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Next entry: Moving on Previous entry: The Height Of Simplicity

Verbatim Sarah Palin

ChoadsRace

After Obama won the primary:

“So Sambo beat the bitch!”

Apparently.

Update: Oh fine, if you insist I behave responsibly, I’ll point out that this is just one story, with less-than-authoritative sourcing. It may be that Sarah Palin is utterly racially tolerant and feministically upright.

 

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Posted by Auguste on 09:52 PM • (66) Comments

You don’t understand ... most Americans WANT a vice/president they can hunt moose, drink beer, and shout racist / sexist slurs with.

... okay, that started off as sarcasm

Comment #1: Joshua  on  09/05  at  10:01 PM

Damnit why wasn’t this on tape and YouTubed??? ARGH!

I guess she learned from George Allen.

Comment #2: Ben D.  on  09/05  at  10:04 PM

Truely, a trustworthy site this www.laprogressive.com.

Thank you for bringing it to my attention.

May I return the favor…..

www. believeeverythingyoureadontheinternet.com

....the real truth.

Comment #3: Bagley  on  09/05  at  10:08 PM

I find it harder and harder to be shocked by anthing to do with this woman.  She is completely over the top in every (negative) way possible.

Comment #4: GumbyAnne  on  09/05  at  10:08 PM

Well, Ben D., to be fair, it was apparently overheard in a restaurant, so take it as you will. But there’s plenty of character references which seem to lend it credence.

Comment #5: Auguste  on  09/05  at  10:09 PM

If we don’t have audio, no one will believe it. Still, I’m praying Palin is stupid enough to have a YouTube moment before this is all over. I can almost smell it coming.

Comment #6: Ben D.  on  09/05  at  10:10 PM

That doesn’t mean *I* don’t believe it. I most certainly do.

Comment #7: Ben D.  on  09/05  at  10:10 PM

Bagley,

One will never go broke underestimating the racial sensitivity of Republican-style “just folks.”

Comment #8: Auguste  on  09/05  at  10:10 PM

Bagley, I agree that it (like her) should be fully scrutinized to make sure it’s legit. 

If it’s not, maybe she’ll have a taste of all of the nonsense Obama has to deal with on a regular basis.  If it is, then well ... color me not shocked.

Personally, I thought the “Kilkenny letter” was bogus until it was confirmed today.

Comment #9: Joshua  on  09/05  at  10:14 PM

But then she staged a huge grandstand play of line-item vetoing countless projects, calling them pork. “They were restored because of public outcry and legislative action,” the aide said. “She vetoed them mostly because she had no idea what they were or why they were important.”

I’ve had bosses like this. Cut it all and see if anyone complains.

Comment #10: Hector B.  on  09/05  at  10:15 PM

One thing I’ve learned from Palin though is that Alaska is truly crazy-go-nuts land. I’ve visited Alabama and Utah, and they were weird places. Alaska sounds 100 times weirder.

Comment #11: Ben D.  on  09/05  at  10:17 PM

To an outsider, it would seem hard to do, but an oil-rich town with zero debt on the day she was inaugurated mayor was left saddled with $22 million of debt by the time she moved away to become governor

The dems need to be bringing this up every three seconds. Why aren’t they?

Comment #12: Sophist FCD  on  09/05  at  10:32 PM

“Alaska sounds 100 times weirder.”

Put that aside and visit Denali….after the tourists are gone (or before they arrive). Beautiful. Awe-inspiring.

Comment #13: Bagley  on  09/05  at  10:33 PM

Oh. My. Christ.

Comment #14: Maureen  on  09/05  at  10:37 PM

I’m doing the Fox News dodge.  Start with “some say” and follow with a question.

Some are saying that Sarah Palin uses ugly racial and gender slurs.  Is Governor Palin a foulmouthed bigot?

Comment #15: Donna  on  09/05  at  10:42 PM

Oh, I’m sure the scenery is outstanding. It’s the politics that sound like they’re from a two-bit kleptocratic developing country.

Comment #16: Ben D.  on  09/05  at  10:43 PM

Sarah Palin - not even remotely racially tolerant or feministically upright.

Sourcing this story as evidence of that - one of the reasons that we progressives are often derided as loony lefties.

Is it true?  I wouldn’t be surprised.  Does it strengthen the argument to vote for Obama amongst those who weren’t already going to vote for him?  Not even a teeny-tiny bit.

I hope this doesn’t get brought up outside the progressive blogosphere (unless stronger evidence lending to its credibility arises) - it would probably hurt Obama more than help him.

Comment #17: DTG in STL  on  09/05  at  10:51 PM

And not just any developing country—the more I hear about Palin, the more she reminds me of the king of Swaziland or some similarly absolutely deluded and insane autocrat of a seriously minor banana republic.

