I guess she doesn’t understand basic biology.

I guess she doesn’t understand that one need not be opposite-married to procreate.

I guess she doesn’t understand that one can be opposite-married and not ever procreate.

I know she just. doesn’t. understand.

...If we don’t preserve “traditional” marriage, Carrie says, children will not have mothers and fathers. Because, you know, that’s the norm.

“What, like Jesus?”

Watch Christonut derail trying to deal with that.

...okay.  This is kinda fun and all, but, at some point, the level at which she is being manipulated is sad and feels uncomfortable, rather than shadenfreudey

I still don’t understand how gay marriage is an attack on opposite marriage?  My dad is more dangerous to the institution of marriage than my lesbian neighbors.  Hell, my inability to notice my first two wives were both, literally, nuts (bi-polar for one and borderline for the other) was more dangerous to the institution of marriage due to my, apparent, complete inability to tell if a woman was a toy surprise shy of a box of crackerjacks.

I would say John Gray “Men are from Mars…” is more danger to the institute of opposite marriage than gay marriage and he writes best selling books on how to stay opposite married.  All while having a phony PhD from a phony diploma mill “university” and has gone through a number of opposite marriages in his life.

And when I ask…  Most what I get is Argumentum ad antiquitatem. (We’ve always done it thus, therefore it is the way it must be.) I think that argument makes as much sense arguing for the abolition of airplanes because “if God wanted us to fly, he’d have given us wings and we walked for thousands of years…”

Does she really not understand that we’re pushing for gay people to be allowed to get married to each other, not mandating that straight people marry members of the same sex?

“I like watching her and I know you probably do too. It’s the one thing we can agree upon.”

...um, what the hell is that supposed to mean? 

And believe it or not, Pam hasn’t been “keeping this issue going” — a young woman desperate to hang on to her 15 mins of fame and the people using her to push their agenda of hate are the ones that keep this alive.  Pam just tells us about it…

Why all this focus on what an ignorant teenager has to say about gay marriage? Does anyone really expect anything better out of someone who would willingly enter a Miss USA pageant?

Why hasn’t Frankie been banned yet?

Franklin Raines, it seems you’re really proud of your dickishness and all.  And I’m sure there are guys over at Free Republic or some such who really admire your posts, especially the ones you leave over here in the Land of the FemiNazi Libruls.

But frankly, we have higher standards for our trolls.  And you’re just not up to snuff. 

Perhaps there’s some kind of remediation that would help you either be interesting or funny.  Because as it stands right now, you are neither.

Maybe it’s time to take your act somewhere else…?

People - please STOP…Why expect a “beyootiful blonde” to be intelligent or intelligible?

In a way this is good, because without Ms P the NOM folks might have been forced to come up with a campaign that is less transparently stupid.

Miss California sets feminism back 100 years in two short weeks.

Why all this focus on what an ignorant teenager has to say about gay marriage?

Nit: She’s 21.

The truly stupid thing: there is NO EVIDENCE that her stumbling and rambling cost her anything.

Sounds like somebody isn’t a very good Christian like she’s pretending to be if she thinks she would have won otherwise - or that she was even supposed to have won.

Cripes, how much more of this princess of Plastic Sore Loser do we have to deal with?  Get some math dipshit - figure out what score you would have needed and what you got!

“What, like Jesus?”

Watch Christonut derail trying to deal with that.

Technically Jesus had Joseph as his “daddy”. I guess God was the biological important daddy (who sent his only son to be beaten, hated and killed) and Joseph was the step dad or something. But they believe that there was a “mother” and “father” to that component as well. I guess Mary just never charged God child support.

And I would like someone to ask anyone opposed to same sex marriage what, exactly, they picture happening once it’s legalized. I mean, we’ve got four states already that have it and the world hasn’t collapsed nor has every heterosexual couple gone sterile. So yeah, let’s get on camera the gay marriage doomsday scenario they imagine.

Has anyone asked Miss CA to point to the actual printed Bible passage where Jesus says, “Be sure to keep your neighbors from having the same civil rights as you do”?

I kind of wish people wouldn’t keep mentioning her implants. It’s such a cheap shot, like “Michael Moore is stupid…and fat!” and it lowers the level of discourse.

Er, not to say that being overweight=getting breast implants. You get the idea, though.

But frankly, we have higher standards for our trolls.

We do?  Was there a memo I missed?

I kind of wish people wouldn’t keep mentioning her implants.

The implants themselves are hardly worthy of notice, but if the Miss California organization paid for them, well, that’s a horse of a different color.

People - please STOP…Why expect a “beyootiful blonde” to be intelligent or intelligible?

Well, Carol Lombard managed pretty well.

We do?  Was there a memo I missed?

Well, I do. I’ve been actively tutoring Franklin here. Although he’s a bit of a slow student, sad to say. I would like to think my charming nature, quirky sense of humor and rugged good looks rub off on those around me, to make this more of a “we” than an “I” but I do understand if not everyone agrees with me.

But really, picking on poor quality trolls is like dogfighting or bearbaiting or some other despicable act of sadism that involves killing a defenseless animal for no reason.

And I just invited the vegans, didn’t I? crap.

But really, picking on poor quality trolls is like dogfighting or bearbaiting or some other despicable act of sadism that involves killing a defenseless animal for no reason.

Oh, I look on it more as teasing a cat with a laser pointer - driving a clueless animal frantic for cheap amusement and yuks.

It was very sad during my childhood, when my parents divorced, and I was rendered an orphan.

I remember there was a time when Vanity was one of the seven deadly sins. What church holds up beauty queens as role models?

