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Next entry: 19% premiums - a postscript Previous entry: Shorter Megan McArdle

If you can’t do it for the country, do it for yourselves

Ezra lays out the political realities for the Democrats to consider if they fuck up this health care bill:

Centrist Democrats know what happened last time a popular young president failed in a massive push to reform the health-care system and lost his high public approval in the process. A historic number of centrist Democrats lost their jobs. More than 50 of them, in fact. Liberals, conversely, kept their seats, because their seats are safe.

The central political reality of health-care reform is that if the bill fails, the vulnerable centrists who are queasiest about supporting it will be the casualties of its collapse.

Here’s a link to the Blue Dogs page!  I’m emailing them a link to this with the relevant passage highlighted.  I suggest you do something similar.  (Hat tip.)  I recommend you email them with your own, personalized spin on this. 

This really cannot be driven home to the Democrats enough. They already suffer from a media-and-somewhat-truth-based reputation of being total weiners, and rolling over on health care when they have a 60 member Senate majority and the House and the Presidency isn’t go to do much to overturn that idea.  For better or worse, the public doesn’t enjoy voting for weiners.  They may even enjoy voting for members of the party that were able to shut this down despite being shut out of power.  That’s not a rational reaction, of course, but no one said that voters were rational people. 

On a more serious note: The declining popularity of health care reform in the polls shouldn’t be taken as a reason to abandon it or weaken it.  People are enthusiastic about health care reform if they’re not dwelling on a bunch of right wing lies about it.  They were enthusiastic about it before the recess gave the nuts time to scare the public, and if they’re polled honestly about it, with educated questions instead of push polls, they still like it.  If health care reform passes and it’s not a bullshit bill, but a real attempt to address the issue, it’s not like the public will respond by saying, “Oh those Democrats made health insurance cheaper and more reliable! Fuck them!”  Well, except for the 25%-ers.  All these fears about Medicare, for instance, will evaporate once the bill is passed and Medicare turns out to be just fine. 

And while I know this seems hard to fathom, if the health care bill doesn’t pass, I’m fairly certain that Republicans will blame Democrats and use that in their campaigns.  Yes, it’s the “why are you kicking yourself?” method of campaigning, but don’t put it past them, seriously.  They are, after all, willing to deceive the public about where Medicare comes from, and they have nearly 40% of the voters behind them on the “keep government out of Medicare” bullshit.  They pay no price for lying.  And really, if they run sob story ads about people who couldn’t afford to keep their health insurance, and then blame the Democrats, what would anyone be able to do to stop them? 

That said, I’m not entirely sure that I trust that poll’s accuracy.  It strikes me as close to a push poll to ask people if the government should stay out of Medicare.  A lot of people polled probably were like, “Huh?”  It’s hard to give an accurate answer when the premise of the question is bullshit.  If you polled people and asked, “Do you think your spouse should butt out of your marriage?”, you might get similarly nonsensical answers.

But still, this sort of data reassures Republicans that lying can result in nothing but pure win for them.  Since there’s no downside to lying for them, the only thing the Democrats can do to cover their asses is to pass good bills and take credit for them.  Anything short is partisan suicide.

 

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Posted by Amanda Marcotte on 04:50 PM • (23) Comments

And here’s the thing - the Republicans have actually said, essentially, “we can’t allow a health care plan because it will be popular and give a permanent boost to the Democrats”.

They know they’re full of shit.  They know it will benefit Americans as a whole.  They don’t care, because it will act against their power, and against those of their backers who see any gain for the whole as a diminishment of their relative superior status.

Comment #1: Phoenician in a time of Romans  on  08/20  at  06:23 PM

On a more serious note: The declining popularity of health care reform in the polls shouldn’t be taken as a reason to abandon it or weaken it.  People are enthusiastic about health care reform if they’re not dwelling on a bunch of right wing lies about it.  They were enthusiastic about it before the recess gave the nuts time to scare the public, and if they’re polled honestly about it, with educated questions instead of push polls, they still like it.  If health care reform passes and it’s not a bullshit bill, but a real attempt to address the issue, it’s not like the public will respond by saying, “Oh those Democrats made health insurance cheaper and more reliable! Fuck them!”

Precisely. Let the proof of the pudding be in the eating.

Comment #2: LongHairedWeirdo  on  08/20  at  06:27 PM

The saddest thing is that you can never count on “centrist” Democrats (and I use the scare quotes deliberately) to take away the right point from a lesson or a poll. Joe Lieberman saw Bill Clinton tack to the center and didn’t say to himself “we were punished for not standing up for ourselves.” He took away “we need to be even more centrist!” Worked great for him in 2000 and 2004, I see.