Though, on the other hand, I’m back from Louisiana convinced that a quarter of the states in the union would be third world backwaters if they weren’t fortunate enough to be a part of the US. 

COUGH *Confederacy* COUGH

Comment #18: The Opoponax  on  09/05  at  10:51 PM

Yup. The Confederacy, had it won and become independent, would have been the South Africa of the West.

Comment #19: Ben D.  on  09/05  at  10:57 PM

But hey, don’t worry. Sarah Palin says we can seceded again—and this time there may be a good reason if she becomes President.

Comment #20: Ben D.  on  09/05  at  10:58 PM

If she is as openly racist as the article claims, I would not be surprised if there was a video or something floating around with her saying really, really nasty shit.  Bigots really let it loose if they are surrounded by people who never call them on it.  If she uttered the word “sambo” in public, can you imagine what she says in private? 

Wanna bet some angry in-law with a score to settle will produce a video with her casually saying some racist crap?

Maybe she’ll have a “macaca moment” on the campaign trail.

Comment #21: Cat Ion  on  09/05  at  11:38 PM

Is it true?  I wouldn’t be surprised.  Does it strengthen the argument to vote for Obama amongst those who weren’t already going to vote for him?  Not even a teeny-tiny bit.

Won’t help against the true-believers who’d vote for the Republicans no matter what. But there’s nothing wrong with reminding non-racist voters of any political stripe that the current crop of Republicans is entirely devoted to the causes of racism, sexism, homophobia, and hate of all types.

Comment #22: Scott  on  09/05  at  11:53 PM

And hate of “Cosmopolitan” things, whatever the hell that means. I think the highlight of that whole convention was seeing the three-time divorced, gay pride parade marching, pro choice former Mayor of New York City denounce…wait for it….places like New York City.

That and Mitt Romney standing in front of that bloodlust-red screen ranting about eastern elitists, even though he’s the former Governor..of….Massachusetts.

Comment #23: Ben D.  on  09/05  at  11:59 PM

Sadly, it makes you like you’re grasping at straws & are scared of this woman’s potential to to take the election. This site is usually better than that.

Comment #24: dooflow  on  09/06  at  12:03 AM

It’s not surprising that they try to get away with massive illogic, nonsensical appeals (“We’re going to bring change to Washington! — By doing the same stuff the current loser has been doing for the last 8-years!”), and newspeak (“We’ve invaded Iraq and we’re planning to invade Iran to bring Peace, Freedom, and Democracy to the Middle East!  We’re protecting The Constitution by dismantling major parts of it!). 

After all, when you’ve gotten away with it for as many years as they have, why not try it again…

Comment #25: MikeEss  on  09/06  at  12:15 AM

You usually lose be trying to imitate the other guy. People buy the name brand, not the store brand. That makes me cautiously optimistic.

Comment #26: Ben D.  on  09/06  at  12:19 AM

@The Opoponax:

the more I hear about Palin, the more she reminds me of the king of Swaziland or some similarly absolutely deluded and insane autocrat of a seriously minor banana republic.

Yup. Sounds like the U.S. At least, you know, the U.S. lately.

Comment #27: mr_subjunctive  on  09/06  at  12:42 AM

Sorry, I’m buying into this one until there’s some corroborative evidence this happened.  Something this strident and over the top deserves better than a semi-anonymous post on “dick and sharon’s la progressive blog”.  Hey, dick and sharon might have the story of the year or they could be blowing smoke up my ass.  I have no way of knowing.

Which isn’t to that statement seems impossible.  Given mccain’s documented outburst’s these statements alleged to made by palin are lightweight stuff.

What’s the line about “it would be foolish not to speculate…”?

Comment #28: ice weasel  on  09/06  at  12:43 AM

And in other news, they finally forgot to euphemize “uppity”...

http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2008/09/obama_uppity_southern_congress.html

Comment #29: Well, what?  on  09/06  at  12:54 AM

Man, do I wish we’d let that fuckin’ Confederacy go. Just imagine the nice, liberal republic we’d have. And those hayseeds would owe us tons of money.

Comment #30: felagund  on  09/06  at  01:25 AM

Isn’t there an alternative-history book where the South wins the Civil War, becomes independent, and then allies with Kaiser Wilhelm’s Germany for World War I?

Comment #31: FlipYrWhig  on  09/06  at  01:45 AM

This won’t go anywhere unless there’s tape of it.  I think Palin is being polished right now by the best of Republican spinmasters so I doubt she’ll have any kind of macaca moment.

Comment #32: Unstable Isotope  on  09/06  at  01:47 AM

“I think if both sides can keep away from the blog rumors (and others) it will be a good race.”-Me from another thread.

