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Next entry: An entertaining Twitter shaming episode, and what it means Previous entry: Friday Music Ten: “Texas Comes To NYC” Edition

How much damage can culture warriors do?

Exciting news, everyone: Despite his Google problems, Rick Santorum is announcing his run for President today. That raises the Republican field to 95% batshit, which may actually be a new record, historically speaking, though then again that's iffy if you consider the Goldwater question.  There are many ways Santorum is just going to make the current clusterfuck even worse, but one of them is that, now that Mike Huckabee's out of the game, Santorum is easily the one with the longest public record of claiming that contraception is the devil.  As a rule, I tend to think that one should avoid hating on something used by 99% of the public, at least if one wants a career in politics.  Santorum has hedged his bets on this---his public statements are all "THE PILL IS EVIL", but he voted with the Republican caucus in the past when it came to generic support for family planning.  Of course, now that it's become mainstream and expected for Republicans to oppose family planning funding, I don't imagine he'll be able to pretend to be even remotely moderate on this issue.

I mention contraception in large part because it's an excellent stand-in for how far right the Republicans have gone in response to Obama winning the election.  And how they've deliberately chosen to be out of touch and paranoid over the other available options.  I have a mixed response to this.  On one hand, I'm glad, because by concentrating their efforts on just the most paranoid, out-of-touch people in their base, Republicans are limiting their general appeal to voters.  Most people just really aren't going to be as fully on board with a politics that is based solely on sex and race panic.  I think most of us are too busy trying to get work and trying to get laid.  

On the other hand, I'm concerned.  Even if this stuff limits the actual Republican Party's viability, it has a way of infecting our discourse.  The more people floating racist paranoia and going into full-blown sex panic, the more normal these things seem.  A year ago, the idea that feminists had defend the right of women to prevent pregnancy was considered so far out there that people laughed at me when I said that we really had to be aggressive on this front.  But now the idea that contraception is controversial is taking hold.  And once something gets marked as "controversial", you start getting the problem of the centrist types who are more interested in keeping the peace than justice looking for ways to compromise, in the vain hope that it will calm down right wingers, when what it does is embolden them.  If we start giving ground up on contraception, look for other incursions into basic rights to determine what your personal life looks like. I'll note that the section of my Bloggingheads with Michael Doughtery that got clipped by the New York Times was where we debating whether or not people should have a right to terminate relationships that aren't working out.  (Technically, we were talking about divorce, but by implication, this is a system where people would also not have the right to avoid divorce by not marrying in the first place.  If anything, I'd say the conservative distaste for cohabitation outstrips the distaste for divorce, by a long shot.)  I can easily see divorce becoming "controversial" in the way that conservatives have managed to make contraception controversial.  

All of this, of course, is about taking people's anger and worries and using that energy---much of which is rooted in economic concerns---to convince them to turn on their neighbors.  The sheer amount of energy dropped by workaday Republican voters on being angry that someone else is having an orgasm, having a good day, speaking in their first language, talking on a cell phone, looking fly, or otherwise feeling pleasures that they disapprove of really leaves me feeling exhausted.  But if all that energy is going towards hating your neighbors and trying to figure out how to make their lives suck more, then I suppose it's not going into thinking about the big picture of where this country is headed.  

And this strategy is working really well on the base voters.  I guess it remains to be seen if it has any impact on the country at large, or if it works mainly to marginalize Republicans. 

Of course, even if this does result in long-term losses for Republicans, they can do a whole lot of damage on the way out, as we're seeing with the attempts to defund Planned Parenthood.  They're trashing the joint on the way out the door. 

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Posted by Amanda Marcotte on 09:19 AM • (47) Comments

Since their positions are becoming more and more extreme, more voters are turning away in disgust.  I’m starting to think that this is their long-range strategy: make a huge mess for the Dems to clean up, loudly say the Dems are incompetent (because it takes more than a couple of years to shovel out all the shit that 30 years of Republican rule have caused), and then, when they eventually do regain power, pass laws that make them a permanent majority.  All they need is majorities in Congress and on the Supreme Court, and we’ll be a two-party system in name only.

Comment #1: NobleExperiments  on  06/06  at  10:24 AM

In theory, a strong democratic party could undo the damage fairly quickly, regardless of what deals may ostensibly have been struck (the same way that republican leadership ignores the promises it has made in negotiations past) but in practice, not so much.

