Next entry: Garry Marshall hates you
Previous entry: Friday Genius Ten "The Hill's Xmas Gift To You" Edition
After all the moving, etc., Marc and I decided that we really couldn’t do Christmas this year with family, and so had as close to a non-holiday as you get. We decided not to really do presents this year, because moving cost so much money, and the atheism and rather lackluster enthusiasm for traditions did the rest. We didn’t have a tree (I hate trying to rearrange around them and have never done a tree), just a cowboy Santa Claus my sister sent us. I did cook a big meal, on the grounds that there’s no time like the present to experiment, but the only even remotely traditional thing was the mashed potatoes, and even then they were sweet potatoes. I did end up participating in the grand holiday tradition of laying on my ass until I really couldn’t put off assembling that new thing that I got, but alas, it wasn’t a gift but shelving for my record collection that I had to buy because a small New York apartment means you don’t have room for records to be scattershot all over the living room.
But my relative non-participation shouldn’t be chalked up to hostility, when laziness is the better explanation. Which is why I agreed with this post by carr2d2 at Skepchick that the very few atheists who straight up want to boycott Christmas are misguided. Yes, it’s offensive that this national holiday is technically a religious one, and the handover of our entire society to it emboldens angry Christians to believe that non-Christians don’t count as much. But unfortunately, a boycott is the wrong way to go about it. But let’s look at the arguments for it boycotting Christmas, as described by carr:
Flynn’s argument, which appears to be shared by some of our readers, is a highly idealistic one, based on the idea that by going along with the holiday as it is, or even by celebrating an alternative holiday (Festivus, Newtonmas, Kwanzaa, etc.) a person helps to perpetuate a society in which Christianity is seen as the norm, and fundamentalism is tolerated. He views his refusal to participate as an act of consciousness raising. He hopes that letting people know that he doesn’t celebrate will reduce the arrogance he perceives in society’s insistence that everyone take part.
Carr fears that people will merely think of you as a crank or a weirdo, though:
In my opinion, you don’t win people to your cause by making yourself an alien. My philosophy is that people are more likely to respect your beliefs and listen to what you have to say if you show them that they can relate to you; that you are a regular person just like they are. Because of this, I think it is good to share in cultural holiday celebrations, especially ones like Christmas whose mainstream face is largely secular.
I will go a step further. I would say that when non-Christians either a) celebrate Christmas their own way or b) celebrate their own holidays that fall around Christmas as boisterously as possible, we are doing more than a boycott ever could to make Christmas a secular occasion, and therefore not a weapon of Christian dominance over the rest. The proof’s in the pudding; the people who claim there’s a “war on Christmas” mean that there’s a slipping of their right to feel superior to everyone else and their ownership of American society just because they are Christian. That’s why they get livid when they see the term “happy holidays”, which implies that other people have a right to have a holiday, and they won’t stand for it. And even those of us who enjoy Christmas itself, but not in the prescribed way, are considered a threat. Not much right now, because I don’t think the freaked out wingnuts are even much aware that people put up solstice trees or putting up ironic tree substitutes. (For years, I had a statue of a leopard that I would hang tinsel on and put presents under. It was smashed up in a move. A friend of mine does a Satanic Christmas tree, decorated exclusively with devils and skeletons, with red lights.) But as the practice of celebrating Christmas in your own, often secular way grows, then it’s sure to have an effect.
And plus, we should all stick it to Garrison Keillor, for writing this nasty essay, where he screeched about the nerve of Unitarians and Jews who think they have a right to write Christmas songs. To make his column even crankier, he lashes out at Ralph Waldo Emerson for rewriting “Silent Night” for his congregation, an incident that happened, in irreverent layman terms, a long fucking time ago. Has this been bugging Keillor his whole life, only to come out now in his cranky old age? Is he that desperate to find examples of people offending his delicate sensibilities that he has to reach that far into the past? Either way, it’s just a warm-up for what really offends him: Jews who wrote Christmas songs that have come to define the holiday.
This is spiritual piracy and cultural elitism, and we Christians have stood for it long enough. And all those lousy holiday songs by Jewish guys that trash up the malls every year, Rudolph and the chestnuts and the rest of that dreck. Did one of our guys write “Grab your loafers, come along if you wanna, and we’ll blow that shofar for Rosh Hashanah”? No, we didn’t.
Well, he’s fighting a battle that’s already been lost. Attacking Irving Berlin for writing “White Christmas” makes even less sense than attacking Ralph Waldo Emerson for rewriting “Silent Night”. “White Christmas” is a done deal. It defines the holiday more than a nativity scene now. We are all about Santa, snow, images of comfortable warmth in the home, presents, and yes, Rudolph. And that’s why it’s sort of silly for atheists to boycott the holiday, since something so secular and silly couldn’t have been better made for us. I’ll bet the first word that comes to most people’s mind when they think about what Christmas means to them is something like “love” or “family”, and not “Jesus”. And if they were to picture what Christmas looks like, it would probably involve, well, what I looked like at about 10PM last night: standing in my slippers over a piece of brand new furniture, screwdriver in one hand and glass of wine in the other, while we watched Christmas-themed episodes of “30 Rock”. Substitute “It’s A Wonderful Life” or “Elf”, and you probably have a scene that was going on in a majority of American households last night. Even on those few occasions in my life where church figured into Christmas celebrations, it was seen as a way to kill time before the big event, which was eating too much, opening presents, and then the inevitable setting them up and screwing around with your new stuff. Flinch at my bold materialism if you want, but don’t deny that you likely share it. Christmas mass, when I had to go, always felt to me like it was mainly there so that you could transition between the shopping mode to the eating-and-opening mode, with a little Jesus thrown in for the same reason that even adults who don’t believe in Santa Claus like Santa imagery. Because it’s tradition.
Secular Christmas won. Atheists should relish the victory and mull some wine. I understand that people that are from non-Christian religions might see it differently, but that’s because they have their own religious holidays to attend to, and Christmas has a different resonance in that context. But for non-believers? Screw it. We own this motherfucker just as much as the Christians. Peace on earth, y’all, and Disco Ball bless us, every one.
------
Registration is now required! We're still in the process of getting it all squared away, so for the moment don't forget to Login or Register using the links in the upper left menu before starting to write your comment.
Posted by
Amanda Marcotte on 09:51 AM •
Permalink
Thanks Amanda! Our 18 year old son was asking me about our “non traditions” the other day. We laughed about them and I told him when he was older and married, he’d probably have some splainin to do to his wife about his idiosyncratic traditions.
Frankly, I just hope he doesn’t get involved with some crazy christian girl. Raised as he has been, it may not be likely, but being in South Texas (as you are now formerly aware) there’s often not a lot of other choices.
As happy heathens, we can only do what we do to fight the light.
I can’t agree more. A friend at my lab asked me if I even did anything on Christmas, seeing how hostile I was to christianity. I told her that as far as I was concerned, Christmas is the holiday where you celebrate a fat man handing out presents, where you sit around a tree give gifts to family members and catch up with one another. So Garrison Keillor can suck my left one, he doesn’t own Christmas, and I’ll do whatever I want on the 25th.