This is exactly what I’m talking about. If you believe this one you’re dumber than Conservatives would have everyone believe you are.  Most of you who have commented on this one aren’t that dumb, I know you’re not, I read your posts almost every day.  You definitely have your opinions on politics but I refuse to think you’re that stupid.

“...racism, sexism, homophobia, and hate of all types…”- Scott

I’m a Republican and I’m no racist, sexist, nor homophobe and in general I don’t hate anyone although their are a few individuals I just don’t like.  Most of my friends are Republicans and they are none of those things either, it’s a dangerous thing when you try to shove people into the little box of your narrow mind.

Comment #33: Jason  on  09/06  at  02:02 AM

If you believe this one you’re dumber than Conservatives would have everyone believe you are.

OMG you’re so right!  How stupid can you be to agree that a great many conservatives and/or Republicans, especially those of the stripe who happily preach hatred and distrust of anything different from a narrow view of acceptable society (vegetables and education are elitist, big cities are evil, feminists murder babies, atheists are devoid of morality, gays and lesbians are perverts, ad fracking nauseam…), are also likely to use racist or sexist slurs in public, especially when they think nobody who matters would ever find out. 

Seriously?  What Palin is alleged to have said is pretty much par for the course in terms of basically every conservative I’ve ever met.  While “Sambo” is a little much, I’ve heard worse from rather moderate family members who’ve simply had the misfortune of buying into the noxious far-right controlled society they grew up surrounded with.  And “bitch”?  If you seriously think no Republican has ever referred to any woman, any strong/powerful/successful/confident woman, or Hillary Clinton specifically, as a bitch, I’m pretty sure that either you’re deaf or we live on different planets.  Because outside of the effete and cosmopolitan PC/liberal social circles I’ve chosen to limit myself to, calling someone a bitch is only slightly less common than blowing your nose or pouring a cup of coffee.

When the whole point of your political party is reveling in bigotry and indiscriminate petty hatred, people tend to think you’re a petty and hateful bigot.  It’s funny that way.

Comment #34: The Opoponax  on  09/06  at  02:23 AM

Both Jason and The Opo are 100% right, and I both apologize and don’t.

No snark, either. I should have paid more attention to what the technorati references were saying before I posted the link (i.e. that all the references were pointing back to the original story), but I also hope that the story is followed up by reporters on the ground in Juneau, since it’s in character for Republican leaders. Or if not the exact restaurant dinner story, the suggestion raised: That people who know Governor Palin, know her to have used racial slurs.

Comment #35: Auguste  on  09/06  at  02:28 AM

A much as I would like to believe every word of this story I can’t. There are no attributions, no sources, no citations, no nothing.

Does the story have the ring of truth to it? Yes. Having lived in small towns I know small town people and politics and this does have the ring of truth. However since no one is willing to go on record, this whole story could be fabricated.

Is it verifiable? No.

And yet on the same page is this http://www.laprogressive.com/2008/08/25/why-i-won’t-vote-for-john-mccain/

An actually relevant article about how being a POW does not qualify one to be President and why this particular POW should not be President. Written by a POW who actually served with John McCain.

How did you overlook that one?

The quality of Pandagon has gone downhill since Auguste and Jesse have taken a more active role.

Pam and Amanda are Major League talents. Their articles have references and the references have references. In comparison Auguste and Jesse are Bush Leaguers. They rant real good but have no backup. Pam and Amanda Rant and Back It Up.

Sorry guys, its late and I have no time for shiny objects.

Comment #36: Colorado Dave  on  09/06  at  02:34 AM

Jason:

I’m a Republican and I’m no racist, sexist, nor homophobe and in general I don’t hate anyone although their are a few individuals I just don’t like. Most of my friends are Republicans and they are none of those things either, it’s a dangerous thing when you try to shove people into the little box of your narrow mind.

Well, if you’re going to insist on voting for a political party that is openly racist, sexist, homophobic and generally hateful, you don’t really have much ground on which to claim not to be those things. If what you claim to believe is demonstrably inconsistent with what you actually do, then nobody in their right mind is going to give a flying fuck what you claim to believe.

Comment #37: Dan, Grand High Emperor of Bananas Foster  on  09/06  at  02:40 AM

Won’t help against the true-believers who’d vote for the Republicans no matter what. But there’s nothing wrong with reminding non-racist voters of any political stripe that the current crop of Republicans is entirely devoted to the causes of racism, sexism, homophobia, and hate of all types.

That’s not who I was talking about… I was referring to undecideds who haven’t yet made up their minds one way or the other.  This article won’t sway a single one of them.  And it may make them think we are as kooky as others who have written articles claiming that Obama is a jihadist Muslim.