Comment #2: paul  on  06/06  at  10:26 AM

I wish I could be as optimistic about the idea that the really far right-wingers will be a problem for the Repubs by alienating people who aren’t their usual 27 percenters, but the fact that so many of them have made it as far into the upper reaches of government already makes me think it’s not such a liability. If it truly turned off the voters, would we have had two Bush terms, the recent flood of anti-woman legislation, the papers-please laws, the tea-party, the “don’t say gay” bill, or the current push to require drug testing of people on wellfare?

I do hope you’re right, but I also think they’re counting on the anti-Obama hysteria they’ve been stoking since day one to carry the rest of the “moderate” Republicans along. NobleExperiments has it exactly right—they operate by destroying government every time they’re in power in order to sell the idea that “government doesn’t work”, and then blame the mess on the Dems. And the nation, as a whole, keeps buying it. Of course, it would help if the Democratic Party ever actually articulated and fought for anything truly progressive, but I’ve about given up on that dream.

Comment #3: Egnu Cledge  on  06/06  at  10:37 AM

This country is fucked. Simple as that. I’ve lost whatever little shred of optimism I had left. I’m hoping that my daughter, who is beginning a biomedical engineering education, will be able to get a job in a civilized country. But I’m stuck; nobody wants non-rich immigrants in their mid-50s. When I get old enough to have nothing left to lose (not that many years away), I’d like to join the resistance (and there will need to be one by then) and go out in a blaze of glory.

OK, it is Monday morning, but I’m not at all far from meaning every word of the above. I see no encouraging trends at all.  The Republican Party has become an outright fascist party which will not hesitate to take and hold power by extralegal means, and the continuing and maybe worsening Second Great Depression will give them their opening. The Democrats are worse than useless. Welcome to Weimar Amerika.

Comment #4: Steve LaBonne  on  06/06  at  10:49 AM

On the other hand, I’m concerned.  Even if this stuff limits the actual Republican Party’s viability, it has a way of infecting our discourse.  The more people floating racist paranoia and going into full-blown sex panic, the more normal these things seem.

This is the thing. If the fact that the GOP’s positions are preferred by 5-25% of the country meant that they got 5-25% of the air time in our national conversation, that’d be fine. (It’s certainly what happens when the Democrats are in the minority, so it’s not like it’s an unheard-of concept.) But their garbage, and slightly watered-down centrist versions of their garbage, is all you hear.

Comment #5: RickMassimo  on  06/06  at  10:55 AM

Well, with the current state of campaign finance, your not likely to see any Democrats mount a full-on assault of the Republican agenda, because they get donations from the same corporations.  It is essentially political hostage taking, and the Democrats have to do as they’re told, at least some of the time, if they want to continue to receive those sweet, sweet corporate campaign donations.  And as if Citizens United wasn’t bad enough, now corporations are allowed to donate directly to candidates.  Say goodbye to any semblance of politicians who aren’t wholly owned corporate subsidiaries.

The Culture Wars are simply a distraction promoted by Republicans so that voters on both sides of the issue have something else to focus on.  Furthermore, it allows Democrats to pump up their liberal credentials without having to do anything substantive on the big issues, like the economy, or the war in Afghanistan.  This way liberals and progressives have to spend time and energy defending things that should be obvious and uncontroversial, like the fact that we have freedom of speech and religion; that women are human beings, too; that there isn’t a fucking War on Christmas.  When we have to expend so much effort fighting these battles, we don’t have much left to fight for things like ending foreign wars, fighting unemployment, or doing something about global climate change.

Of course, none of this would be a problem if there weren’t so many small minded, racist, misogynist, hateful people who buy into the Culture Wars.  I do my best to fight this kind of mindset where I can, mostly in people my own age, so that the chances will be lower of them raising their children up to be small-minded, racist, misogynist, hateful adults.  In the end this may be all we can do.  I hope it’s enough.

Comment #6: progrocker  on  06/06  at  11:02 AM

When they eventually do regain power, [they] pass laws that make them a permanent majority.

This is happening right now in Canada (at least in terms of attempt), so…yeah, what you said.

Comment #7: Ranylt  on  06/06  at  11:03 AM

But their garbage, and slightly watered-down centrist versions of their garbage, is all you hear.