Comment #3: Incertus, Nacho Daddy  on  08/20  at  06:27 PM

A commenter at Ezra said something very interesting:

What you’re really getting at is that they are being forced to choose between two sub-optimal options: running as a Dem along with a “failed” Dem president, or running with a “successful” president but having to defend a vote for a bill that’s more liberal than their constituency.

There’s another interpretation. Centrist Democrats may see this question as heads they lose, tails they lose. Therefore, with nothing to really lose…

I think the commenter is right, Blue Dogs have nothing to - personally - gain from voting for the reform. And Obama’s weakness with Lieberman and others shows them they have nothing to lose either.

They do have a lot to gain from insurance companies, if they block reform.

One doesn’t need to be a rocket scientist to see how they will vote.

Comment #4: lostmypassword  on  08/20  at  06:27 PM

I think the commenter is right, Blue Dogs have nothing to - personally - gain from voting for the reform. And Obama’s weakness with Lieberman and others shows them they have nothing to lose either.

They do have a lot to gain from insurance companies, if they block reform.

One doesn’t need to be a rocket scientist to see how they will vote.

Easy solution, and it’s been floated out there by lots of people.

Let the conservative Democratic senators vote against the final bill.  The final bill will only need 50 votes (plus Joe Biden) to pass.

But tell them that they do need to vote for cloture to block the filibuster.  And their rationale can be, “While I was generally opposed to the bill, I believed that it ultimately deserved an up-or-down vote, and so in the end I didn’t vote for the bill, but I wasn’t going to participate in obstructing the process to get it to a final vote.”

Yes on cloture, No one the bill.  Ten of them get off the hook for the final passage of the bill, but don’t have to join the Republican obstructionists in the process.

Comment #5: DTG in STL  on  08/20  at  07:28 PM

>All these fears about Medicare, for instance, will evaporate once the bill is passed and Medicare turns out to be just fine.

“good thing i called everyone nazis and protested and waved a gun around, otherwise the government would have taken over medicare”

Comment #6: anonlololol  on  08/20  at  07:28 PM

OT but really ironic:

Bachmann: No Government Control Over My Body! (TPM)

Comment #7: lostmypassword  on  08/20  at  08:09 PM

“Bachmann: No Government Control Over My Body!”

...but your body?  Well that’s a completely different subject…

Comment #8: MikeEss  on  08/20  at  08:14 PM

Oh I forgot… IOKIYAAR

Comment #9: lostmypassword  on  08/20  at  08:34 PM

There is no “declining popularity of health care reform”. The numbers depend on which poll you look at and exactly how the questions were worded. In the aggregate there is not the slightest evidence for any decline.
For example: http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/08/new-surveyusa-poll-shows-support-for-public-option-hasnt-dipped.php

Comment #10: Steve LaBonne  on  08/20  at  08:46 PM

This is a bit OT as well, but bear with me. I was under the impression that the Obama administration was going to come in guns blazing, kicking ass, taking names, etc. etc. (They were certainly entitled to it, given the margin with which they won the 2008 election). Why hasn’t this happened? Rahm Emanuel* is supposed to be Thor’s hammer, pushing initiatives through, getting people on the hill aligned, and so on. How come he’s not using said superpowers on what is arguably the administration’s #1 priority? I remain a huge fan of Obama, but can’t deny that I’m disappointed.

* The consensus was that Aaron Sorkin based TWW’s Josh Lyman (my second favorite character on the show) on Emanuel but -based on the last 7 months- I fail to see the resemblance. When is Emanuen going to call the Blue Dogs and tell them “Why don’t you take your legislative agenda and shove it up your ass?”

Rant over. Apologies extended for the digression.

Comment #11: Dan2108  on  08/20  at  09:40 PM

When is Emanuel going to call the Blue Dogs and tell them “Why don’t you take your legislative agenda and shove it up your ass?”

You must have been thinking of some other Rahm Emanuel. The one I know about IS a Blue Dog. The conversation you describe is the very one that he has all the time with progressives.

Comment #12: Steve LaBonne  on  08/20  at  09:48 PM

When is Emanuel going to call the Blue Dogs and tell them “Why don’t you take your legislative agenda and shove it up your ass?”

You must have been thinking of some other Rahm Emanuel. The one I know about IS a Blue Dog. The conversation you describe is the very one that he has all the time with progressives.