Why?

It’s lacks verifiable credibility.

Do I believe that this could have happener?  Most certainly.  It wouldn’t shock me in the least if it were true.

That said… this article, by itself… doesn’t necessarily constitute “truth”, at least not to someone who isn’t already solidly in Obama’s corner.

I sent it to several friends whose political ideologies I don’t know, and they all said the same thing… it looks the same as a blog claiming that Obama was schooled in a jihadist madrassa.

Until something more fleshes out with this - if that happens, which I expect it won’t - I’m filing this in the “who cares?” column.  The notion that Sarah Palin is probably a racist is as shocking to me as the fact that the sun rose in the east this morning.  But if I didn’t already suspect that she had racist tendencies, this article wouldn’t do a damn thing to lead me to believe that now.  And I can’t imagine someone who doesn’t already suspect that she might be racist reading this and saying, “OMG!!!  She’s a fucking racist!!!”

And if Obama’s Campaign came out with a screen capture from this blog screaming “she’s a racist, she’s a racist!!! See! Proof!!!” it would wind up hurting him much worse than helping him, because he would get written off as a kook by most people.

Comment #38: DTG in STL  on  09/06  at  03:25 AM

“And if Obama’s Campaign came out with a screen capture from this blog screaming “she’s a racist, she’s a racist!!! See! Proof!!!” it would wind up hurting him much worse than helping him, because he would get written off as a kook by most people.”

Eh?

Can someone diagram this concern trolling for me?  Please.

Comment #39: ice weasel  on  09/06  at  03:34 AM

“And if Obama’s Campaign came out with a screen capture from this blog screaming “she’s a racist, she’s a racist!!! See! Proof!!!” it would wind up hurting him much worse than helping him, because he would get written off as a kook by most people.”

Eh?

Can someone diagram this concern trolling for me?  Please.

Concern troll?

Ummm… no.  Look through my comment history, if you care to.

I’m pointing out that this type of suspect article, while many here can look at it and say to ourselves “well, that would make complete sense” is utterly meaningless and useless in the context of trying to expose Sarah Palin’s likely racist tendencies.

It reads like a Jerome Corsi piece, except that it’s coming from a progressive on our side.

Do I think Sarah Palin is probably a racist?  Yes.

Do I think this article adds even a shred of evidence to support that contention?  No.

Do I think trying to disseminate this article in the hope of “exposing” Sarah Palin’s racist tendencies would in any way be beneficial to Barack Obama?  No.

Do I think it could be potentially harmful, if it starts popping up prominently on places like DKos and MyDD without more substantial verification?  Yes.

The whole “Bristol-Palin-Is-Trig’s-Baby-Mama” meme floating around on DKos made us progressives look like conspiracy theorist idiots.

Comment #40: DTG in STL  on  09/06  at  03:48 AM

Yeah, this thing is silly. Unless it can be verified (and who knows — maybe it will be), it’s no different from the various Obama rumors. I don’t care if you “know” she’s racist; you have to prove a charge like that.

Comment #41: psmith  on  09/06  at  04:10 AM

Isn’t there an alternative-history book where the South wins the Civil War, becomes independent, and then allies with Kaiser Wilhelm’s Germany for World War I?

It sounds like something by Harry Turtledove, although I can’t recall the title.

Comment #42: Jennifer  on  09/06  at  04:53 AM

It’s amazing how, the moment that charges of racism come up, everyone suddenly turns into Edward R. Fucking Murrow.  What invisible line does saying someone is racist cross that makes people rush to the defense of the accused?

And don’t tell me it’s because of the source.  We’ve had bigger stories from smaller sources that we’ve all jumped right on.

Comment #43: Damian  on  09/06  at  05:31 AM

“Well, if you’re going to insist on voting for a political party that is openly racist, sexist, homophobic and generally hateful, you don’t really have much ground on which to claim not to be those things. If what you claim to believe is demonstrably inconsistent with what you actually do, then nobody in their right mind is going to give a flying fuck what you claim to believe.”-Dan

So every Hispanic, Asian, African-American, Jewish, Pacific-Islander or Homosexual Republican is a racist gay bashing Nazi?  It’s people like you that make Libs look like complete jack-asses.  I have friends in all of the above mentioned and all but a few are Republican and I think they might have a problem with you suggesting they’re a bunch of homophobic racists.  I do have to admit that I’m prejudice, against ignorant slow minded morons like yourself who can only parrot the opinions of others instead of actually taking the time to form one of your own.

Comment #44: Jason  on  09/06  at  07:34 AM

Jason, no one with any credibility will claim all Republicans are racists.

