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Next entry: Prop 8 mouthpiece bleats that defeating gays is akin to beating Hitler Previous entry: My Apologies To John Derbyshire

NC: Hagan responds to ‘Godless’ ad; Dole’s immigrant bashing

(UPDATE: Hagan has filed a defamation suit against Dole—and she will be seeking damages.)

There has been a large dustup in the blogosphere and in the media over Elizabeth Dole’s fraudulent ‘Godless’ ad portraying her as cozying up to atheists, so much so that Dem challenger Kay Hagan has a new commercial out addressing the matter:

I’m Kay Hagan and Elizabeth Dole’s attacks on my Christian faith are offensive. She even faked my voice in her TV ad to make you think that I don’t believe in God. Well, I believe in God. I taught Sunday school; my faith guides my life. And Senator Dole knows it. Sure, politics is a tough business, but I approved this message because my campaign is about creating jobs and fixing our economy, not bearing false witness against fellow Christians.

It’s a strong response, placing the tactics directly on the MIA senator (note there’s no mention about the MIA senator’s anti-gay mailer that bashes Hagan as a liberal and in favor of marriage equality (she’s not).

UPDATE #2: The person standing next to Hagan in the ad, one of the alleged Godless Atheists, isn’t one (The Independent Weekly):

Both ads feature shadowy photographs of Hagan standing next to a nameless gray-haired man—presumably one of those atheists to whom the Democrat is allegedly indebted. He is in fact, Charles Frederick (Rick) Stone III, who currently studies theology at the Harvard Divinity School. Until his 2007 move to Boston, Stone lived in Greensboro and taught Biblical studies at Greensboro College, which is affiliated with the United Methodist Church, and Guilford College, which draws on Quaker tradition.

His courses have included Old and New Testament, religious law, and the teachings of Jesus. Stone himself is Episcopalian and a believer in God.

That’s rich. I hope Hagan bankrupts Dole.

A couple of things about the “Godless” debacle trouble me, aside from the base mudslinging of Liddy in her last gasps of desperation. 1) Dole is saying there’s a religious test to serve in public office; 2) Hagan has to respond in a way that affirms this, though she attempts to redirect by saying she plans to focus on the secular. It’s troublesome all around that candidates have to drag personal faith into a discussion about fitness to serve office. For goodness sake, what if an atheist wants to give to her campaign? I’m sure Dole has some atheists on her mailing list of donors. Does it not occur to the surgically preserved senator that non-believers simply want to select a candidate that will address the economy or the host of other issues, given the state the U.S. is in? It’s all ridiculous.

***

But back to Dole on another matter that has received scant attention in this state—immigration. The ads have been inflammatory, full of fear-baiting. More below the fold.


“I’m Elizabeth Dole and I approve this message.”  Announcer: “Associated Press says Kay Hagen is being ‘coy’ about her illegal immigration plans.  But Hagan voted to give illegal aliens drivers’ licenses.  So, here they came.  Costing us a billion dollars each year.  Billions in lost wages.  What else is Kay hiding?”  Hagen (video): “When I get up there, I will let you know, I will let you know.”

In fact, Dole’s very first TV ad focused on immigration. It’s a naked appeal to fear of the Brown Menace, featuring a bunch of sheriffs from around the state talking about the “illegals” and how Liddy is tough on immigration, or as the campaign refers to it—“combatting the criminal illegal alien problem.”

Notice that her campaign managed to find a black law enforcement officer to add some color to put a break in the string of the white, tough-talking good-old-boys. Dole doesn’t say anything in the commercial other than the usual tagline at the end; it’s a series of clips, wonderfully shot, of her walking, nodding, smiling, etc.

If you take a look at how this is framed, Dole is being very careful to narrow her focus on undocumented people who are committing crimes (gang activity, violence, property crimes) other than being here illegally but working and otherwise law-abiding. The fact is that businesses NC benefit from these undocumented workers, and the business interests that support Dole don’t want a serious dragnet that deports low-paid farmworkers, chicken plant employees, construction workers, etc. Dole is counting on the ship-them-out, low-information voters not to make such distinctions.

I’m curious how the Hagan campaign will address this, since immigration is the one issue the Democratic party here hasn’t shown any interest in challenging the hypocritical Republican frame; that’s why Dole is going there.

Immigration08.com is a project that tracks how immigration is playing out in political races across the country. The almost-untold story this year is the exodus of Latino votes to the Dems, as the GOP is bleeding Latino voters. In many ways, the level of racial animus that we have seen in The Base during the presidential campaign harkens back to the reactions we saw against the immigration proposal on the Hill.

The GOP absolutely had a chance to capture the Latino vote, but its intolerant faction wanted no part of it.

 

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Posted by Pam Spaulding on 01:04 AM • (21) Comments

Bill Maher had an interesting comment on this “religious test” business when he was on The Daily Show to promote his movie - Stewart asked him about Obama’s professed Christianity, and Maher said “Well, I hope he’s lying about that”, or words to that effect. I’m with Maher on this one - since there is a de facto religious test in this country, in that it’s damn near impossible for a non-believer to be honest about it and get elected, I don’t really have a problem with otherwise secular-minded, progressive candidates pretending to be Christians to put stupider voters at ease.