If Keillor wants to attack the real source of our Christmas imagery, he should be going after Clement Moore.
What we should Garrison Keillor is, How do you think the Pagans felt when Christians took over their Saturnalia? Christians have no basis for their complaint, seeing how their moving Christ’s birth from the day it actually occurred to the Solstice which seemed good marketing.
I, too, am generally apathetic about all things holiday, but we have taken to decorating for Christmas (and leaving it all up for months) because it’s kind of gloomy in Philadelphia during the winter and we both like pretty lights. Plus, I found a gigantic bright blue fake tree last year, so our living room looks a lot like whoville.
We try to keep lights up somewhere all year long.
And we have the same disco ball ornaments pictured above on our tree as well. Spiffy.
Pointing out how much of our “traditional” Christmas music has been written by Jewish composers has been a longtime source of amusement for the sort of banal columnists that Garrison Keillor exemplifies, and his speculative Rosh Hoshanna couplet it pretty funny, but once you start frothing at the mouth in indignation about Ralph Waldo Emerson, you’ve crossed the line into “crank.”
I guess I “boycott” Christmas. I don’t give presents. My family is across the continent, and I would much rather travel at some time when there is a lower change of delays, and fewer inexperienced travelers. (I usually visit in May and/or October—my hobby is nature and wildlife photography, and these are the best times to visit their part of the country for photography.) I give gifts to family and friends when I see something appropriate, and I don’t wait for a date on a calendar.
I’d much rather work on December 25, and get an extra day of paid vacation during the year when I can use it to better effect. (A big part of this is the very limited number of vacation days we get in our jobs.)
Maybe I am just giving the right fodder, but I am a non-Christian who freakin’ hates Christmas. I hate all those annoying songs, I hate all those “December to Remember” ads hocking Lexuses (LExi?), I hate lights, I hate stupid sweaters with reindeer on them, I HATE Santa and the whole rigamarole around “oh noes! should we tell our kids that he’s not real??” Sometimes I feel bad that I’m so grinchy, but to me Christmas is just this super WASPY holiday that portrays an unrealistic notion of what happiness and family-time is supposed to look like. And the holiday includes no spicy food--yuck. I am ecstatic that we’ve exited the holiday season, and are no win ordinary time.
I guess ironic celebrations could be fun, but it’s much more natural to me to just boycott all the yuckiness of the holiday and watch Bad Santa instead. Still, I recognize that boycotting Christmas is a ridiculous, kill-joy endeavor. I just can’t help it!
For those who deny that New York is the center of the universe, just remember that just about all of this holiday’s traditions were invented in New York. That includes our concept of Santa Claus, which was revived by the Washington Irving Society after the Dutch Sinterklaas tradition had died out.
ps, I don’t much like New York.
I hate all those “December to Remember” ads hocking Lexuses (LExi?)
Everyone hates those ads.
T-ster, you need to get hip to the New Mexican version of holiday food: tamales and posole smothered in red and green chile, a side of caldillo, maybe a couple of chile rellenos, and a bizcochito thrown in for good measure.
In the first place, Amanda, if you’ve ever listened to Keillor, you must realize that the article you linked to is pure satire. In the second place, I’m having a tough time telling whether or not your piece is as well. I’m sure you are correct that those who want to abolish Xmas are a tiny minority of atheists, so why bother writing a column about their admittedly uber-marginalized views? I mean, does anyone who isn’t a Xtian or a Xmas-hating atheist really give two tugs of dead dog’s dick how or whether to observe Xmas?
If you take all the mythical sky fairy worship out of christmas it is a pretty good time, either time off from work or extra pay depending on your job. The problem with the holiday is you usually have to spend time with people(your family) that in many cases you wouldn’t to talk ever, if you weren’t related to them. But sometimes you can really see why ancient pagans liked having a winter festival.
In the first place, Amanda, if you’ve ever listened to Keillor, you must realize that the article you linked to is pure satire.
Do people not know what satire is anymore? Either that, or “satire” is being used here in an attempt to sound more credible than asking, “What’s wrong, Amanda, can’t you take a joke????”
I get the impression that Keillor frequently tries to accomplish “jocular mocking,” but his end result is all-too-frequently “cranky indignation.” He has done this before with gay marriage where he tried to pull of a sort of jocular, “heh heh heh, but who would be the wife?” sort of thing, but he wasn’t able to hide his ultimate contempt for the idea.
#12-
Satire? Which part? Keillor was certainly one of the masters of the dry, satiric criticism but note the “was”. His more recent ventures in such areas have mostly fallen flat.
And again, which part was satire? All of it? So Keillor really think Summers is a genius? And “Elites” really more than idiot savants?
If this ham handed op ed from Keillor was meant as satire it was exceptionally poorly written at best (like most of Keillor’s books). Keillor was, at one time, a brilliant monologist and story teller, even that’s mostly become a game of him sending up himself to an audience who mostly isn’t listening to the words as much as being lulled into a stupor from Keillor’s monotone whisper.
All of which is to say, it’s time for Keillor to STFU and sit down.
I agree with Amanda. I think we subvert the existing establishment by taking and making it our own rather than trying to boycott it loudly. The only exception I would include is shopping. In the last few years my family and I have drastically changed the way to we shop and how much we shop for the holidays. I’ve noticed a lot more people talking about making presents and buying things made locally. I think that’s a big improvement over the annual migration to the mall.
I do think Amanda is right. I think rather than declaring war on anything (an idiotic and over-used phrase) we do best by taking the holiday and making it what we want it to be in a myriad of different forms.
Well jjcomet, if it is satire, it is astonishingly bad satire, and it follows in the footsteps of a number of other cranky, mean columns that Keillor has written that could also, at best, be considered badly failed satire. It makes a hell of a lot more sense to just take him at face value: Garrison Keillor is being cranky and mean for real. This isn’t all that surprising; he’s a comedian, yes, but he is a comedian who wants to be taken Very Seriously. Throw in his well-known reputation as a big jerk, and there’s no reason to think that he’s trying to be satirical here.
As for Christmas, it’s been a big fun party for my entire life, with family and presents and booze, and I see no reason to stop partying just because I don’t believe in God or Christ anymore. Of course, the very secular nature of my family’s celebrations, going way way back, did a lot to make that easy. So yes, we’ve won, when cranky atheists like me don’t even need to change the way we party on Christmas in order to feel perfectly comfortable.
As for food, no, none of it is spicy, and I like spicy food. But I don’t eat spicy food for most of my meals, so I don’t see any harm in Christmas being the same. There are 364 other days in the year for spicy food, and it just wouldn’t be right on Christmas. I guess that means that I, too, am caught in the crushing grip of tradition, but I can live with that. I’m a middle-class Irish-British-Jewish Northeasterner, that is, incredibly normal in these parts (my family lives in the Greater Boston area). I’m okay with that.
