Login

Register

Member List

RSS Feed

Amanda | Contact

Auguste | Contact

Jesse | Contact

Pam | Contact

Next entry: And From The Ashes Of Destruction… Previous entry: This Is The Movement That Won The Presidency…Twice

Obvious Limitations

Policy

Matt talks about term limits:

It really does seem a bit odd that a mayor with a 67 percent approval rating should be forced from office because of a term limits law. I suppose I understand the theory that presidential-level term limits serve as a check on tyranny, but there doesn’t seem to me to be a good reason to worry about that at the local level of government.

Term limits in Ohio actually helped created a great racket for the continuation of legislative political machines - State Representatives and Senators are term-limited to eight consecutive years of service (one can serve eight years, go away, and run again and serve another eight years).  What happens far too often is that a soon-to-be-term-limited official “retires” a few months early, allowing a successor in the same party to take over the seat in a low-information, low-turnout election and run as an effective incumbent in November.  It doesn’t get new, fresh faces in office - it simply gets handpicked, identical politicians in gerrymandered seats.  It’s worse than lifelong incumbency, in a way, because it allows political parties to game elections in order to ensure the results they want.  It also tends to ensure that you get a lot of politicians who are simply biding time for their next job rather than doing the current one.

Legislatures and executives are different, however; I can see the case for executive term limits a lot more easily than I can legislative limits, particularly given the scope of power executives have over appointments and administration.

 

------

Registration is now required! We're still in the process of getting it all squared away, so for the moment don't forget to Login or Register using the links in the upper left menu before starting to write your comment.

Posted by Jesse Taylor on 08:25 PM • (7) Comments

I always thought term limits were a crock because if someones sucks just vot them out. THAT’S the term limit.

I am also WAY to idealistic.

Comment #1: Mark  on  07/07  at  08:55 PM

It’s pretty much damned if you do, damned if you don’t. Without term limits, you have local executives who run places for 20-30 years; with them, you have local kingmakers who do the same thing. But usually the expiration of an incumbent gives at least a little breathing room.

Comment #2: paul  on  07/07  at  09:40 PM

We have term limits in NY City for both the mayor and the city council.  Federal prosecutors have recently uncovered a long term practice of the city council whereby its members would allocate city funds to non-existent groups and then later secretly distribute these funds to organizations (do you think they were seeking some?).  Anyway the city council president (an aspiring future mayoral candidate) all but admits that she was aware of the practice (she claims to have ordered it to stop; there is no evidence that she referred herself or her cronies to appropriate prosecution).  The New York Times
has characterized the “embezzlers’ ball” thusly:
“. . .the Council’s longtime practice of appropriating discretionary funds to nonexistent organizations, which has allowed the speaker and other council members to tap the money later for favored programs without the mayor’s approval. On Wednesday, the United States attorney for the Southern District, Michael J. Garcia, said the budget maneuver was part of a system that “lacked controls and accountability.”[http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/17/nyregion/17council.html?_r=1&ref=nyregion&pagewanted=all&oref=slogin]
Our very popular billionaire mayor does not seem interested in these goings-on, but is interested in removing the term limits law so that he and this merry band of miscreants can seek futher public funds to feather their private interest nests.
Of course there are really no reasons for term limits.

Comment #3: hicks  on  07/08  at  02:31 AM

“Our very popular billionaire mayor does not seem interested in these goings-on, but is interested in removing the term limits law so that he and this merry band of miscreants can seek futher public funds to feather their private interest nests.
Of course there are really no reasons for term limits.”

Considering this happened in spite of the term limits laws, I don’t really see your argument.

In Michigan, we voted them in the early 90s (2 terms for gov, 6 years for state rep, 8 years state senate) and the main result has been that the lobbyists in the Lansing have grown in importance because they know how to operate the state government apparatus much better than the average rep or senator.

One big reason the term limits were enacted was the former chair of the state house appropriations committee, Dominic Jacobetti. For over forty years he represented part of the Upper Peninsula, which has been the poorer and more economically depressed part of the state since the end of World War I. The late Jake funneled money north into the U.P. at a hilarious clip and got things built like a doomed football stadium for Northern Michigan University in Marquette. (Known as the Yooper Dome, it’s the largest wooden dome in the world, dontcha know) He also got state support for things like hospitals and roads. He had a couple of other members of what was called the U.P. Mafia, although Jake was smarter and more honest than the others.

Philosophically, I’m opposed to telling the voters, at all, whom they can elect. Having Jim Trafficant in congress is a joke, but the idea that the house of representatives can tell whatever yahoos elected him that they know best is a bigger one.

Maybe it’s just because I’m a Yooper, but I don’t think having a bunch of people who don’t know what they’re doing running Lansing, plus the violation of what I think should be the right to vote for whatever idiot you in your own idiocy think you should vote for, is really worth the end of Jake’s depredations.

Comment #4: witless chum  on  07/08  at  08:09 AM

I’ve typically thought term limits were a good ideas, though my take is a bit different fomr what I have seen outside of Caliofrnia.  Instead of setting the limit for a given legislative body (ex: Senate or House of Reps), set it for that legislative body in general. 

I figure on the Federal level 18 years is plenty of time to get established and some major legislation passed.  This could be 3 senate terms, 9 house of rep terms or some combination of the two.  I don’t imagine it would be very difficult to apply this on a state by state basis either.

This solves incumbents sticking around for decades keeping new blood out and allows representatives time to learn the ropes.

Comment #5: MDK  on  07/08  at  10:45 AM

Ideally, we shouldn’t need term limits—Mark’s first comment pretty much on target on that regard—but in a practical sense, yeah, sometimes we do.  I know that y’all hate George Bush and loved Bill Clinton, but without term limits, do you realize that the man would be running for his fifth term right now?  Note that Hugo Chavez is trying to get the Venezuelan constitution amended so that he can continue in office.

Perhaps mayoral elections are the place where term limits are needed the most; too many of our cities have huge, one-party political machines who keep the same crowd, if not the same man, in power forever.

Comment #6: Dana  on  07/08  at  12:34 PM

I know that y’all hate George Bush and loved Bill Clinton, but without term limits, do you realize that the man would be running for his fifth term right now?

And since the man can read his PDBs, 9/11 wouldn’t have happened and we wouldn’t have been at war until 2005, when Belgium launched a nuke prototype at Providence, RI. But that’s a whole other hypothetical.

If Clinton staying in office would have saved the lives of a million Iraqis, several thousand Americans, and who knows how many Afghans, then I reckon that would have been a better situation than where we are now.

Comment #7: pepito  on  07/08  at  07:21 PM
Page 1 of 1 pages
Commenting is not available in this channel entry.