Comment #1: El Caballo de Sangre  on  10/31  at  02:09 AM

I love how you can’t get practically can’t get elected to office unless you’re Christian (literally for some offices, like the presidential one), but the Christians think they are the most persecuted class in America.

Also, Caballo de Sangre, I hope Obama is lying about that, too, but I don’t think he is. I think he is a basically secular, logical guy who also has a pretty hefty amount of faith in God. McCain is definitely lying, though; he’s an unbaptized “Baptist” who doesn’t belong to a church (we all know Obama was chilling at Jeremiah Wright’s place for a looong time). Which is why it is so hilarious/tragic that I keep seeing YouTube videos of ultra-conservative Christians saying the only issue that matters to them in the election is who is more of a Christian, and that they’re therefore voting for McCain.

Comment #2: Lauren O  on  10/31  at  06:16 AM

P. Z. Myers wrote a couple of blog posts about this (here and here), and he’s pissed.  He was pissed about it was taken for granted by both sides that being a (gasp!) atheist is a horrible character flaw, and the latest developments haven’t improved his mood any.

Comment #3: JCfromNC  on  10/31  at  07:00 AM

The immigration ad is truly disgusting.  The announcer takes pains to put the emphasis on “illegal” to make it sound like he’s talking about Kay Hagan doing something illegal rather than her policies.

Comment #4: libdevil  on  10/31  at  09:14 AM

A couple of things about the “Godless” debacle trouble me, aside from the base mudslinging of Liddy in her last gasps of desperation. 1) Dole is saying there’s a religious test to serve in public office; 2) Hagan has to respond in a way that affirms this, though she attempts to redirect by saying she plans to focus on the secular.

That’s the Republicans and Democrats in a nutshell right now.

The Republicans: Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead to the 11th century! Fear & Ignorance, Ignorance & Fear!!!!!

The Democrats: I really like your idea about making everything Fear & Ignorance, bringing witch-hunters back, and nuking the whole world. But here is a practical reason that it might not work.

Comment #5: atheist  on  10/31  at  09:22 AM

I wish Kay Hagan had consistently supported driver’s licenses for undocumented people, like one of those horrible Dole mailers (“Sponsored by Americans for Job Security!”) states. This crap where we live in a rural state that requires you to drive to get anywhere, but you can’t drive to your job (or away from your job if you, say, live in a labor camp in the countryside) without breaking the law, thus making you a default criminal and giving local law enforcement a reason to go after you, is the hugest waste of taxpayer dollars and the most blatant display of racist dipshittery I have seen in recent years. It’s one of those policies which does nothing to actually keep citizens safer or decrease the number of “jobs” going to “illegals”, but contributes hugely to keeping poor working people isolated and silent and under the thumbs of their employers. Grr.

Comment #6: purpleshoes  on  10/31  at  10:01 AM

This thing has left a bad taste in my mouth.  Just the day before, I saw on the Rachel Maddow show how the army was “investigating” twitter because it could be a tool of dangerous groups and in the statement from the defense department atheists were actually on the list.  I myself am an atheist, and I’m not involved in “anti-american” activities as far as I can tell.  The apparent classification of atheism as being “anti-american” is pretty appalling given our explicitly secular constitution.  I’m not out to tell anybody what they ought to believe, and I’m not calling religious people stupid.  I don’t see why they have to make pariahs out of people like me.  Also, I agree that while Hagan has every right to defend her actual beliefs against libelous allegations, in a way her response has the unfortunate effect of reinforcing the idea that you must be religious to hold a public office in America.

Comment #7: brzungdy  on  10/31  at  10:56 AM

Stone went to Harvard Divinity?  He has a Quaker background?  Shit, he probably doesn’t believe in god.

wink

Comment #8: ummeli  on  10/31  at  11:00 AM

Bill Maher had an interesting comment on this “religious test” business when he was on The Daily Show to promote his movie - Stewart asked him about Obama’s professed Christianity, and Maher said “Well, I hope he’s lying about that”, or words to that effect. I’m with Maher on this one - since there is a de facto religious test in this country, in that it’s damn near impossible for a non-believer to be honest about it and get elected, I don’t really have a problem with otherwise secular-minded, progressive candidates pretending to be Christians to put stupider voters at ease.

Bear in mind, Caballo, that Obama belongs to the United Church of Christ, whose central doctrinal tenet is, essentially, Thou Shalt Tolerate Everybody Else’s Beliefs of Lack Thereof. 

If we have to have a self-identified “Christian” as a president, we’d have a hard time finding someone better than a U.C.C. member.

Comment #9: ummeli  on  10/31  at  11:07 AM

Just when I thought I could respect Hagan- she does a 180 and says she believes.
Just one more mindless sheep in the flock…. baa baa

Comment #10: Dave  on  10/31  at  11:30 AM

she does a 180 and says she believes.

A 180 from what?