I agree with the general sentiment of your statement, but that isn’t precisely true.

People talk about “Blue Dogs” in two different ways, literal and figurative.  In the figurative sense, a Blue Dog is a member of the Democratic Party who ideologically aligns himself/herself with the right flank of the party.  In the figurative sense, Rahm Emanuel is arguably a Blue Dog.

There is also a literal meaning, which refers to anyone who is or was a member of the Blue Dog Coalition, a formal caucus of Democrats within the U.S House of Representatives.  As a Congressman, Rahm was never a member of this caucus, so he was never literally a Blue Dog.  And by the same token, while we often think of conservative Democrats in the Senate like Kent Conrad as “Blue Dogs”, that technically isn’t true, either, as there is no official Blue Dog caucus in the Senate as there is in the House.

When she was a Congresswoman, U.S. Senator Kirsten Gillibrand (who represented a Republican-leaning NY district) was a member of the Blue Dog Coalition, and thus she was literally a Blue Dog Democrat.  Interestingly enough, since being appointed to the Senate, her voting record has shifted dramatically leftward, as she now represnts a much more liberal overall constituency, the entire stte of New York.

Anyway, Rachel Maddow coined a word that probably more accurately describes the people we frequently call “Blue Dogs” in the Senate - “ConservaDems”.

And Rahm Emanuel, with very strong ties to the decidedly conservative Democratic Leadershiop Council (DLC), is arguably a “ConservaDem”.  And I have little doubt that it was because of Rahm Emanuel that Howard Dean (who Rahm despises) was never seriously considered for Secretary of Health and Human Services, which I believe would have been a perfect fit for him.

Comment #13: DTG in STL  on  08/20  at  10:42 PM

Thanks Steve & DTG. I appreciate your comments.

If you allow me, I’ll continue using (ok, stretching) my Emanuel-Lyman analogy. The point I was trying to make is that the White House Chief of Staff (or Deputy Chief of Staff in the fictional TWW universe) serves the POTUS first and foremost. If President Obama clearly has healthcare reform as a priority, shouldn’t Emanuel do anything in his power to ram it through? If he’s effectively aligning himself with people who are part of the problem (call them ConservaDems, Blue Dogs, whatever you want) why is he still in the office next to the Oval Office? Something here doesn’t add up. I hope that means that I’m too dumb to understand Obama & Emanuel’s strategy for getting healtcare reform passed. If, in a couple of weeks/months I have to smack my forehead and acknowledge they brilliantly fooled me too while getting better health coverage for more people, I’ll admit my naivete gladly.

Comment #14: Dan2108  on  08/21  at  12:05 AM

Dan, remember that Rahm hates Dean b/c DEAN WAS RIGHT.  The Blue Dog strategy was a loser, and Dean’s 50-state strategy was a winner.

And instead of doing the smart thing and making the guy who was right part of the team, Rahm is bitter and is marginalizing him.

Cutting off his nose to spite his face.

There is no 11th dimension chess strategy.  They aren’t as smart as we hoped they were.  They have more corporate leanings, and Barack is friends with Rahm not because he was effective (b/c he wasn’t) but because they are similar creatures.

We will have to push them hard to make them do the right thing.  They really think that progressives have no other choice and will have to take what they give us.

They are wrong.  We’re not Republicans.  They shouldn’t be “mystified” that their “team” is “forgetting”  to support them.  We support policy, not personas.

If Obama doesn’t get us a public option, he’s in big trouble.

The message on health reform is muddled b/c they didn’t want it clear.  They have BARACK OBAMA.  He could be out there talking to people all the time.  Instead, he’s been quiet and let SARAH PALIN frame part of the debate FROM HER FACEBOOK ACCOUNT.

That’s stupid.  Or corrupt.  Or both, it is a both/and blog.

Comment #15: Caren-Sun-blocking Creator of Animorphic Pancakes  on  08/21  at  02:11 AM

One other thing on the Emanuel front… I don’t know how directly involved Rahm was in the 1993-94 Clinton healthcare reform debate, but he was in fact a senior advisor to President Clinton during this time period.

He got his start in national politics as a Clintonista, and the current breakdown in the healthcare debate today is feeling more and more like the same breakdown in the healthcare debate that happened back in the beginning of Clinton’s presidency.

And who is the one common denominator between Barack Obama’s healthcare reform initiative and Bill Clinton’s healthcare reform initiative?

Rahm Emanuel.

Comment #16: DTG in STL  on  08/21  at  02:28 AM

The real question now is whether or not the Obama team will destroy the Democratic Party to preserve the Faustian bargain they made with the insurance companies.