Comment #5: RickMassimo

They have made a concerted effort to corner the market on media and pass laws to eliminate competition in the media as well.
And when you consider that we think that 60% voter participation during high turn out years is good, well that 5 - 25% is a much larger portion of the voting populations.  Reason #1 that Republicans push for voter suppression laws and arcane, confusing voting methods.  (When they’re not just failing to provide voting booths and other resources for poor areas.)

Comment #8: cynickal  on  06/06  at  11:08 AM

Since when do Democratic positions get air time proportional with their popular support, whether they’re the majority or the minority?  Have you been living in some liberal paradise that I don’t know about?

There’s no piece of Democrat-written legislation that ever has or ever will be written that the media would cover even one tenth as much as they’ll cover Sarah Palin when she declares next month that Jesus hand-wrote the US Constitution.  Much less the fawning coverage they’ll give Paul Ryan’s soon to be drafted legislation that would require all voters in state and federal elections to prove that they own at least $1 million worth of property before their votes can be counted.

I made those two things up, but I’ll seem pretty damn psychic in a couple months when they actually happen.

Comment #9: Toitle  on  06/06  at  11:13 AM

I remember that waaaay back in the 90’s pro-lifers would get indignant at the suggestion that they really wanted to ban contraception as well, and loudly insist that this was some sort of liberal smear.

Turns out that they were lying, as usual.

Comment #10: Nobody  on  06/06  at  11:23 AM

This is where we are now:
http://www.care2.com/causes/womens-rights/blog/idaho-woman-charged-with/

(apologies if this doesn’t automatically open, I’m not so good with links)

Yes, you can be prosecuted for having an abortion in America. And please read the completely self-righteous comments from the “tipster”. People who enjoy hurting others that much are the ones who who enjoy seeing their elected representatives enact draconian legislation. They are probably rejoicing that they’ve lived to see the day when women can actually be put in prison for having an abortion.
As #10 Nobody said, they lied about wanting to ban contraception in the 90’s. That’s also when they spread lies about how they didn’t want to see women go to prison, just those evil doctors who performed abortions. They don’t even try to cover their misogyny with lies anymore.

Comment #11: serious bette  on  06/06  at  11:41 AM

All of this, of course, is about taking people’s anger and worries and using that energy—-much of which is rooted in economic concerns—-to convince them to turn on their neighbors.

This is exactly right. The cynicism of those stoking this conflict - Rove, Ailes, the Koch’s et al. - infuriates me more than just about any other phenomenon in the universe.

Comment #12: tesseral  on  06/06  at  11:42 AM

campaign finance

This is what it comes down to.  If we want to have a hope in hell of substantially turning things around, we need to fix this.  I have no idea how.  On good days it seems impossible; on bad days, hopeless.

Comment #13: bomberE  on  06/06  at  11:42 AM

Hey, a n***er got into the White House.  All they can do now is chain up sluts.

I’m sick and tired of the “Culture Wars are just to stoke the base and don’t really do anything.”  They most certainly do do things.  1000 state and federal laws this year restricting abortion and reproductive rights.  Indiana is willing to give up over $4 billion federal dollars in its attempt to run Planned Parenthood off.  Who cares if the poor suffer?  They’ll just claim it’s proof that government doesn’t work, instead of admitting that this particular government attacked its citizens.

It’s long past time for the Democrats to scrap Hyde and insist that abortion, as a legal medical procedure, must be covered by all insurance companies.  That an OB specialty cannot be granted without the doctor being experienced in terminating pregnancies.  That any hospital that provides emergency care to the public is REQUIRED to provide EC and most certainly can have the shit sued out of them if they refuse to save a woman’s life because abortions are icky.

If that means Catholics have to get out of the hospital business, so much the better.  You don’t have to be a doctor, and you don’t have to operate hospitals that provide ER services to the public.  If providing competent medical care is too icky for your conscience, YOU ARE IN THE WRONG BUSINESS.

It really sickens me how even “liberals” are willing to sell women’s rights to live and to freedom as bargaining chips.

Comment #14: Caren-Sun-blocking Creator of Animorphic Pancakes  on  06/06  at  11:54 AM

“The sheer amount of energy dropped by workaday Republican voters on being angry that someone else is having an orgasm, having a good day, speaking in their first language, talking on a cell phone, looking fly, or otherwise feeling pleasures that they disapprove of really leaves me feeling exhausted. “

Beautiful, Amanda.  Me too.  This is close to Mencken’s definition of Puritanism: “The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, might be happy.”  The current climate also calls to mind the famous prayer:
“God bless me and my wife
My son John and his wife,
Us four and no more
Forevermore.  Amen.”