Yeah, Secular Christmas is the holiday most celebrated in America, which is why the fundies are screaming bloody murder about how they are the only ones to own Christmas. It’s the same with marriage in a lot of ways. Marriage has always been a secular affair and these days most people see the Church part as either something to do for family or a weird anachronism. Few people see the “religious blessing” aspect as actual critical or meaningful or definitional of the celebration and Santa and the Easter Bunny are the equivalent memorable and meaningful mythological characters from Christmas and Easter.
The fundies also want a sleight of hand so that one buys the other part of their framing which is that they owned these holidays and then they were taken away, which doesn’t really sell all that well when you note how the “Christian” holidays were all blanket takeovers of popular festivals in countries the Church was trying to take over from the inside or outside. Jul in the nordic regions, Saturnalia in Rome, Eostre in the british isles.
Yeah, I also like celebrating them and reminding the fundies that the holiday is not theirs and further was never theirs thanks to their complete lack of an original thought. So they can butt out of Secular Christmas, festival of family and consumerism, Secular Easter, festival of chocolate and distracting children for a few hours, and marriage, celebration of two people who love each other and are seeking a ceremony of recognition. Just as they have long “lost” Valentine’s Day (back to a proper celebration of sex) and St. Patrick’s Day (now just Irish pride, specifically celebrating the Celtic aspects that Patrick tried to eliminate in genocide).
Sometimes I feel bad that I’m so grinchy, but to me Christmas is just this super WASPY holiday that portrays an unrealistic notion of what happiness and family-time is supposed to look like. And the holiday includes no spicy food--yuck. I am ecstatic that we’ve exited the holiday season, and are no win ordinary time.
I’m not a christian either anymore (although I was raised Catholic), but I absolutely love Christmas. It is what you make of it. Skip all the religious stuff, and the secular bits are lots of fun.
Also, around here we have the traditional Christmas Curry for dinner instead of the usual stuff. I started that “tradition” after I got married, because the husband is Sri Lankan and was raised Hindu, so Christmas isn’t really on his cultural radar. But since I love the holiday and I express love through food, I wanted to incorporate his food into my holiday. So yesterday we had crab curry with rice, poori, dahl, drumsticks (a kind of vegetable--I don’t care for it, but he loves it and we can get them frozen), eggplant, fried plantains, and gulab jamun. We don’t always have crab, because I can’t get them here and we have to get them frozen in Toronto when we visit his sister and then back across the border, and sometimes the border guys take them, but I’ve done chicken, shrimp, fish, and tofu in the past.
“Christmas is the joy of getting all you can while the getting is good.” - Sally Brown
My Christmas rounds involved a Goth Christmas tree (complete with crucified doll in place of a star), an exciting stop-over at “Christmas with tattooed Jews” celebrated with vegan Chinese food, a very hungover Catholic mass (complete with a “war on Christmas” homily that made the whole family groan), overeating that would make Saturnalia-celebrants proud, Ikea furniture, marijuana hidden in stockings, and a pick-up snowball fight that lasted about 2 days in all.
If we’d been aiming to appropriate an obnoxious consumerist institution with built-in Christian wank-fests, I think you could have picked out points that indicated both success and failure. But if the goal was “spend time with the family you actually like on one of the few mandated days-off of the year,” I think it qualified as a victory.
The problem with the holiday is you usually have to spend time with people(your family) that in many cases you wouldn’t to talk ever, if you weren’t related to them.
Projection!
Just teasing, as I’m in a somewhat similar boat… but keep in mind, there are actual human beings who do actually like their families and don’t all consider it burdensome to associate with them. I’m a bit ambiguous - I’d be pretty bummed if I didn’t have any of my family in my life, but at the same time, I like them a lot more when it’s in smaller doses.
As for Christmas… loved it as a kid, not such a fan anymore. Not really because of it’s religious ties, just that I don’t like all of the expectations that get placed upon the season.
That… and fuck winter. I hate the goddamned Midwestern cold so much. I’ll be in a better mood again when pitchers and catchers report.
I hate stupid sweaters with reindeer on them
Even people who wear those hate them, I think. They’ve successfully moved into the camp family, as well, fwiw. Even non-hip people have ironic Christmas sweater parties now.
If you want to measure how secular something is, look to Japan. For example Japan celebrates of Christmas with Santa and presents despite being a non-Christian nation. They also celebrate Valentine’s Day. And have adopted western style “church” weddings (which makes less sense than the previous two, but whatever).
Also, at what Ticky said, in Texas and much of the Southwest, spicy food is a part of Christmas. Traditional tamales on Christmas Eve is something I miss sorely.
In the first place, Amanda, if you’ve ever listened to Keillor, you must realize that the article you linked to is pure satire.
I’m aware of how this is the excuse he hides behind whenever he writes a blatantly reactionary piece. I am not required to play along.
At our house, it’s almost always been watching some form of Scifi or drama with dead bodies/mysteries. So this long weekend is sort of devoted to Babylon 5, Castle, Space Truckers (Dennis Hopper as a gypo trucker; don’t ask).... And, oh yeah, you’re so right about the eating too much and the wine while assembling whatever; every year almost.
In my opinion it’s a failed attempt to make the dark, hopeless dead of winter feel good. The Christmas concept came clear in my own mind when I fell for the carnival trap in Quebec City one February. A frozen, impassable tundra of a town with a smiley face painted on it. Life hands you lemons and you try to make lemonade, I guess. Often you end up with just lemons.
What frosts my ass, so to speak, about the holiday season is the locked-down feel of public life during December. Nothing is open or available; nobody responds. Even a trip to the grocery store is fraught. Don’t I want working people to have time to spend with their families (of choice)? You betcha. Generous paid vacations spaced through the year. Many would prefer to be together during May or October, as James said upthread.
That said, of course Amanda is right about who owns the silly thing. I’d sell it for a nickel; I wish it didn’t exist; but it’s ours as much as it’s Keillor’s.
The problem with Keillor isn’t so much that he might be some kind of sneaky stealth bigot. It’s that decades ago he made up one vaguely funny joke, and it’s not fucking funny anymore.
Fire crackers. I seem to remember firecrackers for Christmas in both Texas and California when I was a kid. And picy food. And pinoche.
I don’t completely disagree with the idea that we should take pride in a victory of sorts, having pissed off the religious right. None the less, even a very secular Christmas is not for everybody. I’m surprised no one has mentioned the extremely corporate aspects of it. After all, it wasn’t atheists who ruined it for the religious folks, it was the department stores.
Christmas, and all the look-alike holidays, are a disgusting orgy of greed, gluttony and materialism. Sorry, but even atheists have values, and I just don’t care to indulge.
ks, your holiday meal sounds delicious. Sri Lankan food is super yummy.
I still feel like Christmas is a holiday (at least here in the US) that doesn’t wholly belong to ethnic people. Even all the secular traditions stripped of their Jesus-related connotations, feel very Anglo to me, and so part of culture that I very much don’t feel part of. Maybe I’d like Christmas in Ecuador or Nigeria or something.
Unree, a lot of Europe can be that way in August, I’ve heard. Inconvenience chaps me, too, but I think it’s probably good for my soul to be inconvenienced that way. God knows it’s hard for me to convince myself to just chill out for a day; being forced to is sometimes helpful.