It is, despite everything, still currently open.  But it’s true, if health care reform either doesn’t pass or passes without a Public Option, I’m done working Federally for a long, long time.

Comment #17: Punditus Maximus  on  08/21  at  04:56 AM

If you allow me, I’ll continue using (ok, stretching) my Emanuel-Lyman analogy. The point I was trying to make is that the White House Chief of Staff (or Deputy Chief of Staff in the fictional TWW universe) serves the POTUS first and foremost. If President Obama clearly has healthcare reform as a priority, shouldn’t Emanuel do anything in his power to ram it through? If he’s effectively aligning himself with people who are part of the problem (call them ConservaDems, Blue Dogs, whatever you want) why is he still in the office next to the Oval Office? Something here doesn’t add up. I hope that means that I’m too dumb to understand Obama & Emanuel’s strategy for getting healtcare reform passed. If, in a couple of weeks/months I have to smack my forehead and acknowledge they brilliantly fooled me too while getting better health coverage for more people, I’ll admit my naivete gladly.

I have no doubt that something that is called “healthcare reform” will get passed.  The Democrats - ALL of them - recognize that failure to pass something is political suicide.

There will be a bill of some sort, and it will be passed this year.

The debate isn’t about whether or not something gets passed, but rather WHAT gets passed.  Right now, Rahm is trying to convince us - meaning progressives - that the healthcare reform bill doesn’t have to have a public option to be strong and effective at achieving its goals - more people covered at lower costs.

Via The Atlantic:

The president continues to operate under the belief that liberals will warm to the bill when presented with a goodybag that includes includes an individual mandate, community rating, guaranteed issue, and a minimum required package. There’s no chance, really, that a bill WON’T feature these reforms. Quietly, to secure and keep Democrats on board, the White House is going to bargain, providing inducements, like more money for favored projects, etc., in order to secure individual votes.

With all due respect, Mr. Emanuel, you can take your “goodybag” and shove it up your ass if it doesn’t contain a public option.  This isn’t fucking Holloween, we aren’t fucking children trick-or-treating, these are people’s fucking lives.  Don’t polish up a turd that is nothing more than a pot of gold for insurance companies and try to convince us that it’s a filet mignon.  Asshole.

Comment #18: DTG in STL  on  08/21  at  05:36 AM

Feedback appreciated. In a way (albeit not the way I had hoped for), I have to admit I was too naive to think that Obama wouldn’t water down healthcare reform precisely because it was his own pet project. If he’s going to cave and sign a weak-ass bill on this, what won’t he yield on? It looks like 7.5 (or 3.5) long years of holding his feet to the fire.

Comment #19: Dan2108  on  08/21  at  08:02 AM

“OT but really ironic:

Bachmann: No Government Control Over My Body! (TPM)”

It’ll go straight to ironing if someone saves that one for her reelection campaign and takes it out of context.

Comment #20: preying mantis  on  08/21  at  09:57 AM

I thought Tim Russo at Blogger Interrupted had a good take on this-

Question for Blue Dog Zack Space and your ilk – how the fuck do you think you’re gonna survive a Republican year in 2010 fueled by what Republicans will claim as a “victory” over health care reform?  You think you got problems now?  Wait until you look at your empty campaign offices in October 2010.

I was there in 1994.  I staffed one of those empty offices.  My most reliable visitor was the homeless dude who came by every day to ask for a quarter.  I watched us get rolled, because these ideologues were pumped up after they killed health care reform, Dems were depressed because we lost this big battle, and guess who got into congress in Ohio in 1994.  Mike Dewine.  Steve “BULLSHIT” Latourette.  BOB FUCKING NEY.

Comment #21: stryx  on  08/21  at  01:27 PM

The newest poll from Wall Street Journal shows 77% in favor of the public option (nearly the same percentage as polls from June.)

60 members of the House made it clear they won’t vote for a bill without a public option.

In three days, FireDogLake and partners raised over $300,000 for progressive members of Congress who agree to draw a line in the sand over a public plan.

It may not be the whole fight, but you, too, can offer carrots to these progressive politicians at ACT Blue:

http://www.actblue.com/page/theytookthepledge

Comment #22: judybrowni  on  08/21  at  02:19 PM

The newest poll from Wall Street Journal shows 77% in favor of the public option (nearly the same percentage as polls from June.)

SurveyUSA, not Wall Street Journal.

Comment #23: DTG in STL  on  08/21  at  03:04 PM
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