Comment #15: Theresa  on  06/06  at  12:14 PM

“Yes, you can be prosecuted for having an abortion in America. And please read the completely self-righteous comments from the “tipster”. People who enjoy hurting others that much are the ones who who enjoy seeing their elected representatives enact draconian legislation.”

From the article serious bette linked to:

According to the report, McCormack was turned into the police by the sister of one of her friends, a woman who stated “There’s other things she could have done. She could have asked for some type of help.”

[Paul Ryan Conservative]
Ask for help?  In our Galtian Paradise?  Help for moochers and leeches and mooching leeches?  You want help, move to Russia, sister.  You let some guy come near you with a loaded penis, and this is what you get: knocked up.  Deal with it.  It’s not our problem…
[/Paul Ryan Conservative]

[Reichwing Religious Nut]
Of course we would have offered her help.  We have stacks of religious tracts that would help her give her life to Jesus.  Would they feed and clothe that precious new life?  No, but God will provide.  And please donate so we can pass an amendment to stop gay marriage…
[/Reichwing Religious Nut]

[Craven Republican Politician]
Of course this is a tragedy, because we live in a world where the ‘60s hippies sold the idea that everyone is free do do what they want.  Well, that’s just not true.  You’re free to do as you’re told.  Bill Clinton.  Family Values.  Judeo-Christian traditions.  Pro-Life.  Traditional definition of marriage.  Al Gore.  Cut taxes.  Continuous warfare.  Deregulation.  Michael Moore.  Monopoly.  Unlimited campaign donations and spending.  Government is the problem.  B. HUSSEIN Obama.  Elect me to represent you in government.  Blah blah blah American People blah heartland blah guns blah blah church…
[/Cravel Republican Politician]

Comment #16: MikeEss  on  06/06  at  12:17 PM

“It’s long past time for Democrats to scrap Hyde”

Amen!  I don’t understand why women’s groups insist on staying on the defensive instead of going on the offensive?  The only possible outcome from being on the defensive is that you maintain your current position.  I would state unequivically that our current position is not very good. The most likely out come from staying on the defensive, is that you lose ground over time.  That’s what we’re doing.

Why aren’t we on the offensive?  OVERTURN HYDE MOTHERFUCKERS!  That is an action I can get behind. 

I suspect that the major women’s groups are too cozy with elected Democrats, who do not want to touch Hyde.  This is why a grassroots movement of women is needed.  How do you start that?  I wish to fuck I knew!

Comment #17: Daisy  on  06/06  at  12:54 PM

The only possible outcome from being on the defensive is that you maintain your current position.

Not even that. If you’re always on defense your position inevitably will gradually be rolled back, as is indeed happening right now with women’s rights.

Comment #18: Steve LaBonne  on  06/06  at  01:13 PM

Can’t we get some cash from big pharma to help cover this stuff? Surely they have an interest in being able to continue to sell the pill. they have to be making a pretty coin off it.

Comment #19: Tersa  on  06/06  at  01:36 PM

@Tersa: big pharma is covered pretty much whichever way the wind blows, unless someone starts reducing patent terms or requiring real proof of efficicacy to bring drugs to market…

They might make more on one preemie than they do on a hundred women taking the pill for 20 years each.

Comment #20: paul  on  06/06  at  01:54 PM

The brutal part of all of this is that Obama team’s economics are so godawful that we’re really being presented with a choice between the people who want us to not be able to get a job, and the people who want us to die.  That’s not an awesome choice.

Comment #21: Punditus Maximus  on  06/06  at  01:55 PM

It takes a lot of hard work to beat down the human desire to appear more sensible, moral, and well-rounded than the rest of the people out there. Just last weekend I was talking to a friend’s mom who used the old “I’m not anti-abortion, I’m just pro-life, and I’m against women who use abortion as birth control.” Because she wanted me to look at her and think “no THERE’S a moral woman. She loves the babies, but she isn’t trying to take away anyone’s right to do what they need to do with their bodies, but she also appreciates that after X number of abortions, it stops being a fetus and starts being child murder. I’m not sure what the exact math on that is, but I’m sure it’s divisible by race somehow.”