That said, in this age the overwhelming majority of racists are Republicans.  While this wasn’t true 50-years ago (I’m guessing they were probably much closer to 50/50), after the fight for civil rights and Nixon’s use of the Southern Strategy, basically all the racists ended up moving over to the R column.

Are there racists in other political parties?  I’m sure there are, a few here and there.  Obama’s primary run managed to find quite a few covert pockets of Democratic racists who never got the message.

Are there racist African Americans, Hispanics, Asians, etc.?  Sure, there are always a few bad apples in every group.  I have been unfortunate enough to know or know of racists of every ethnic and cultural background. And I can testify that racism is ugly no matter who is a believer.

Do I believe this story about Palin?  Not without further proof. 

Do you understand that the Republican Party has a major problem with racism?  If you don’t, you need to open your eyes…

Comment #45: MikeEss  on  09/06  at  09:58 AM

Damian your source is a waitress called Lucille who won’t give her last name. I’m not sure how you could have a “smaller” source. “Unnamed man in the pub” maybe ?

I’m sure you’ve jumped on all sorts of bullshit before - however using your past idiocy as a precedent for your present stupidity is not a sound basis of justification.

Comment #46: James Rockford  on  09/06  at  10:07 AM

“Are there racist African Americans, Hispanics, Asians, etc.?  Sure, there are always a few bad apples in every group.”

MikeEss you are wrong. According to Dr. Skakti Butler, ONLY white people are racist. By definition, POC and other marginalized peoples cannot be racist. I correct you for your own good.

Comment #47: Isopluvial  on  09/06  at  12:02 PM

Isn’t there an alternative-history book where the South wins the Civil War, becomes independent, and then allies with Kaiser Wilhelm’s Germany for World War I?

Yes.  As previously noted, by Harry Turtledove.

Comment #48: libdevil  on  09/06  at  12:22 PM

It is kind of fascinating that every time we point out the very well-documented fact that Nixon implemented the Southern Strategy to draw racist voters to the Republican Party, every conservative who posts here immediately says, “Are you calling me racist?”

Are you, personally, racist?  I have no way of knowing.  If I see you, say, quoting Steve Sailer approvingly, I might be thinking along those lines, but I really don’t know.

Is the modern Republican Party built on racism?  Yes.  That’s the way Nixon built it, and it’s been such a successful strategy that it continues to this day.  I have no idea if Nixon was personally racist (though he did seem to have a bit of an anti-Semitism problem) but the fact remains that the Republicans viewed racism as an electoral strategy.  They chose to deliberately whip up racism to benefit their party.

I suppose you can draw a line between someone who’s genuinely racist and someone who only uses other people’s racism to benefit themselves, but the end effects are pretty much the same.

(Oh, and while I would not be surprised if someone from a small town in an already isolated and insular state like Alaska turned out to be a racist, I’m going to need much better evidence than this to be convinced that Sarah Palin is personally racist and not, you know, a garden-variety Republican asshole.)

Comment #49: Mnemosyne  on  09/06  at  12:39 PM

“(Oh, and while I would not be surprised if someone from a small town in an already isolated and insular state like Alaska turned out to be a racist, I’m going to need much better evidence than this to be convinced that Sarah Palin is personally racist and not, you know, a garden-variety Republican asshole.)”

You don’t have to wait for proof!

Diversity Facilitation Training
University of Delaware
August 14,15 2007
Presented by Dr. Shakti Butler

“A Racist: A racist is one who is both privileged and socialized on the basis of race by a white supremacist (racist) system. The term applies to all white people (i.e. people of European descent) living in the United States, regardless of class, gender, religion, culture, or sexuality. By this definition, people of color cannot be racists, because as peoples within the U.S. system, they do not have the power to back up their prejudices, hostilities, or acts of discrimination.”

Sarah Palin is white.  Q.E.D.

Comment #50: Isopluvial  on  09/06  at  01:34 PM

And along comes Iso to prove my point:  when I talk about how the Republican Party has built its electoral strategy on exploiting racism, all s/he can respond with is an irrelevant clip from “diversity training.”  Because if there’s stupid diversity training out there, that proves that the Southern Strategy never existed and Nixon was just joshin’ when he set it in motion.

Iso, you really are the most useful tool ever.  Thank you.

Comment #51: Mnemosyne  on  09/06  at  01:40 PM

Thank you. Its always good to have one’s research appreciated!

Comment #52: isopluvial  on  09/06  at  02:03 PM

According to Dr. Skakti Butler, ONLY white people are racist.

Never heard of the guy. Is he another one of those fringe academics who is assumed, by the right, to “speak for all liberals”?

