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Next entry: Scientific American on why evo psych is bad biology Previous entry: Another Papal bigot eruption

Lowery, Rhue speak out on Warren debacle; Saddleback homophobe to keynote at King Memorial Service

(UPDATE: Rick Warren pulled the anti-gay language from his church’s web site (see the Google cache for the original language).  The relevant question is whether the church now suddenly welcomes “unrepentant gays,” and if this is about Warren being embarrassed or Team Obama putting some heat on him - a good journalist would ask the obvious questions of the megachurch pastor). Perhaps some “unrepentant gays” need to contact Saddleback and see if they can join.

UPDATE 2: Read how Soulforce’s Jeff Lutes was given the calculated cold shoulder by Rick Warren after the Saddleback pastor agreed to meet with a group of gay and lesbian couples—then did everything in his power to back away from the commitment after the get-together was outed in a Newsweek piece.


The news keeps breaking on the Rick Warren situation…

First, Dyana Bagby @ the Southern Voice reports that gay rights ally Rev. Dr. Joseph Lowery, who will deliver the benediction at the Obama Inaugural, weighs in on the controversy—by steering clear.

“I’m not getting into that,” Lowery said with a chuckle when asked about the controversy. “I’m the other preacher on the program. I’ll leave those who are upset to their calling. “I would hope we would not create a distraction,” he added. “The president-elect promised he would reach across the divide and that is what he’s doing.”

...Lowery, 87, a founder of the Southern Christian Leadership Conference, was the first to mention Coretta Scott King’s support for gay civil rights at her funeral in February 2006 at New Birth Missionary Baptist Church, reminding the audience that she “frowned on homophobia.”

...“By the time Aretha sings, the poem is read, people may have already forgotten what Warren said,” Lowery said.

Dr. Sylvia Rhue, director of Religious Affairs at the National Black Justice Coalition, has shared her views on the Warren invitation. (You’ll recall that she gave a smashing smackdown to the insane anti-gay rant of “Dr.” Firpo W. Carr last week.) The emphasis below is mine.

Rev. Rick Warren at the Inauguration
By Sylvia Rhue, Director of Religious Affairs, National Black Justice Coalition

One of the overriding goals of the Religious Affairs Program of the National Black Justice Coalition is to change the conversation of homosexuality from being a sickness and a sin, to a genuine understanding of sexuality with inclusion replacing exclusion, and fact replacing fears.This is no small task with the kind of opposition we face on a daily basis. I see first hand the damage that spiritual abuse can do to body and soul.

We work with people of faith and people of good will to accomplish this goal.We are interfaith and ecumenical in reaching out to powerful religious forces that are adamently allied against equal rights for lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender (LGBT) people. We reached out to Bishop Harry Jackson of the High Impact Leadership Coalition and others who do not agree that LGBT people should sit at the table of full equality.

Dr. Rhue continues below the fold.

We agree with President-Elect Obama that we should talk to everyone about ideas and beliefs that are different from our own. We believe in dialogue, that is how the conversation about change happens.

But, there is a difference in engaging people in dialogue about poverty and AIDS and elevating Rick Warren, a rigorous opponent of LGBT rights to the position of the nation’s pastor in the inaugural prayer. He does not represent change but a status quo of discrimination. He is symbolic of a tone setting circumstance that does not bring us together in spiritual terms.

We are aware that Mr.  Obama is dealing with pressures from all sides and that we are in the honeymoon phase of his impending presidency. But this choice has seriously jarred the wedding night of the honeymoon and has given us a wake-up call of deep and righteous concern. We are concerned that the choice of Rick Warren foretells of a potential continuation of the callous disregard for the lives and aspirations of LGBT people in America.

President-Elect Obama, many of us will be at your inauguration. We will dance and party and drink a toast to your success upon which so many hopes are tethered. But, you have to understand that we are once again coming to Washington DC to cash a check. Yes, like the 1963 March on Washington, organized by a black gay man, Bayard Rustin, we LGBT people have been given the same promissory note that is the heritage and pride of every American. The right to pursue life, liberty and happiness, “the riches of freedom and the security of justice.” And this is fierce urgency of now has been tainted by the choice of a man who is so deeply flawed that he equates the lifelong love and commitment of a same gender couple to be equivalent to incest and pedophilia.

Thank God we will be able to see and hear the words of an authentic civil rights warrior.  The Reverend Joseph Lowery will be there to provide the benediction. Rev. Lowery is a stalwart believer in full and equal rights for LGBT people.

We will be praying that the value system that energized the Obama campaign, a notion of inclusion and respect, will continue. Many of us will be praying that the words and actions of Rev. Rick Warren will not continue to harm us.

Speaking of Coretta Scott King, Rick Warren has been invited to be the keynote speaker at Martin Luther King, Jr. Annual Commemorative Service, according to The Atlanta Progressive News. That is sickening. Local gay rights activist Darlene Hudson is appalled and says there will be protests.