She was taken aback when I quickly and unapologetically rejoined that I’m all FOR women using abortion as birth control (I mean, apart from that’s technically what it is). After pointing out that these straw women who rush off to planned parenthood every couple of months for an abortion because they were too hepped up on sex to remember to take their BCPs or get condoms are probably not the responsible sort of people who should be having lots of kids, she had to square her moral posturing against reality, and she had to concede that I had a “good point.”

Comment #22: Mighty Ponygirl  on  06/06  at  01:59 PM

(I should say for the record that I have no indication that my friends mom is actually racist, but even if she doesn’t think lovingly about all the adorable, adoptable white babies being aborted while recoiling at the thought of a poor black women having a dozen or so babies—it’s not hard to scratch the surface of most anti-choicers and come up with that sentiment)

Comment #23: Mighty Ponygirl  on  06/06  at  02:02 PM

Dems/progressive organizations need better media strategy. You still have a huge population of Americans who believe that partial-birth abortion even exists. Misinformation is one of their cornerstones.

Comment #24: BeanS  on  06/06  at  02:05 PM

BeanS—it’s worse than that, because, like my friend’s mom, there’s no critical thinking, it’s just laziness. People are all-too-willing to picture a woman 8 months pregnant swanning into her doctor’s office and declaring that she wants to fit into her bathing suit for summer. People don’t think about the realities of the situation when late-term abortion is performed and how it can be the salvation of families. We’ve allowed the right-wing to paint women as a bunch of vulgar, amoral monsters. We need to be more forceful on calling them on their hatred.

Comment #25: Mighty Ponygirl  on  06/06  at  02:12 PM

BeanS:

It’s got to start with us. No one is listening to the progressive side except for the rare Barney Frank and Al Franken.

Comment #26: BrianX  on  06/06  at  02:19 PM

Exciting news, everyone: Despite his Google problems, Rick Santorum is announcing his run for President today.

Well, Republican smears have already stained American politics beyond hope of cleansing.  I urge all good Republicans to get behind Santorum’s effort, pushing with all their might no matter how tight his policies might be.

(I figured I better get the puerile innuendo (*) in before we had to suffer MikeEss’s pitiful efforts)

(*) Innuendo. Heh heh heh.

Comment #27: Phoenician in a time of Romans  on  06/06  at  02:28 PM

#14 caren-sun-blocker,

Yeah no Catholic hospitals. They want to put religion first and health care second in the diverse publics time of need. They are sorely inadequate and should be cited and disbanded for that. Who wants to be airlifted to a catholic hospital (perhaps the only or nearest one) after being gang-raped only to discover they wont give you Plan B to prevent a pregnancy from that trauma? Who wants to be sent to the Catholic hospital when one needs a life-saving abortion only to find that no one on the staff knows how to perform one and no one wants to approve of it because they worry about being ex-communicated? They act like mafia.

Comment #28: BeanS  on  06/06  at  02:35 PM

If anybody has the slightest chance of whupping Obama in 2012, it is Foghorn Leghorn.

Here’s why: Despite the fact that he is a self-centered, sexist, loud-mouthed, redneck asshole, he has a mesmerizing gift for gab. He is also an anthropomorphic chicken. And if its one thing that the GOP has stridently ignored in all its craziness, it is equal rights for imaginary cartoon characters.

If a blob of protoplasm falls under the jurisdiction of the right for life, then so does Tweety Bird, Charlie Brown and Garfield. How are they any less real? And they are already loved by millions of people.

Comment #29: MHF  on  06/06  at  03:06 PM

” This is why a grassroots movement of women is needed.  How do you start that?  I wish to fuck I knew!”

Suggestion: Talk to the women who fought for legal abortion in the first place, back in the 60s and early 70s. And those who worked to provide abortion before it was legal, like Jane. (The Story of Jane is a good read, btw).

I sit between the second and third wave feminists in age, and IMNSHO there’s been way too much divisiveness between the two generations which has seriously undercut the feminist movement as a whole. I’d suggest the time is past when we can afford those kind of divisions as a movement. We need to learn from the people who’ve been there…and instead of arguing that “their” movement wasnt racially balanced, or overlooked the issues of gay and lesbian people, wasn’t “sex positive” enough, we need to *listen* to how they managed what they did. Certainly, we can address shortcomings in how we approach things, but speaking as someone who grew up in the “Mad Men” 60s and the “Free Love” 70s, there is no arguing that the impact of second wave feminists on the status of reproductive rights, and women’s rights in general, was enormous. Perhaps we can, on both sides of the wave, stop pissing amongst ourselves and try to figure out *why* they were as successful as they were.