Generic disdain for “materialism” seems overly simplistic more and more to me. It’s very close to the Christian strategy of saying everyone’s a sinner, so everyone should be in a permanent state of guilt that only can be soothed by giving the church money and submitting to its authority. If a material good gives joy and pleasure, that’s authentic. Our hostility to pleasure is one reason it feels right to simply oppose “materialism” while guiltily indulging. But I refuse to apologize; my iPhone makes me very happy. It’s not that this means that I don’t have deeper sources of joy---but then again, you have to ask what “deep” even means. Most anti-materialist sentiment would accept that enjoying art is a “deeper” pleasure, but that’s exactly what I use my iPhone to do. They would accept that love of others is a deeper pleasure, one that can be fed by....calling your mom when you can’t see her in person. Being engaged in the world may not always be a pleasure, but it’s a responsibility, and one that reading news and blogs on the hated little symbol of materialism helps me accomplish.
And that’s the problem with it. It’s easy to hate on empty status symbols, sure. I think empty status symbols are bunk. But a lot of what gets dismissed as “materialism” gives pleasure for reasons that most would accept are legit: art, escapism, connection to others, aesthetic pleasure. And often the dividing lines against acceptable consumption and frivolous consumption have a whiff of sexism, to make the whole thing more complex. Collecting shoes is often considered the height of evil materialism. Why is that singled out more than collecting DVDs, comics, or other things that provide similar aesthetic pleasures? Well, few men are shoe collectors, you know.
Not that you, whatever, are leaning on the sexist arguments. Not at all. But I’m just ranting; I don’t really think that enough thought is given to why it’s just assumed that “materialism” is a bad thing. Giving someone a gift they really want and can use is a genuine pleasure. The problem of Christmas stems from the requirement that we give even if we aren’t capable of anticipating the recipient’s desires.
I think what irritates me the most about people who complain about Jews writing Christmas songs is that few, if any, of them know a damn thing about the real-world historiography of Christmas music.
The tune to “Hark the Herald Angels Sing” was written by Felix Mendelssohn (Jew) as part of a cantata celebrating the invention of the printing press. You can’t get much more Jewish-secular than that. Irving Berlin’s “White Christmas” is practically a violent fundamentalist anthem by comparison.
It’s Dec. 26.
Christmas is over. At last.
Can we talk about something else, pretty please?
Amanda, I didn’t mean to suggest that we throw away all of our modern conveniences and retreat into caves. It isn’t materialism so much I object to, but the overboard celebration of it. Please keep your iPhone if it makes you happy. But does your iPhone really need its own national holiday?
My complaint stems in large part from the fact that I have a child in elementary school. I watch the kids go crazy every Halloween and Christmas, encouraged by their parents and by the public school, and it is just sad to see.
I believe this is due to deliberate policies of large corporations, and of the government. I don’t know what percentage of the GDP is represented by holiday shopping, but it must be huge. The economy would crumble if people celebrated reasonably - not boycotted, just acted rationally and reasonably.
My sister, her boyfriend, my Dad, my brother and I all watched “Look Around You” last night.
It was fun.
Giving someone a gift they really want and can use is a genuine pleasure. The problem of Christmas stems from the requirement that we give even if we aren’t capable of anticipating the recipient’s desires.
I lloooovvee gift shopping, and I love gift wrapping, and I love the sight of wrapped gifts so much I’ll happily wrap empty prop boxes for under the tree. But sometimes I avoid giving certain things, even when they’d be appropriate or welcome, because certain gifts give off that “Here’s a little something to let you know I spent the requisite amount of money on you.” For example, virtually everything at Bath and Body Works. I hate giving those things as much as I hate receiving them. But even then, it often boils down to personal preference. Some people hate giving gift cards for that reason, but I’d rather receive $10 in the form of an iTunes card than a Christmas-themed bottle of body wash. So yeah, the “required” gifts are definitely the worst part of shopping. I’’d more happily drive two hours to get the perfect gift than I’d drive 10 minutes to Overpriced Candle Store, even though I know many women who really like overpriced candles.
It’s really huge; the reason that the day after Thanksgiving is called Black Friday is that if you don’t go into the black by then, you probably won’t for the year.
My point is that the way capitalism controls our society is sad. But the least effective, less humanitarian way to attack it is to guilt people about either loving material goods, or yes, even celebrating them.
When I was a kid I hated Christmas because I was bored. I had few Jewish friends, so no one was available for a play date and there was nothing to watch on television. I remember my parents renting a VCR for one of our birthday parties, so that certainly wasn’t a household item until I was a teenager. It was whatever seven channels came in with the rabbit ears, and that included Catholic mass on at least one, possibly more, channels. So from Christmas Eve until Christmas evening I had to play with my siblings, or sometimes cousins who lived nearby would come over.
As an adult, I love Christmas. A couple of times I’ve done a project at the synagogue Christmas morning. Sometimes we go to the movies and run into lots of my parents’ friends and their kids. Best of all, though, it’s a relaxing day at home. Yesterday we played games on the Wii that we bought recently (but not specifically for any holiday), watched a movie at home, and made latkes even though Hanukkah is over. We were going to have blueberry pancakes but we were in a latke mood.
We managed to get our respective families to gather in the same place on Xmas Eve, so they could pass our daughter around like a fruitcake and we could go swim laps together. It was awesome. Xmas Day was pot brownies with friends, takeaway Chinese and a “Bones” marathon. Even better.
We probably know five or six people who are actual believing Christians, and all of them are perfectly well aware that Xmas is an appropriation of winter-solstice festivals. One of them is really quite conservative but in the old-fashioned way of being personally conservative rather than a hectoring scold, and when we asked whether she was offended by our heathen ways, she laughed and said that it was she who was the minority and could she please have one of those delicious-looking brownies?
“I don’t know what percentage of the GDP is represented by holiday shopping, but it must be huge. The economy would crumble if people celebrated reasonably - not boycotted, just acted rationally and reasonably.”
Comment #37: whatever on 12/26 at 02:31 PM
Spot on. That’s the reason “Black Friday” is called what it is—for many (most?) retailers, it’s when their annual operations kick over from losing money (in the red ink) to making it. No Qwimas, no profit; no profit, bankruptcy; enough bankruptcies, economic crumble (unless you’re a big / connected enough bank, I-bank, or insurer).
I also seem to recall having heard that 1/3 of all retail $ are spent in Qwimastime shopping—though I’m less sure of that. (That said, I suspect many big-ticket purchases—like the Lexi referred up-thread—would have been bought anyway, tho’ p’raps at different times of year.)
”even atheists have values”
Comment #31: whatever on 12/26 at 01:44 PM
I trust that was sarcasm.
This should be the last place that it has to be pointed out that atheists’ values are, if anything, of greater “worth,” since they’re determined by thought, analysis, experience, and discourse—and motivated by care and concern for the good of others, including non-human animal others, the world, the kosmos.