Does she really not understand that we’re pushing for gay people to be allowed to get married to each other, not mandating that straight people marry members of the same sex?

~ ~ Lymis

Wait, so there’s not really a whole proselytizing effort going on to turn mommy/daddy marriages into TEH GAY marriages?

that Carrie “chose the truth over the tiara.”

I wish she would give up on this already.  She lost because she gave an incoherent answer.  She might not have even won even if she had given a well-spoken answer.  She’s just a sore loser who wants to blame someone else for her failure.  Typical conservative.

Does she really not understand that we’re pushing for gay people to be allowed to get married to each other, not mandating that straight people marry members of the same sex?

No.

I kind of wish people wouldn’t keep mentioning her implants. It’s such a cheap shot, like “Michael Moore is stupid…and fat!” and it lowers the level of discourse.

You have a point, but in this case it is relevant because it demonstrates her hypocrisy.  She acts like she cares so much about the truth that she couldn’t lie to win the crown, but so much of her appearance is a lie.  She has fake boobs, fake hair color, and tons of make-up, but she just couldn’t go so far as to have a fake opinion to win.  (Not that she would actually have to have a fake opinion, but that’s what she thinks.)

I remember there was a time when Vanity was one of the seven deadly sins. What church holds up beauty queens as role models?

Samantha, from my understanding of this trend, the idea is to use conventionally attractive women as shills and pawns to sell their horribly confining and stupid ideals.  It works for most other marketing, why not for neoreligious marketing?  “Wow.  I guess being a celibate prude and running around telling everyone else what horrible people they are because they have sex will make me hawt and maybe land me a man so I can become a mirror for him and his beliefs but at least I look good while doing it!  And maybe the people in this church will take me seriously once I’m hanging off the arm of a dewd!”  Is kind of how it works.

Seven Deadly Sins:

Pride, Envy, Gluttony, Anger, Sloth, Avarice, Lust

We could probably have a pretty good time documenting the Deadly Sins of our Holier-Than-Us brethren and sistren, starting with lust.

Sadly, hypocrisy never made the cut.

Answer: None that <strike>I have ever seen</strike> have ever let me get close enough to touch.

I have spent a good part of my career working with people with developmental delays or intellectual disabilities or whatever you want to call it but this woman, this woman is RETARDED!

Do you know what else is interesting?  I have never met a misogynist or a libertarian who is attractive.  They are all ugly men with hygiene issues who are probably just mad at women for not tolerating them and jealous of them for the ability to create life.  Who knew?

“People - please STOP…Why expect a “beyootiful blonde” to be intelligent or intelligible?”

If your personal beliefs are that everyone else adhere to a norm or be considered unequal, then you need to be intelligent enough to justify why the norm is superior, and why it is proper to penalize those who choose something different.

The arguments that heterosexual marriage is superior to all alternative arrangements and that gays in relationships of the same commitment are entitled to the same benefits are not persuasive. As they become more obviously unpersuasive, what gay rights proponents will see is a narrative similar to what Miss California represents: “I just feel this way for reasons I don’t have to explain, it’s all becuase of my family and religion which you are not allowed to question politely, and treating gays equally threatens my right to feel this way and takes away my freedom.”

Even Carrie doesn’t look like Carrie, once you remove the make-up and hair extensions and the rest of the pageant drag.

Agree with Punditus Maximus above…. at this point she’s just humiliating herself publicly on behalf of some really twisted people, and appears completely unaware.  Painful to watch.

That said, I kept wanting to scream at my computer screen every time she said she was representing not only California, but the entire nation, because seven million Californians voted on this issue.  When did California’s elections becoming reliable polling on national views?

Yikes, there should be a “not” in my post 10:58AM, between “are” and “entitled.”

Franklin, you’re projecting too much.

Go to a gym, get some plastic surgery and a spray on tan, and maybe - MAYBE - some desperate woman somewhere will fuck you.

The kind of anger you have toward people who have nothing to do with you is pretty sick.

Franklin, the reason few feminists look like Miss Vacancy is that they consider the kind of surgery and obsession with appearance that she has resorted to as, quite frankly, a waste of time in trivial pursuit.

I mean, I could get lots of surgery and primp up and body sculpt, etc. and look pretty cute, but then when would I have time to help decide the future of regulation of air pollution in the US, EU, and, by extension, countries that adopt those limits?

You don’t see very many women who look like Pre-genes in real life anyway, and it’s more rare when women have something to offer beyond faux-hawt.

Yeah, Nicole Kidman’s a real oinker. So is Reese Witherspoon, and Geena Davis. (to name a few off the top of my head) What a bunch of notoriously ugly COWS!

I call stick rule. If Franklin can’t form a coherent thought for himself and must instead regurgitate whatever vomit he licked up from the Rush Limbaugh Asshole Hour, I see no reason we should do our thinking for him. He’s like a welfare queen, except he’s thinking off of other people’s intelligence instead of spending their money.

This is embarrassing on so many levels. First of all, she didn’t answer the question at the end. She definitely gave a beat around the bush type answer. Which is extremely irritating to me. Also, I think everyone needs to stop focusing on Carrie’s appearance and instead discuss the basis of what she’s saying. Talking about Carrie’s appearance and what feminists look like her is not going to change the fact that a lot of people feel the same way. It’s not going to change the fact that a lot of young girls probably look up to her, and that she truly believes what she does. It’s not going to educate her on any current issues, it’s not going to do anything.

Now, back to what Carrie said. What do you all suggest as ways to educate her?