score points by making something ordinary into a Big Deal!  They think somehow this will translate into more votes in November.

What I can’t figure out is why all these efforts to get The Base to vote the way The Base always votes.

Because energising the Base by whipping them up with cheap tribalistic theatrics gets them out to vote.  It’s like cheerleaders pepping up the hometown audience before the Big Game, only with wars instead of football games.

America has to come to grips with the FACT that, if it wants to demonstrate that the terrorists have NOT won, they MUST allow this center to be built. In fact, it is an imperative for this center to be built.

This.

Osama bin Laden was quoted at the time as believing that this attack would split up the United States. 

At the time, I found that preposterous.  He simply didn’t understand that we were one nation, not just a collection of states like the EU or Soviet Union.  What a fool.

My fellow ‘Merkins have done so much to prove him right in the name of defeating him.  Bush and Cheney most of all, but every one who cannot handle a differing opinion or the fact that an opposing political party won an election is proving bin Laden right.

Jeff Goldberg, whom it’d be hard to accuse of being soft on Islamofascism, points out that Rudy is lying about Rauf.

Tell you what, Rudy: we’ll withdraw the Muslim rec center, if you’ll tear down the apartment where your pal Bernard Kerik used to harpoon his mistress.

http://soupsoup.tumblr.com/post/894772323 friends

Fuck!! I hate this kind of ignorant bullshit and all the dumbasses that buy into it. Ground zero is not “sacred ground” and the rec center isn’t even actually at ground zero. Its around the corner and down the street I think

It’s two blocks northeast of Ground Zero, and the view from the proposed Islamic Center to Ground Zero is obstructed by two taller buildings.  These jackoffs are whining about a building that you won’t even be able to see from most points at Ground Zero.

This has nothing to do with protecting “sacred ground” and everything to do with ratcheting up racist xenophobic fears, something the teabaggerati have perfected.

When a Muslim does something bad, it’s because he’s a Muslim.  When a Christian does something bad, it’s because he wasn’t really a Christian.  Fucking hypocrites.

This is the most sickening part of this whole phenomenon.  Earlier this year when Army Major Nidal Hasan went on a killing spree at Fort Hood, the first thing the baggers picked up on was his Muslim faith.  From there, they deduced that he was a secret agent of Osama bin Laden, called upon to inflitrate the infidels’ military so he could take a dozen American soldiers out.

Had he been a white Christian Army Major, he would have been characterized as someone who had a psychological meltdown, and certainly not representative of Christians or white people as a whole.  But since he was Muslim, there was no chance of a similar psychological meltdown, as this surely must have been an evil Islamic terrorist attack.  That the right wants to call the actions of mentally disturbed American citizen with no known ties to Al Qaeda who happens to be Muslim a “terrorist attack” makes it pretty clear that they really do see all Muslims as one huge monolithic enemy.  Any violent crime committed by a Muslim = “terrorist attack”.  Any violent crime committed by a white Christian male = “lone wolf incident”.  Case in point, Timothy McVeigh.  While I don’t believe Mr. McVeigh was a part of a deeper conspiracy than what was revealed in his trial, I do believe that his vile and sadistic crime was silently praised by a shitload of resentful white Christian men who feel as if “their” country is being stolen from them by the damn man-hating feminazis, queers, and coloreds with the help of the federal government.

Scum.  That’s what these people are.  Pure scum.

Xeranar @14, are you sure the zoning board is even involved? Some douchebags tried to argue that the building that’s currently on the proposed Cordoba House site was “historic” because it had been hit by debris from 9/11. But the Landmark Preservation Commission just voted unanimously for the project to go ahead. I believe the local community board also approved the project and that the majority of the people who actually live in the neighborhood support it. I bet that most of the people who are organizing the protests and those bullshit challenges aren’t even New Yorkers.

The building that’s there now has got one of those cool (but common) facades that are all over NYC. I hope that something can be done to at least preserve the facade and the character of the street, but if not, whatever. I don’t remember Rudy and his friends being all that verklempt about historic architecture when his developer buddies needed building sites or when NYU was destroying a historic church in East Village to build a dorm.

“the Landmark Preservation Commission just voted unanimously for the project to go ahead.”

and they did so to rousing applause.

are you sure the zoning board is even involved? Some douchebags tried to argue that the building that’s currently on the proposed Cordoba House site was “historic” because it had been hit by debris from 9/11. But the Landmark Preservation Commission just voted unanimously for the project to go ahead. I believe the local community board also approved the project and that the majority of the people who actually live in the neighborhood support it. I bet that most of the people who are organizing the protests and those bullshit challenges aren’t even New Yorkers.

I used the generic “Zoning Board” because I don’t live in NY nor did I feel the need to find the exact controllers of the right to build.  More or less it was just a generic group but since buildings are largely controlled by hearings and the only LEGAL prevention of building most buildings is on safety issues defeating it over personal feelings would be nigh impossible.  I assumed this fight was still in the zoning stage since if they own the property pretty much the only legal thing stopping them would be zoning and permits.  Private citizens don’t get a say on what is built on private property.

It makes me reflect back on the hundreds of catholic and christian universities in this country and how they should all be brought down because they except federal funds for their religions services.  I mean that atleast has a more legal stance than this crap.

CrazyComposer @ 16, next time I’ll add the </rolling eyes> tag for your benefit.

Leona brach in Tränen aus, musste aber nicht ins Krankenhaus. Sie rannte aus der Bücherei und führte die Stunde nicht zu Ende. Sie entschuldigt sich bei ihren Fans dafür.

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So Palin’s saying that if Cordoba House hadn’t been in that neighborhood ... wearing that skirt….

And every word of it — written in King James’ own English, just like Jesus spoke — is literally true…
Comment 7—MikeEss

Including “and” and “the”?

Didn’t you know America really isn’t a democratic republic it is a Capitalist society?  We should all be so lucky to have a Century 21 department store near our religious centers.
Comment 14—Xeranar

Ah, but it’s discount shopping. And you know what sort of cosmopolitan internationalist buys clothing at a discount.

(Did I leave out any code words?)

It’s two blocks northeast of Ground Zero, and the view from the proposed Islamic Center to Ground Zero is obstructed by two taller buildings.
Comment 25—Murrow Fan

Well, if the Liberty Tower is ever built that view won’t be obstructed.

high-end fashion shopping on “sacred ground”? I’m not saying there should or shouldn’t
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