“I’m completely baffled by this Rick Warren piece,” Hudson said. “Inviting someone of his caliber, of comparing GLBTQ people to bestiality, that’s a pretty low blow in our community, and to pedophiles, that’s pretty grappling information to try to deal with.”

“It’s just absurd. It’s ridiculous. In my opinion, nobody should be given a platform that’s that divisive,” Betty Couvertier, WRFG radio host and homosexual activist, told Atlanta Progressive News. “They’re promoting discrimination.”

“He [Warren]... puts the gay, lesbian, bisexual, and transgender community… in this other place that doesn’t give us humanity. People talk about civil rights and human rights,” Couvertier said.

“I think it’s inappropriate for him to be involved in the inauguration. I think it’s inappropriate for him to be involved in the King event,” State Sen. Vincent Fort, a prominent civil rights leader, told APN. “What he represents in his slander of the gay community—it is slander—seems to be antithetical to the spirit that Obama was communicating during the campaign as well as the spirit of the King Center—antithetical, at cross purposes,” Fort said.

 

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Posted by Pam Spaulding on 05:50 PM • (22) Comments

Perhaps some “unrepentant gays” need to contact Saddleback and see if they can join.

Funny you should mention it! My girlfriend and I went there yesterday, just on a fact-finding mission; we wore our small “marriage equality” buttons, but made no other particular displays of lesbianocity. Of the hundreds of people who walked past us—-as we stood there, looking for all the world like confused first-time visitors—-exactly one said hello. Two women at an information table chatted pleasantly enough with us, but as soon as we walked away, they snickered and pointed and rolled their eyes. When we left the parking lot, the people in the car behind us made a big show of frowning and shaking their heads at our “Obama/Biden” and “No on 8” bumper stickers. And that was the extent of our welcome.

So we’re planning a return visit, but we haven’t decided on the specifics yet.

Oh—-the contracted photographer did snare us for a picture, and we made sure our rainbow buttons were nice and visible. It gives me a small cheer to think of their PR team sorting through photos today and being greeted by our smiling gay faces.

Comment #1: FundamentallyFlawed  on  12/22  at  06:31 PM

Rick Warren pulled the anti-gay language from his church’s web site (see the Google cache for the original language)

Warren may not be an ignorant godbag, but apparently he’s a cowardly one. Like many a teenaged girl who flashed her breasts to a cam-phone, he’s going to learn that past indiscretions posted on the Internet have a way of persisting for a long, long time.

Comment #2: Gracchus  on  12/22  at  06:36 PM

Oh—-the contracted photographer did snare us for a picture, and we made sure our rainbow buttons were nice and visible.

Wait, you can’t use rainbow buttons because my local militia uses rainbow buttons and we might get all confused as to who’s who, and such like.

Comment #3: RUGGED IN MONTANA  on  12/22  at  06:49 PM

At least Rev. Warren is toning down the anti-gay stuff, even if for the wrong reasons. The only problem now is that The Dark Horsemen of the Homosexual Agena will be accused of censoring him.

Note Lowery’s subtle smackdown: “By the time Aretha sings, the poem is read, people may have already forgotten what Warren said.” Dr. Rhue’s letter makes me want to take back some of the ugly things I have said about religion. But to attribute the moral courage of those positions to commands from God seems to me to diminish it.

Comment #4: Luke  on  12/22  at  07:24 PM

Ugh, Fatally Flawed, what assholes.  I mean, seriously, Yaweh needs to go all Sodom and Gomorrah on their asses for that lack of hospitality.

Cause, you know, that’s what Jesus did.  He smiled to people’s faces and then laughed at them behind their backs.  It’s all in Matthew Ch 5-6.

Oh wait…Jesus says the opposite there…

Who are these folks worshipping again?

Comment #5: Caren  on  12/22  at  07:28 PM

Caren,
They worship their ego and call it God. Friggin’ idol worshippers. Time to go golden calf on them…

Comment #6: histrogeek  on  12/22  at  07:39 PM

Dr. Rhue’s letter makes me want to take back some of the ugly things I have said about religion.

Why?  It is good people like her that the institution of religion is committed to holding down. 

Rick Warren has been invited to be the keynote speaker at Martin Luther King, Jr. Annual Commemorative Service

Does anyone here think, for even a moment, that if Warren were active 40 years earlier he would NOT be squarely in the anti-civil rights camp?

Comment #7: Notorious P.A.T.  on  12/22  at  07:50 PM

More or less nothing seems worth doing, but oh well.
I just don’t have anything to say now.
adipex
http://adipexadipexonl.blog.ijijiji.com

Comment #8: adipex p  on  12/22  at  08:17 PM

There’s an interesting symmetry in that Warren is a thick, grim wedge of a man, purposely-driven (ho ho) between racial minorities and LGBTs.