Comment #30: Broce  on  06/06  at  03:21 PM

And as if Citizens United wasn’t bad enough, now corporations are allowed to donate directly to candidates.  Say goodbye to any semblance of politicians who aren’t wholly owned corporate subsidiaries.

The Culture Wars are simply a distraction promoted by Republicans so that voters on both sides of the issue have something else to focus on.

Progrocker @6

I envision current US life as a T graph.  Below the bar we have the left and the right fighting the culture wars, and above the bar is the plutocracy, who have no allegiance to anything but their money, tossing crumbs down to keep us entertained, you know, so we don’t pay attention to what they’re doing.

Comment #31: NobleExperiments  on  06/06  at  03:53 PM

And fucking Obama has remained silent on this. Go fuck a chainsaw, all of them.

Comment #32: pitbullgirl65  on  06/06  at  05:07 PM

BeanS, where did you think the mafia lerned how to act?

Broce, my mother was one of those feminists.  Now that she is in her sixties, she has gone fundie and spouts some of the most outrageous stuff, without even thinking about it.  In her case, she was always a little prone to following the woo, but also, she got tired.

Comment #33: helen w. h.  on  06/06  at  05:13 PM

#34. helen w. h., I can understand her tiredness, if not her fundieness. I’m 52. I’m freaking god damned tired of fighting the same battles over and over again.

Way back in the early 80s, I worked for Planned Parenthood, and part of my job was to read through a lot of political stuff, newspapers, etc. In 1981, I started yelling about what the Right was planning, right down to the anti contraception stuff. Everyone thought I was bonkers. “They’ll never threaten Roe, it just won’t happen.” Well…here we are 30 years later. Yeah. I’m tired. A lot of us are. But if we don’t keep fighting, we’ll lose.

Comment #34: Broce  on  06/06  at  05:18 PM

I tend to the Thomas Frank kinda strategy. It’s a lot easier to talk cultural conservatives into voting for the Dems for economic reasons, in spite of their views on abortion, than it is to get them to change their views on abortion.

That would probably require the Democrats to actually turn on and start attacking the people in Obama’s Treasury Department, though. Rhetorically hanging a few bankers ought to go a long way toward channeling some resentiment the other way.

“The brutal part of all of this is that Obama team’s economics are so godawful that we’re really being presented with a choice between the people who want us to not be able to get a job, and the people who want us to die.  That’s not an awesome choice.”

I don’t know if that will work, but a lot of people were Democrats for a long time because FDR gave them the sense that government was trying to have their best interests at heart in running the country. Maybe the Obama team might want to try that?

Comment #35: witless chum  on  06/06  at  05:33 PM

When was the last time someone who was voted out of office got elected President next?

Comment #36: Crissa  on  06/06  at  05:52 PM

NobleExperiments@32:

Part of the problem is that the stuff we fight over in the Culture Wars often makes a palpable difference in ordinary people’s lives.  Women’s lives are substantially improved when they have free and open access to BC, family planning and abortion.  LGBT people’s lives are better when they don’t have to live in fear, and when they can marry the people they love.  In some ways the Culture Wars are easier battles to win than the bigger one’s against the warfare state, corporate plutocracy, environmental degradation, and so on, because though the monied interests enjoy the distraction that the culture wars create, they aren’t invested in any particular outcome.  They just need everyone to continue to look the other way.  So we do need to keep fighting back in the hopes that we might convince all the conservatives and reactionaries that human rights are not negotiable or open to restrictions, and that if they don’t like someone else choices or existence, they can SHUT THE FUCK UP about it.

Ok, I think I got all the rage out for the time being.

Comment #37: progrocker  on  06/06  at  05:57 PM

Comment #6: progrocker on 06/06 at 11:02 AM

So your solution is… What?

You just said that aside from culture wars, Democrats and Republicans are the same, right?

Do you have empirical evidence for this?

Comment #38: Crissa  on  06/06  at  05:59 PM

Comment #36: witless chum on 06/06 at 05:33 PM

Do you know the names of Obama’s nominees, and which ones were confirmed and which were blocked by Republicans?