Comment #53: Chet  on  09/06  at  02:09 PM

Definitely not fringe…

Dr. Shakti Butler is a multiracial African-American woman - (African, Arawak Indian, and Russian-Jewish). Her work as a creative and visionary bridge builder has challenged and inspired learning for over twenty-one years. Dr. Butler is also the producer and director of the groundbreaking documentaries, The Way Home and Light in the Shadows and Mirrors of Privilege: Making Whiteness Visible, which is World Trust’s latest release.

In 1994, as Executive Director of World Trust Educational Services, Inc., Dr. Butler designed and launched Heart to Heart Conversations®, a national program of public dialogue designed to help people learn together and share deep feelings about race and culture. This program has gained recognition and been reviewed on both local and national television. Her videos serve as catalysts for dialogue and set the context for constructive conversations on oppression through the lens of race. Shakti’s work moves conversations beyond black and white and speaks to the interconnectedness of racism, classism, sexism, and homophobia.

Shakti is an inspirational facilitator, trainer and lecturer. Her work emerges from years of self-exploration, commitment to social justice and experience as a learner, lecturer and public speaker. Dr. Butler’s services are sought after by colleges, universities, public and private organizations, religious and spiritual institutions.

Comment #54: Isopluvial  on  09/06  at  02:12 PM

Um, Isopluvial, isn’t obvious to you that the USA has indeed been historically based on a white supremacist racial system, and that therefore Butler’s definition is pragmatically correct for us, here and now?

If Butler wants to suggest that under no imaginable circumstances, in a different society with a different power set-up could people not primarily of European descent possibly be racist, then I’d have to agree that she would be racist herself, because that would make sense only if one assumed that there is indeed some set of inherent, biological differences between these different bloodlines that makes Europeans but not other humans subject to this particular form of mustering social forces. I for one don’t believe that, and I bet Dr Butler doesn’t either.

(If she does, and is trying to genetically privilege African-Americans by some sort of “white devil” assumption, she has a problem, because African-Americans are largely descended from white slaveowners. She’d have to believe in some sort of virtuous “one-drop” theory of African inborn rectitude to balance that.)

If you delete the word “white” in the first sentence you have a perfectly general and true (IMHO) formulation of the mechanism of racism. It highlights the fact that not everyone “gets to” be a racist, in a practically effective sense—you have to have the machinery of society on your side first. The historical momentum of the particular racist system we have goes back a third of a millenium or so, and affects two of the three mega-societies (USA and Europe, with China being the third) that dominate the world today.

I think it is mighty unlikely that the power relationships would be reversed anytime soon. What one can hope for in our lifetimes is that the racist mechanisms will be discredited, repudiated, and perhaps largely forgotten, but this requires a new social balance of power (and would of course also be a foundation of one). At any rate, as long as racism is relevant in our society, Butler’s formulation, with its “white” and “European ancestry” tags included, is practically valid.

I don’t believe in “reverse racism,” Isopluvial. Do you?

Comment #55: Mark Foxwell  on  09/06  at  02:25 PM

I don’t believe in “reverse racism” either. I just believe that racism is possible between any individuals or groups of individuals when hateful or harmful actions are the result of perceived differences in any number of characteristics such as race, sex, gender, age, ability and so forth. I reject collective guilt concepts that designate a member of an identity group as responsible for the actions of that group whether or not they are individually guilty.

Comment #56: Isopluvial  on  09/06  at  03:05 PM

Quoting from Butler’s own PR packet “proves” that she’s a vitally important figure on the American stage?

Then again, you’re the same one who decided that an obscure professor from the University of Colorado spoke for all Democrats and liberals when he said some assholish things about 9/11, so I’m not that surprised that you’ve decided that Butler is more representative of African-American academic thought than, say, Henry Louis Gates or someone else that people have actually heard of.

Man, you just can’t stop proving my points for me, can you?

Comment #57: Mnemosyne  on  09/06  at  03:07 PM

sorry, I’m still confoozled at the phrase Arctic Arabs but then, I didn’t know that “mukluk” was a slur (I thought it was a boot).

Comment #58: ol cranky  on  09/06  at  03:26 PM

Grading Palin’s Speech: A
It was a great night for Alaskans as Governor Sarah Palin hit all of the high notes and delivered a well rounded speech that touched all of the bases.

She introduced her family, talked about her experience, talked about Alaska and how we could help the country with our energy sources and even took swipes at the media and the Obama camp in true Sarah fashion. I gave the speech an A and probably would have given it an A+, except for the fact that I know her actual record as governor too intimately.

Andrew Halcro’s blog |
http://www.andrewhalcro.com/
This is a really interesting blog by a guy who’s been watching ‘cariboo barbie’ (I love it!!!) for quite a while. There ARE good guys up there and they are fighting for their lives.