Doesn’t take a doctorate in Kohlberg to know that’s taking “values” a lot more seriously than merely following arbitrary tribal rules (or not-so-arbitrary, in that they benefit the ruling classes) and/or seeking to avoid punishment at the hands of Big Daddy Higher Powers.
Now, on to the next socially mandatory group-observance:
Happy New Year, all!
“My point is that the way capitalism controls our society is sad. But the least effective, less humanitarian way to attack it is to guilt people about either loving material goods, or yes, even celebrating them.”
Comment #40: Amanda Marcotte on 12/26 at 02:58 PM
First of all, I wasn’t suggesting a campaign to force everyone to do things my way. I was explaining why I prefer to not celebrate even a secular Christmas.
But more significantly, I wonder, what do you recommend as an effective, humanitarian way to attack the way capitalism controls our society? I would have thought that refusing to do as the ads tell us would be a good start.
I suggest by validating human needs and desires, and asking what are best ways to meet them. Sometimes, capitalism is better. I think technology is often better developed through capitalism. Sometimes socialism is better---think, transportation systems, libraries, health care. Sometimes material goods create environmental issues, and that has to be addressed. But to do so by making anti-materialism a virtue is doomed to fail. Especially since people don’t necessarily see much of their environmental damage as “materialism"---is it materialist to fly home for Christmas, to go to work every day? No.
All in all, discourse about materialism is not very solution-oriented. It’s about distracting from real solutions by substituting morality plays over who is better than who at self-denial.
For what it is worth my family celebrated a traditional Jewish Christmas yesterday. Chinese food, followed by a first run movies (Up in the Air which I recommend ).
I’d even argue that it’s easier to teach thrift if you validate the experience of being wowed by a commercial or the pleasure you get from a material good. I know I was better able to learn thrift by having my parents teach me to skip fleeting pleasures like candy and spend my money I’d saved on stuff I wanted.
Oh man, Keillor. I think he’s actually underrated as a storyteller/impressario, (even if a Prairie Home Companion isn’t everyone’s cup of tea) but for all the burnishing of his liberal bona fides he does, this kind of “satire” is a real disappointment. Nostalgia has long been his stock-in-trade, but he seems to be getting worse in recent years about pushing narratives of tolerance that treat pluralism like a favor the majority does for the minority. That’s even more objectionable when one of his common themes is that the Good Ol’ Days weren’t that good and are never coming back. He really ought to know better.
I’m aware of how this is the excuse he hides behind whenever he writes a blatantly reactionary piece. I am not required to play along.
Comment #25: Amanda Marcotte on 12/26 at 01:24 PM
Hey Amanda, I’ll agree, that piece does come off as ambiguous - but, less so if you actually listen to Keillor. For those who do listen to him, even reading him translates to hearing his voice and intonation - necessary, to getting it, IME.
Also, Keillor is an equal opportunity satirist. He satirizes both his background (staid conformist midwesterners) and his new milieu and audience (when he became - for at least a while - hip? or at least successful and “international cosmopolitan") Yeah, I’m inventing terms as I go here, so don’t attack. I think that sometimes he tries to do both in one piece, and those are the ones which fail, because we’re not able to make/see the switch as to which group is getting skewered as easily from the outside.
ks, your holiday meal sounds delicious. Sri Lankan food is super yummy.
I still feel like Christmas is a holiday (at least here in the US) that doesn’t wholly belong to ethnic people. Even all the secular traditions stripped of their Jesus-related connotations, feel very Anglo to me, and so part of culture that I very much don’t feel part of. Maybe I’d like Christmas in Ecuador or Nigeria or something.
Thank you. It was delicious. And the best part is, there are enough leftovers for today and probably tomorrow.
And I do agree with the rest of your comment, too. The whole Santa, presents, carols, tree, etc., is pretty mainstream and, in the media anyway, there aren’t too many “acceptable” alternatives presented. But I think that is changing. As the population becomes more diverse, people will get used to more and different traditions and the holiday will also get more diverse. And there will be much more blending of cultural traditions as well.
Because really, there’s no wrong way to have a celebration, and something needs to be done to liven up the winter months, which last for-fucking-ever and suck pretty royally around here (Great Lakes area).
My complaint stems in large part from the fact that I have a child in elementary school. I watch the kids go crazy every Halloween and Christmas, encouraged by their parents and by the public school, and it is just sad to see.
I believe this is due to deliberate policies of large corporations, and of the government. I don’t know what percentage of the GDP is represented by holiday shopping, but it must be huge. The economy would crumble if people celebrated reasonably - not boycotted, just acted rationally and reasonably.
Comment #37: whatever on 12/26 at 02:31 PM
Lockstep consumerist mentality - one of the many reasons - my kids are no longer group schooled. Guess that makes me anti-fish?
I have never liked Garrison Keillor.
As a child, I had a friend whose parents loved Keillor, so often if we were playing on Saturday, they would turn on NPR and my friend would run in to listen, so I was more or less conscripted into listening.
I did not enjoy them.
They made the insulting comment that I “just didn’t get the humor”
no. I get the jokes. I understand the verbal irony involved. I wasn’t fucking funny. There’s nothing to get. it’s shallow, dry, and uninspired.
saying “you don’t get it” as to why someone dislikes Keillor is as insulting as saying the reason one dislikes Carlos Mencia comes down to a lack of humorous sophistication.
In actually looking at the Keillor piece and knowing his shtick, its pretty obvious to me that it was written in jest. Its not especially funny or clever, but to take it at face value is a misinterpretation.
Hey now, lets not say things we can’t take back. Keillor may not always be funny but he’s way better than Mencia, who manages the double whammy of being unfunny and a plagarist.
I don’t understand why anyone likes Keillor, but that’s my curmudgeonly ways.
As Amanda said, you need only listen to the War on Christmas people and what they bitch about when they’re crying about the lack of PROPER RESPECT(tm) for Christmas. The things that they hate most, you need to do more of. They especially hate anyone else honing in on their territory and celebrating other festivals.
Instead of eradication, dilution is the best and most effective method to win this “fight”. Water the shit down. Bring in hundreds of alternative Christmases, flood the market!
I love that Chicago lights up Michigan avenue and the lights stay up through February-March. We need more light. When the sun starts to set at 2:30, you have to do something to keep from going nuts.
I do an awesome Christmas tree. It’s mostly red ribbons, santas, and animals. The star on top is a clear discoball surrounded by a gold star frame. It lights up, and there’s a cylander of differnt colored foils on the inside that spins when the lightbulb gets hot. It shoots faceted-colors all across the living room. My parents bought it for my 1st Christmas, so it’s a 43 year old psychadelic wonderpiece atop the tree.
I actually feel sorry for people who don’t do trees, b/c I enjoy the spectacle so much. I understand and respect that people have different traditions, but my discoball tree is a thing of happiness.
Just saw the coolest commercial on BBCA--Doctor Who’s TARDIS is stuck in the snow, so he snares some nearby reindeer and takes off, Santa style, and loop de loops the BBC logo. Awesome. Completely fitting to what the season truly is.