It’s this ignorance that lets you believe one is the same as the other, when in fact, they aren’t.

Comment #39: Crissa  on  06/06  at  06:03 PM

#31 broce,
Yeah I liked your idea. I’ve been reading about it and I really think they need better media strategy. Those that oppose abortion either do for religious or punishment reasons that arise from stereotypes. The latter is usually held among your everyday type and its not a very good or well thought out foundation. Realistically speaking do these people know what would happen if we didnt have legal abortion in regards to legally investigating abortion (forced vaginal ultrasounds which cant tell between miscarriage or abortion), treating women like second-lass citizens, rape and child custody, access to abortions for health/death reasons, investigating every miscarriage, how many things can cause abortion, contraception ect, ect? Alot of the latter are unsure about the actual “pro-life” argument which is that its murder (which is absurd). They need to see their hypocrisy. “Pro-lifers” put more emphasis on blastocysts than they do on real children, babies or adults. Shouldnt that alone put off a signal in their heads? They need to know who these activists are and their views on women (ex. Operation Rescue believes women should be submissive to their husbands). Would they really prefer that their daughter die/receive injury from a back-alley abortion after handing over $1000 and being sexually assaulted rather than have a simple cheap procedure performed by a licensed doctor? You add that along with the fact that these people oppose contraceptive access, sex ed and innovations in contraceptions. They need to see the replys from actual “pro-life” people and how ‘out of this world’ they are in regards to realism on this subject. These are the same people who try to push creationism on everyone.

Comment #40: BeanS  on  06/06  at  06:12 PM

[Posted before realizing I left something out]

Hopefully, we can get enough people to come around on this stuff that we can start turning more of our collective attention to trying to solve the bigger problems we face.  Right now we’re fighting on so many fronts that our progress is slow.  But we are making progress.  Remember Ghandi:

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.

Right now, they are fighting us.

Comment #41: progrocker  on  06/06  at  06:12 PM

Not being married anymore, I hope they reverse that abomination that is Griswold.  Today, condoms, tomorrow….

Comment #42: Iam138  on  06/06  at  06:15 PM

progrocker @ 38;

I don’t think the idea is to give up on the “culture war” stuff, the idea is to make economics the centerpiece. Yes, the culture war stuff hurts real people. Do you know what hurts real people even more? Not having money.

Take almost any social justice issue: at bottom it will be an economic justice issue. Abortion and contraception cost money. If women had more money, health coverage, and more reasonable working arrangements fewer women would need abortions in the first place. Or take any form of discrimination, or sexual harassment: the best thing you could do is to get union protections in place, which would also help most of the white males. If we see the issues as fundamentally economic we take away the pretext for intergroup hostility and replace it with solidarity.

Comment #43: SomeGuy  on  06/06  at  07:03 PM

Oh heavens, Crissa, there’s a complete universe of difference between left and right.  And I agree, progrocker, that these issue are hugely important to real life humans.  I just meant that sometimes I get so bogged down in the swamp of the culture wars that it’s easy to forget who’s pulling the strings. 

It is vital that we win the culture wars (and we will…. progressives always do, eventually).  I didn’t mean to imply otherwise.  May I blame Monday?

Comment #44: NobleExperiments  on  06/06  at  07:12 PM

I don’t know if it makes any difference to the Mystery Engines® at Google, but as a civic duty whenever RS comes up on the news, I make it a POINT to go google “Santorum” and click on Dan Savage’s coinage, just to keep it up there in the ratings.

Comment #45: Eric_RoM  on  06/06  at  07:34 PM

Eric: Oh I’ve clicked on spreadingsantorum.com a dozen times today, just for the heck of it.

Comment #46: judybrowni  on  06/06  at  08:53 PM

@Crissa

Yes there is a difference between Democrats and Republicans, but considering the current situation, it isn’t as significant as it should be.  Right now, only the Green Party and a few Democrats are supporting truly liberal and progressive policies.  As for evidence, just look at how many Dems voted for the patriot act, and for extending combat operations in Libya.

@SomeGuy

I agree with all your points, but all these issues are tied together.  It will be much harder to guarantee equal employment conditions for men and women if we stop pushing for full reproductive rights for women, because we will have conceded to the wingnuts the idea that there are defined roles for men and women.

Comment #47: progrocker  on  06/07  at  01:40 AM
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