Comment #59: jean  on  09/06  at  03:36 PM

I would also add to Mark’s explanation the fact that, from a diversity training point of view, it is both valid and useful to decide that when you use the word “racism”, what you are talking about is the white supremacist hegemony that has dominated American discourse since circa 1865 (at least).  And thus “I once knew this Asian who had some pretty fucked up beliefs” is not on the agenda today.  Because using anecdata examples of individual instances where a person of color exhibited racial prejudice is a convenient way of derailing a conversation that is supposed to be about deconstructing white supremacy in the context of the workplace or community relations. 

A diversity training is generally a meeting on company time, which has been scheduled rather painstakingly, and paid for, so as to accomplish some needed goal within a group of professionals.  An agenda can and should be set for what is on topic, and what is off topic.  In the sense that most diversity training seminars are about white supremacy and the racism of white people, that is the topic that should dominate the agenda of such a meeting.  In a community where a different sort of prejudice predominates, diversity training would obviously cover different material, and I’d guess that Shakti Butler probably wouldn’t be the go-to person to lead such a seminar.

Comment #60: The Opoponax  on  09/06  at  04:12 PM

MikeEss you are wrong. According to Dr. Skakti Butler, ONLY white people are racist. By definition, POC and other marginalized peoples cannot be racist. I correct you for your own good.

I agree with this… however, I think anyone of any ethnic background can have racial prejudices, and anyone of any background can use those tendencies to unjust ends.

When I was 13 years old, I got the snot beaten out of me on a playground by a group of African-American kids a few days after the Rodney King beating.  My sin?  I’m a caucasian.

Were the kids justified in their anger at the horrific racist beating of a fellow African-American?

Absolutely.

Did that anger justify their random racially-oriented beating of a white kid simply because he was white?

Fuck no.

So yes, racism, particularly as a systemic institution, is a uniquely white phenomenon.

But racially-biased intolerance and hatred spreads across all backgrounds, and a group of black kids beating up a white kid simply because he is white is every bit as evil as a group of white kids beating up a black kid simply because he is black.

Comment #61: DTG in STL  on  09/06  at  08:27 PM

Jason:

So every Hispanic, Asian, African-American, Jewish, Pacific-Islander or Homosexual Republican is a racist gay bashing Nazi?

You’re obviously unfamiliar with the concept of tokenism. “I have a black friend, so I can’t be racist” is not a valid argument.

It’s people like you that make Libs look like complete jack-asses.

Yes, we all already know that Republicans can’t stand people who will judge you by what you do rather than by what you say. But that’s something you’re just going to have to expect when what you do is blatantly inconsistent with what you say you believe.

I have friends in all of the above mentioned and all but a few are Republican and I think they might have a problem with you suggesting they’re a bunch of homophobic racists.

Then perhaps you and your friends should stop voting for the political party that is openly promoting a homophobic, racist, sexist, xenophobic, classist, creedist and anti-intellectual agenda. The fact that you’re a bunch of self-absorbed gasbags who can’t be bothered to know or even, apparently, to care what you’re voting for isn’t proof that the Republican party isn’t a glorified whites-only water fountain.

I do have to admit that I’m prejudice, against ignorant slow minded morons like yourself who can only parrot the opinions of others instead of actually taking the time to form one of your own.

I’m sure I’m very sorry that actually reading what I actually said — and thinking about it for more than a picosecond — would cause you immense amounts of searing cranial pain. I’m sorry you don’t understand that voting for the racist party makes you complicit in racism. I’m sorry you don’t understand that voting for the sexist party makes you complicit in sexism. I’m sorry you don’t understand that voting for the homophobic party makes you complicit in homophobia. I’m sorry you don’t understand that voting for the hate party makes you complicit in hate.

But that’s on you. Don’t you fucking dare try to blame that on me. Maybe you should try taking your head out of your ass and start paying attention to what the political party you claim to identify with actually stands for. Then you might actually have something other than “surely it’s all about me, me, me, me, me” to base your arguments on. As it stands now, you’re like someone who loudly pats themselves on the back for being such a great and pure vegetarian while stuffing a fucking rack of ribs down their throat. And I do believe that there’s a special word just for that.

Of course, I say all of this knowing full well that you probably don’t give two stale shits about who you’re actually voting for, so long as they have an R next to their name.

Comment #62: Dan, Grand High Emperor of Bananas Foster  on  09/06  at  11:02 PM

Just to chime in: racism is systemic and embedded in institutions. Bigotry is an unreasonable personal prejudice.