Amanda,
Although it’s not like I haven’t done it, but I’d recommend against the screwdriver in one hand and the wine in the other. Bad hangover—bad, bad hangover.
We have incorporated going to the movies into the Christmas tradition as have many others judging by the lines yesterday. Saw “It’s Complicated”—if you like Alec Baldwin as comic actor, it’s well worth seeing.
As for Garrison Keilor, the preciousness of PHC generally makes me want to fall asleep at the wheel or drive into a tree. Either way, it’s unsafe for driving. I’d rather have a screwdriver in one hand, wine in the other and steer with my knee.
We are all about Santa, snow, images of comfortable warmth in the home, presents, and yes, Rudolph.
When I was a kid (the 80’s) this is what the fundies were all worked up about, too much Santa and presents not enough Baby Geezus! They complained that Christians were targeted by corporations and that their holiday had been stolen by the secular world. So now the “War on Christmas” bullshit sounds like the same a-holes complaining that they aren’t getting targeted enough. Or, at least, that they aren’t the only ones being targeted, or some such nonsense.
This is one of the most convincing things I’ve ever read about celebrating Christmas. I almost wish you had written this a few weeks ago so I could appreciate have enjoyed this year!
Lockstep consumerist mentality - one of the many reasons - my kids are no longer group schooled. Guess that makes me anti-fish?
No, it just makes you someone who’s going to have poorly-adjusted children who will wish all their adult lives that they had been able to go to school and have Xmas like normal kids.
Homeschooling = Narcissism, in 99% of cases. And trust me: I’m a professor and I see what happens to homeschooled kids when they hit college. It’s most unpretty.
Traditional tamales on Christmas Eve is something I miss sorely.
THIS. The one thing I really missed about not being in New Mexico or TX with family this year.
Yeah, that said, I feel the exact same way about this holiday as T-ster.
I would never concede this holiday to the late-to-the-party jump for jesus crowd. As for Keillor, I’ve been listening for years, and am quite familiar with his *voice*. Still doesn’t make that piece work any better as satire, regardless of his intent.
Holy crap, I came to exact same realization just this week. Christmas means to me what I want it to mean.
No, it just makes you someone who’s going to have poorly-adjusted children who will wish all their adult lives that they had been able to go to school and have Xmas like normal kids.
This may come as a shock to you, but there are billions upon billions of people in this world who never had Christmas and don’t spend their adult lives wishing they had. Even more shocking, millions live in this very country and there’s a pretty good chance that scores of them are your colleagues.
Or maybe you’re not surprised to find out that these exotic creatures exist. You just feel that something’s not quite normal about them.
school, not Xmas, was the point. Oh, and bite me.
The only people who ever actually banned Christmas were Christians--the Calvinist Congregationalists who ran Scotland, to be exact. (Their counterparts in England, the Puritans, wanted to also, and may have actually done so in the New England colonies at one time).
The Scots therefore invented yet another new winter solstice celebration--Hogmanay.
Happy Xmas, Pandagonians! I miss you all!
I still can’t get online often enough to ever keep up with the threads. But Hai!
Keillor doesn’t like people telling him what Christmas is. Neither does anyone else.
This will not be solved so long as religion exists.
As a rule, the Jewish atheist and the Christian atheist in this household celebrate the holidays like crazy - not this year, granted (ill health), but usually. The big party we hold is called the Winter Festival of Your Choice party and all traditions are welcome. And I mostly use purple, and green and silver in my decorations, because those are my favorite colors. I collect Father Christmases and they’re everywhere with no baby Jesus to be found. It’s all about light in dark times, baby.
MKK
I’ll bet the first word that comes to most people’s mind when they think about what Christmas means to them is something like “love” or “family”, and not “Jesus”.
Which, given that Jesus was all about love and family, and really not known for being an attention whore, is probably a phenomenon he’d consider a success.
Hey Amanda, I’ll agree, that piece does come off as ambiguous - but, less so if you actually listen to Keillor. For those who do listen to him, even reading him translates to hearing his voice and intonation - necessary, to getting it, IME.
Oh, for fuck’s sake. See, this is a dangerous road to go down, because then you come across someone like me, who literally grew up listening to Garrison Keillor and who knows his “voice,” and who still thinks that this piece is, at best, a poorly executed and ill-conceived attempt at satire, and more likely is Keillor’s use of weak self-deprecation and false modesty to just act like a cranky old man without admitting that that’s what he is. This is what he’s been doing in print for years.
And keep in mind that, as I said, I grew up listening to PHC. I laughed at the jokes. I even enjoyed (forgive me, Disco Ball) The News From Lake Woebegon (though I tried reading Lake Woebegone Days last spring and couldn’t for the life of me figure out how such a dreadfully dreary and boring book is so acclaimed). To this day, if I flip the radio on in the car and PHC is on, I’ll happily tune in and listen to Garrison Keillor droning away on an advertisement for Beebop-A-Reebop Rhubarb Pie or, yes, The News From Lake Woebegon. The show has gone downhill, or my tastes have just changed, but it’s like comfort food for my brain.
But dammit, there’s a not-so-fine line between smart satire and just being a dick, even if you don’t mean what you’re saying. This is a lesson I learned in high school, for crying out loud. Keillor has absolutely no excuse.
Yeah Kyra, telling everyone that you’re the son of God and gathering disciples to yourself and all that stuff is not attention-whorish AT ALL. That “I am the way” stuff, he didn’t really mean it or anything.
At least Jews still think Christmas is a Christian holiday, according to an article in today’s NYT, featuring converts to Judaism who are leaving behind decorated trees, family feasts, stockings, snowmen, and Santas. Never mentioned is The Birth of the Redeemer, stables, swaddling clothes, virgins, shepherds, Magi, etc. etc. So new Jews have to fucking give up secular Christmas. What’s up with that?
Still echoing are volleys of letters to the editor in the SF Chron. A woman protested her building’s putting up a tree in their lobby, asking why the management was insensitive to non-Christians. Readers poured in, arguing that a dead evergreen was part of no one’s religion but the Druids’. And so on.
But for Christians who are tired of listening only to holiday songs about snow, chestnuts, and writing out greeting cards, rent The Bells of St. Mary’s, where Bing Crosby sings Adeste Fidelis at Christmastime, and O Sanctissima in May.
Which, given that Jesus was all about love and family
Which Jesus? Not the Jesus in the Bible, who told his followers that they should hate their families, and abandon them and follow him, instead. (Liberal Christians - you really need to read your Bible.)
Which Jesus? Not the Jesus in the Bible
No, the Jesus all the “Jesus is the reason for the season” crowd claims as their figurehead. Biblical accuracy optional and subordinate to marketability.
Most Christians are of the insistence that Jesus was all about love and family (even as many of them say “God hates/disdains/demands slavish obedience from with threats of eternal damnation [insert group here]” out of the other side of their mouths (and since when do any of them bother to notice the passages (such as the hate/abandon family one) that inconveniently contrast their holiday fluff and sap?).
Re: the attention-whore part, these same Christians will pretty much always agree that Jesus did it all to save the world’s people rather than for personal glory. (Although certainly he got that anyway, but more due to the effects of his followers than his own horn-blowing.)