Comment #11: Tyro  on  10/31  at  12:41 PM

brzungdy, unfortunately, you’ve mastered an extremely powerful tool, to judge from this:

A chapter on “Potential for Terrorist Use of Twitter” notes that Twitter members sent out messages, known as “Tweets,” reporting the July Los Angeles earthquake faster than news outlets

From the Wiki:

The Chino Hills earthquake caused no deaths or significant damage due to the physical location of its epicenter.[10] Most of the infrastructure in the Chino Hills area is relatively new and well suited to withstand a large quake.[4][6] Unlike previous earthquakes in the region—such as the 1994 Northridge earthquake and the 1987 Whittier Narrows earthquake, which caused serious structural damage and fatalities—this quake caused only minor damage. However, the high volume of telephone use following the shock overloaded provider capacity and disrupted service into the afternoon.

ummeli noted that “Stone went to Harvard Divinity?  He has a Quaker background?  Shit, he probably doesn’t believe in god. “

I think you mean the Jesuits, don’t you?

Comment #13: seeker6079  on  10/31  at  01:26 PM

Personally, I don’t believe in Jesuits.

Comment #14: ummeli  on  10/31  at  03:24 PM

That’s the Republicans and Democrats in a nutshell right now.

The Republicans: Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead to the 11th century! Fear & Ignorance, Ignorance & Fear!!!!!

The Democrats: I really like your idea about making everything Fear & Ignorance, bringing witch-hunters back, and nuking the whole world. But here is a practical reason that it might not work.

Atheist FTW.  I don’t understand why the answer can’t be, “No, I’m not an atheist, but why the hell does it matter?”  Akin to Colin Powell’s reply about Obama and Islam.  I am glad that she’s suing her for libel, but it still reinforces the religious test ideal.

Well, okay, I do understand why - I lived in NC for five years.  But, for fuck’s sake, people.

Comment #15: Atheist Feminazi  on  10/31  at  04:09 PM

I don’t think that Hagan’s response to this is an implication that she thinks that atheists are bad/evil. It is in fact defamatory to say that because a person is or hangs out with a specific group they are therefore lacking in character in some way or other, and it is in fact defamatory to make up lies about someone. This has an extra bit to it because Dole’s adverts were/are playing on people’s fears of not-conservative-Christians.

Dole could have pointed out that First Presbyterian in Greensboro, Hagan’s congregation, is a member of PC(USA), which is the most liberal body of Presbyterians in the country, and therefore could have brought up their pro-choice stance or their thoughtful and evolving stance on gays in the church. In short, she could have brought up things which are true in order to attempt to make her point. Instead, she lied.

In short, Hagan is filing suit because Dole’s campaign is making shit up about her which is contrary to what she has been doing for the vast majority of her life. It just happens that the lie is that she is an atheist; were she (hypothetically) suing for defamation because Dole asserted that she is of black ancestry and was using that to appeal to people’s racism, it wouldn’t mean that Hagan doesn’t like black people while it would mean that she is not going to let people make shit up about her.

Comment #16: Ivy  on  10/31  at  04:20 PM

I don’t understand why the answer can’t be, “No, I’m not an atheist, but why the hell does it matter?” Akin to Colin Powell’s reply about Obama and Islam.

Good point INTPagan. Maybe, If we’re lucky, some brave person will do that.

Comment #17: atheist  on  10/31  at  04:52 PM

were she (hypothetically) suing for defamation because Dole asserted that she is of black ancestry and was using that to appeal to people’s racism, it wouldn’t mean that Hagan doesn’t like black people while it would mean that she is not going to let people make shit up about her.

Yes; however, were she to sue for defamation because it was claimed that she had black ancestry, it would still imply that she thought that it was defaming to be accused of being black.  It wouldn’t be defamatory so much as false; just because someone calls you something as a perjorative doesn’t mean that it has to be taken that way - it just means it needs to be addressed that way, if that makes sense.  It’s kind of like when people think I’m a lesbian (which happens often enough when I’m not with my boyfriend or at work).  I don’t go, “Oh, gods, no!”  I say, “No, I’m not.”  The difference is staggering.

Comment #18: Atheist Feminazi  on  10/31  at  05:03 PM

Apparently <a >Dole has a new ad</a> where she attacks the idea that atheists should be allowed to donate money to politicians.

I really, really, really wish someone would call her on that and ask her why she thinks that only church members should be allowed to support political candidates, but I doubt it could happen in South Carolina.

Comment #19: Mnemosyne  on  10/31  at  09:11 PM

D’oh!  Sorry, bad linky.  That’s what I get for skipping Preview.

Dole’s new ad

Comment #20: Mnemosyne  on  10/31  at  09:12 PM

I’m more or less with Ivy on this one, with the following clarification:  Dole is not only making shit up about Hagen, she’s making shit up with the intent of damaging her, shit that in NC politics could indeed have that effect.  It’s absolutely defamatory.  I’m not against the First Amendment if I object to someone who wishes to discredit me falsely claiming I subscribe to the NAMBLA Bulletin; indeed, I think the existence of that journal testifies to the greatness of our nation.

Comment #21: Josh  on  11/01  at  02:55 AM
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