Individual members of a minority group could increase racism for their peers within said group for personal gain—and, by definition, for the gain of the majority—but outside of that circumstance it is, indeed, impossible for the target population of racism to be racist. For blacks to be racist in the U.S., they’d have to run the major institutions of the country then create a pogrom against whites.

But anybody can be a bigot. Of course, bigotry is mostly silly. Racism slowly murders thousands and can disenfranchise millions. So the difference is staggering.

And, btw, voting for racists makes you a racist. Voting for people who back racist policies makes you a racist, too. Racism has no emotional component. You don’t need to be a bigot to be a racist. A white person can say, “well, yes, it’s unfair that latinos don’t get a fair shake, but I’m happy I get a free bennie.” That person is not a bigot, but he is a racist. Racism is what you do, take advantage of, or allow to occur. It has nothing to do with what you feel. To paraphrase (with emphasis on the “para”) Franklin, it picks your pocket and breaks your leg. (And destroys your ballot. And reduces your economic opportunities. And. . .)

You may now return to your scheduled mewling of republican racists insisting that racism they support doesn’t make them racist.

Comment #63: No One of Consequence  on  09/07  at  12:30 AM

For blacks to be racist in the U.S., they’d have to run the major institutions of the country then create a pogrom against whites.

We had an interesting situation here in Los Angeles that does actually fit your criteria:  an Indian-American doctor was refused a promotion to be the head of emergency medicine at King/Drew Medical Center because the administrators said it would look bad to the community for a non-African-American to hold the post.  They eventually gave it to a black doctor whose specialty was not emergency medicine.  There were also lawsuits by Latino/a employees making similar allegations.*

This is, I think, the exception that proves the rule:  racism is what happens when you use the power of an institution to benefit your own group.  Bigotry is what people do on an individual level.

* Of course, the racism problem at King/Drew was pretty much the least of their problems.  You’ve probably heard it referred to as “Killer King.”

Comment #64: Mnemosyne  on  09/07  at  02:52 AM

As a former Alaskan who knows most of the politicians up there and has been watching Alaskan politics for twenty-some years, I feel I may have more insight on Palin than most commenters here.  And while I do not doubt that Palin harbors racist tendencies and supports ‘accidentally’ racist programs, I sincerely doubt that this quote is real.  Sounds like something Don Young would say, but not Palin.

No, I am not supporting Palin for VP or for any other national (or state) office.  She was elected in the first place because Frank Murkowski’s rating was lower than any governor in our history, state or territorial, not because the public thought she was qualified.  Alaska is quite conservative, and she was the best of some bad options.  But she’s smart, she’s professionally nice, and she’s always on, which means she’s not the sort of person to make a comment like that, especially not in a restaurant.  And that particular comment?  Doesn’t sound like the sort of thing she would say ever.  Again, I do think she is racist in Butler’s terminology, and further, I think she is committed to protecting forms of racial privilege in the guise of the Christian family, traditional values, a Protestant work ethic, equal treatment (such as equal “heating fuel assistance” to people in Anchorage (mostly white) and the bush (mostly Native) although oil in the bush costs six times as much), etc.  But that type of racism allows her to pretend to herself that she isn’t racist, while “Sambo” doesn’t.  She isn’t from the generation or good-old-boy culture that thinks that sort of thing is normal, and it just doesn’t sound like her.

That said, I totally believe the accusations in Andrew Halcro’s blog, including this one:
http://www.andrewhalcro.com/shadow_governor
It’s completely in line with Palin’s conservative Christian beliefs, and unlike Lucille-the-imaginary-waitress, Halcro is willing to put an important and well-respected name behind his accusations.  When Halcro was in the State House, he was a moderate committed to working with both sides of the aisle,.  He continues to be an active member of the community and a respected political figure who frequently publishes op-eds in the Anchorage Daily News.  Let’s stick to repeating credible sources, shall we?

Comment #65: Kua  on  09/07  at  01:43 PM

Charley James is standing by his story, and he describes the way that he got the story on his blog: http://thepoliticalcurmudgeon.blogspot.com/2008/09/sarah-palin-and-me.html

This is one of those stories that, for the moment, is difficult to prove. There is no tape. Perhaps the story will be corroborated, or others will come forth with similar (corroborated) stories. In the meantime, the author is holding his ground. If Governor Palin would come out of hiding (or study hall) to answer questions, we might get more information. Perhaps a more important issue here is her complete unsuitability for the job of VP. When asked, before all of the national attention, what she thought about the surge in troops in Iraq, she said she really hadn’t kept up with any news about the war in Iraq. No amount of sequestering her for intensive lessons in how to be a VP is going to change tha fact that she did not give a damn about national or international issues until last week. Maybe she still doesn’t care, but desperately wants the job.

Comment #66: Lynn  on  09/07  at  07:22 PM
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