I mean, that’s what’s going on here, right? The effect of him speaking at the inauguration is to get LGBTs angry at Obama. And the effect of him being the keynote speaker at the MLK service is to get LGBTs angry at the caretakers of the civil rights group who invited him. And the upshot is that a lot of LGBTs get mad at a lot of African Americans, and vice versa. It’s standard thug politics; divide two minority groups and set them at each others’ throats, which gives you just enough time to figure out how to screw them both.

So why is Obama participating in this, again?

Comment #9: cyrano  on  12/22  at  08:41 PM

Wait, you can’t use rainbow buttons because my local militia uses rainbow buttons and we might get all confused as to who’s who, and such like.

RiM, your fellow militia will be those who are your comrades in arms, your stalwart companions through thick and thin, the guys you can count on to be watching your ass.

Nothing like the gays at all.

Comment #10: Phoenician in a time of Romans  on  12/22  at  08:55 PM

Nothing like the gays at all.

Nothing like that….....it’s just that a lot of us wear assless chaps for the freedom it gives us to move stealthily through the brush…...oh, ok, I get what yer sayin’.

Comment #11: RUGGED IN MONTANA  on  12/22  at  09:24 PM

Holy smokes, get over it already! What is this, day six or seven in a row of your god-forsaken whining? Can’t you find something new to whine about?

Comment #12: Sniffle  on  12/22  at  11:28 PM

It’s standard thug politics; divide two minority groups

Well, it’s not like anything happened recently to make LGBTs and blacks mad at each other.  In California, for instance.  On the latest election day.

Comment #13: Notorious P.A.T.  on  12/22  at  11:42 PM

“Well, it’s not like anything happened recently to make LGBTs and blacks mad at each other.  In California, for instance.  On the latest election day.”

Oh, don’t even go there. Notorious P.A.T.! Don’t you know it’s all a big KKK myth that blacks voted for Prop 8? Blacks LOVE teh gays, my friend. Look at Michael Jackson. Look at Marlon Riggs. Look at Chris Rock. Look at 50 Cent. Look at Prince (is he black? who can tell these days)? All gay-loving homophobes, god love them. They would not have voted for Prop 8!

Let’s go back to bashing Rick Warren for having attitudes that no decent black folk would share. Bastard fucker pig bigot asshole Nazi! Fuck him, that pastor!

Comment #14: Sniffle  on  12/23  at  01:06 AM

uh, guys, 538 tore that myth a new one, like WEEKS AGO.

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/11/prop-8-myths.html

Sniffle can’t be fucked to read, i see.

Comment #15: redwards  on  12/23  at  01:18 AM

“538 tore that myth a new one, like WEEKS AGO”

Absolutely.  But I remember there being some tension between the two camps until word of this spread.

Comment #16: Notorious P.A.T.  on  12/23  at  01:22 AM

Holy smokes, get over it already! What is this, day six or seven in a row of your god-forsaken whining? Can’t you find something new to whine about?

For the average follower of politics, nothing is quite so satisfying as one more chomp on a well-chewed cud. Five minutes’ exposure to the world of political bloggers is sufficient to verify this, so I’m sure I can’t imagine why you’re surprised at all the god-forsaken whining.

Comment #17: cyrano  on  12/23  at  01:47 AM

Well, it’s not like anything happened recently to make LGBTs and blacks mad at each other.  In California, for instance.  On the latest election day.

Oh, yes. I know. And I knew about the 538 debunking, as well - thanks for that, anyway,  redwards. I’m just wondering if there’s some intelligence operating behind this increasing friction. Maybe I’m being paranoid; maybe not.

Comment #18: cyrano  on  12/23  at  02:00 AM

I know what you mean, curano.

Qui bono? The enemies of both gays and blacks; the reactionaries on the right who want for people to “know their place”.

Comment #19: Samantha Vimes  on  12/23  at  03:25 AM

And don’t forget that Oprah loves gays, and Jay-Zee, and Beyonce and Colin Powell, and Bill Cosby. All these people would never vote for Prop 8, and certainly neither would anyone in California. It was all the fault of them Mormon churches and the baptists where the blacks all go had nothing to do with it. Keep smoking yer crack pipe, Pam.

Comment #20: Sniffle  on  12/23  at  10:51 AM

“Warren may not be an ignorant godbag, but apparently he’s a cowardly one. Like many a teenaged girl who flashed her breasts to a cam-phone, he’s going to learn that past indiscretions posted on the Internet have a way of persisting for a long, long time.”

It might not be genuine cowardice per se. He might be trying to present himself as a victim of “political correctness” here: “The powerful homosexual lobby forced me to censor my God-given right to my own opinions! And on my own website, no less! I’m the real vicitm here! I’m the greatest hero in the history of America!!! Boo hoo hoo hoo hoo hoo!!!!”

Or something to that effect.

Comment #21: John D.  on  12/23  at  01:32 PM

What if Warren changes his church’s policy, or stops making denunciatory statements like the ones he’s been rightfully pilloried for? Will that be a victory, basically, if he and his organization remove the hateration from the dancerie?

I hope so.

Comment #22: serena kitt  on  12/23  at  09:16 PM
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