Sorry---I meant the previous comment to be commentary on the general Christian public’s view of Jesus, and not to an objective claim about him myself. And mistakenly thought that came through in it, but apparently it didn’t.
My question for Keillor: Why do we need a whole season to observe the birth of the Savior? If the day is so special, then why not leave it at 24-25 December? Hell, I’ll throw in Boxing Day if los religiosos would just buzz off before and after. For Christ’s (ahem) sake, nothing in anyone’s religion precludes treating the rest of December as a regular working month, mmkay?
Amanda’s correct to say we in the U.S. have our own cloudy, inclement, annoying “aôut.” But that’s bad, and it’s got nothing to do with Jesus. I worry about an unemployed friend whose job search has been stymied since around Nov. 20.
Meant to say that even their Jesus wouldn’t complain, so why are they?
This Christmas I visited my family, adorned and honoured a cultic object, ate a sacrificial animal, and participated in gift-exchange aimed at least in part in strengthening communal bonds. This is what I’ve done every year since infancy. It is what the majority of the country (UK) does. It’s what my parents and grandparents did – though they didn’t have television so they also went to church for something to do and because cultural pressure was greater. It’s an ancient holiday filtered through cultural traditions that accrete over centuries. And I’m not going to stop calling it Christmas because I’m an atheist from a cultural Christian background any more than I’m going to start going into the office on Saturday simply because I don’t need the day off to sacrifice babies to Saturn, or refuse to write “Thursday” because that would be worshipping Thor.
Late December in northern Europe is cold, damp, and dark. Christmas, and not just the days, but a festival season, cheers it up. Ultimately that’s why it survives, because when it starts to get dark at half-past two (and that’s northern England, let alone further north) you need light and fire and green life to celebrate.
Interesting comments about virulent anti-consumerism. I have a lot of very left fb friends from the years I spent in the peace movement. Actually I’ve gotten rid of a lot of them, or they’ve gotten rid of me. But anyway, this is a big trait in the activist left. And it’s so sneering, and sometimes outright nasty. I have had to read through fb missives about “so-called” peace activists and their “meaningless consumerist lives”. More than I care to remember. I knew some of them were directed at me. From this one man in particular they defintely were.
And for a while, I did feel really guilty. I would be ashamed for desiring a nice handbag, or a pricey pair of boots. I like what Amanda wrote here about that.
“… and may have actually done so in the New England colonies at one time)”
Most defiantly yes
”The Scots therefore invented yet another new winter solstice celebration—Hogmanay”
And we New Englanders invented Thanksgiving for the same reason
It’s not satire. One defining characteristic of satire is that it is recognizable as satire. Keillor’s rant is, well, indistinguishable from a rant. If it’s supposed to be satire, it fails.
I’ve noticed that a lot of people think that simply writing a rant that they do not personally believe in and is indistinguishable from other rants somehow constitutes satire. I suggest such people read more Swift. To satirize an idea, it is insufficient to simply reiterate it.
nothing in anyone’s religion precludes treating the rest of December as a regular working month, mmkay?
Traditionally, the Christmas season started Dec. 25 and ran through Epiphany. Retailers needed to get shoppers to start thinking about buying Christmas presents, so they started the Christmas shopping season on Thanksgiving with the emblematic Macy’s parade. That meant pumping Xmas tunes throughout stores, decorated trees, and the Visit on Santa’s Lap photo-op.
Retailers are so out of touch with the traditional season that the card stores have already made the changeover to Valentine’s Day.
@Karpad: “I wasn’t fucking funny.”
Truer words never typed.
@RobW, Sushi No Gakusei: “Can we talk about something else, pretty please? “
Not until everyone’s shared their superiority over the unwashed masses.
For those who’re sick of the Keillor thing, check out CBC Radio’s Vinyl Café instead (podcast available from iTunes).
In terms of commercialism and guilt about overconsumption—AnglScarlett et al—Andrew Potter and Joseph Heath dissected the uselessness of “buy nothing day” type protests. Their point: Buying nothing is only half the equation; the other half is refusing to sell something, i.e. your individual labour that you sell to your employer (or, if you’re the employer, shutting down your business for a day, and so on.) Half-baked symbolic gestures don’t change things nearly as much as the dull, long-term work of fighting for greater social equity, equality, fairness and safety.
The problem is that the people who think of Christmas as a religious holiday tend to think of every aspect of it as overtly religious (not saying that there is any logical basis for this). So, since it is about Jesus for them, then everything they do is part of the religious holiday.
So when someone tries to tell them that things like evergreens, Santas, presents, carols, family dinners and all the rest are “secular” it doesn’t make any sense to them, because they “know” it is religious, regardless of how they actually practice it.
It’s the same thing with marriage being “a religious thing” that shouldn’t be “redefined.”
abo gato:
I told him when he was older and married, he’d probably have some splainin to do to his wife about his idiosyncratic traditions.
Ah, the assumptions, they start so early....
My question for Keillor: Why do we need a whole season to observe the birth of the Savior? If the day is so special, then why not leave it at 24-25 December? Hell, I’ll throw in Boxing Day if los religiosos would just buzz off before and after. For Christ’s (ahem) sake, nothing in anyone’s religion precludes treating the rest of December as a regular working month, mmkay?
Comment #78: Unree on 12/27 at 12:57 AM
Since Keillor didn’t say we need a whole season to observe the birth of the Savior, I’d direct my questions elsewhere.
If I read Keillor correctly, for him Christmas is part of his religion, so don’t tell him what Christmas is and don’t try to make it about Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer. He’s on the same side as those who don’t want to be inundated with Frosty the Snowman starting on Thanksgiving day.
The problem is that the people who think of Christmas as a religious holiday tend to think of every aspect of it as overtly religious (not saying that there is any logical basis for this). So, since it is about Jesus for them, then everything they do is part of the religious holiday.
So when someone tries to tell them that things like evergreens, Santas, presents, carols, family dinners and all the rest are “secular” it doesn’t make any sense to them, because they “know” it is religious, regardless of how they actually practice it.
Comment #87: Lymis on 12/27 at 02:10 PM
Keillor is very obviously not one of these, either. In fact, he’s saying that those things *aren’t* Christmas, and stop pissing on his leg and telling him it’s eggnog ho ho ho.
There’s a strain of religious thought that wants separation of church and state not because religion is worthless, but because it’s precious and should not be sullied by government or the marketplace.
Obviously you can’t put Keillor 100 percent in this camp, since he has Christmas stuff on his show. But he’s leaning in that direction, at least in this piece.
For what it is worth my family celebrated a traditional Jewish Christmas yesterday. Chinese food, followed by a first run movies (Up in the Air which I recommend ).
Haven’t seen it, but heard it’s decent. Had a couple of friends in it as extras (it was mostly filmed in St. Louis).
Kyra:
Which, given that Jesus was> all about love and family,
In which alternate universe did this happen? Or were Luke 14:26 and similar verses just snuck into the KJV by the commie librulz?
Oops, n/m, I see that that’s already been addressed upthread. Must not post while drnuk.
Traditionally, the Christmas season started Dec. 25 and ran through Epiphany. Retailers needed to get shoppers to start thinking about buying Christmas presents, so they started the Christmas shopping season on Thanksgiving with the emblematic Macy’s parade. That meant pumping Xmas tunes throughout stores, decorated trees, and the Visit on Santa’s Lap photo-op.
Hell, even going back to the days when the retail Xmas season began at Thanksgiving would be a drastic improvement over where we are today.
You can walk into just about any big box retailer in late September/early October nowadays and see them already hawking the fake plastic trees with lights on them - more than TWO MONTHS before the actual holiday.
We’ll all be better off--Keillor included-- when the holiday finally evolves to be called Xmas (pronounced ex-mass) and Santa takes his rightful role as a vengeful robot bent on destruction.
/futurama
Since Keillor didn’t say we need a whole season to observe the birth of the Savior, I’d direct my questions elsewhere.
Keillor implored the country to return to some purer, lost version of this holiday, which IMO requires capping it at less than six weeks.
Since Keillor didn’t say we need a whole season to observe the birth of the Savior, I’d direct my questions elsewhere.
Keillor implored the country to return to some purer, lost version of this holiday, which IMO requires capping it at less than six weeks.
Comment #95: Unree on 12/27 at 09:28 PM
Maybe I’m misunderstanding, but you seem to think that Keillor is a hypocrite in this respect, when in fact I think he would agree with your suggestion.
http://www.allbyer.com
Hi,Dear Ladies and Gentlemen,Here are the most popular, most stylish and avant-garde shoes,handbags,Tshirts, jacket,Tracksuit w ect...Nike Air Jordan(1-25)/Jordan Six Ring/Jordan Fusion/Nike Shox/Air Max/AF1/Dunk: $32
Polo/Ed Hardy/Lacoste/Ca/A&F;……T-shirt: Coach /Gucci/Lv/Ed Hardy/D&G;/Fendi ……Handbag:$35
Christian Louboutin/Lv/Ed Hardy/Gucci/Coach/Lacoste/ Timbland……Shoe :$35 True Religion/Coogi/Evisu/Ed Hardy/Prada ……Jeans:$30
New era/Gucci/Ed hardy ……cap : $13 Okely/Coach/D&G;/Fendi/Gucci/Armani ……sunglass : $15 Nike shoes: 32 $, True Religion jeans: 30 $, Ed Hardy, t-shirts: 12 $, NFL Jersey: 20 $, Boots UGG: 50… For details, please consult http://www.allbyer.com %$&6O;^u76u
The really funny thing (in both senses) is that what secularized Christmas (or, Xmas) was not atheism or an Xmas tune written by a non-believer. What did it was CAPITALISM, that very economic model worshiped by the very people who most loudly decry its effect on the holiday.
We own this motherfucker just as much as the Christians.
Preach it Amanda! I was raised a Buddhist, still am a Buddhist and we always celebrated Christmas. To me it’s not a religous holiday at all and never has been. Wasn’t the custom of the tree taken from Pagenism?
Had a nice, secular Christmas which included exchanging presents with my wife’s family, drinking whiskey, making and sharing different varieties of homemade pizza, watching the Mormon Tabernacle Choir, puzzling at the weirdness (and all-whiteness) of that, playing ping pong, switching over to the Michigan State children’s choir singing carols on a different PBS station, some light squabbling about politics and playing cards and dominoes.
Why should we change? They’re the ones who suck, as the quote goes.
Eh, getting into these comment threads about religion just ruffles me. Why hate religion? Because somebody said something stupid, other people took it as truth, and now you want to complete the cycle by hating them?
I’m indifferent to non-christians desires and needs as a religion because it isn’t my responsibility to help them celebrate and in turn I don’t ask them to help me. Course it doesn’t bother me if there are christmas trees up in the malls or if they just say happy holidays. These things don’t matter, internal respect and love are the required parts of our self.
Course, if it suits the rest of the people in this thread, demonize the worthwhile Christians in the same breath as the fundamentalists. There are plenty of good christians and catholics who don’t give a hoot about the “war on christmas” in fact my parish made a point to avoid making an issue of it because it doesn’t matter what OTHER people are doing. Only what WE do. That we of course is the group in church. We’re responsible to ourselves and needn’t worry about shoving it in others faces. Then again, I find the Atheists who insist on wearing it on their sleeves to be more than a bit annoying.
Homeschooling = Narcissism, in 99% of cases. And trust me: I’m a professor and I see what happens to homeschooled kids when they hit college. It’s most unpretty.
Comment #61: felagund on 12/26 at 05:43 PM
A professor? Really at what? crackerjack U? Because both the spouse and I happen to be professors at an institution where there are quite a few formerly homeschooled students, and many of those the offspring of my colleagues. All doing quite well, academically and socially.
I guess seeing your prejudice and bias smashed is an unpretty mess.
It’s not satire. One defining characteristic of satire is that it is recognizable as satire. Keillor’s rant is, well, indistinguishable from a rant. If it’s supposed to be satire, it fails.
I’ve noticed that a lot of people think that simply writing a rant that they do not personally believe in and is indistinguishable from other rants somehow constitutes satire. I suggest such people read more Swift. To satirize an idea, it is insufficient to simply reiterate it.
Comment #83: Whispers on 12/27 at 10:35 AM
To whom? There are many people who don’t realize that Swift is satire, or wouldn’t know irony if it jumped up and bit them. Not that I’m suggesting readers here fall into that ignorant group. Is it bad or too subtle satire or IMO too unfocused satire - quite probably.
But here’s the way I’m hearing/reading the piece - Keillor is a fencesitter between the two greener pastures - he satirizes his background - those conformist fundamentalist Christians, but then he also satirizes those who inhabit the world he jumped to and found to be lacking - those sophisticates who want both to celebrate and yet not participate in the conformity of celebrating.
Point the first - Charles Dickens is the person that took Christ out of Christmas.
Point the second - the Christmas fireworks thing started with the Southerners from the border counties of England/Scotland. They celebrated Christmas by shooting guns into the air (not unlike the Iraqis), and it transferred to the Southern US - see Hackett’s “Four British Folkways in America.”
keillor’s lost already. i saw more people lined up to see avatar on christmas day than i ever have at church. nothing says jesus’ birth like tall blue aliens
also, his post is pretty incoherent.
Nobody in Particular #88
Ah, the assumptions, they start so early....
Early, like at 18 years? That’s how old their kid is… though you did claim to be drunk later on
Page 1 of 1 pages
Commenting is not available in this weblog entry.
Thanks Amanda! Our 18 year old son was asking me about our “non traditions” the other day. We laughed about them and I told him when he was older and married, he’d probably have some splainin to do to his wife about his idiosyncratic traditions.
Frankly, I just hope he doesn’t get involved with some crazy christian girl. Raised as he has been, it may not be likely, but being in South Texas (as you are now formerly aware) there’s often not a lot of other choices.
As happy heathens, we can only do what we do to fight the light.