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Next entry: No cops, no parks, halted economic activity: conservative paradise Previous entry: The Pray In Jesus Name Project: ‘defending our troops against open homosexual aggression’

Well, at least he admitted it’s about opposing contraception

What’s interesting in this otherwise stunningly dishonest op-ed column by Ross Douthat about sex ed is that he casually admits that abstinence-only education is about attacking contraception, a practice that 98% of American women have engaged in at some point in their lives.  And by virtue of this, that means that the Bush administration and that anti-choice movement that promoted abstinence-only and required that schools teach it to get federal funding for sexuality education were anti-contraception as a matter of policy and ideology.  Attacking contraception while claiming to be all about abortion is a classic right wing move, and under the Bush administration, it became the standard conservative stance.  Douthat, I think somewhat accidentally, admits this briefly:

None of this renders the abstinence-versus-contraception debate pointless.

But it’s just a quick moment of letting the reader in on the fact that “abstinence” was a nice way of saying “anti-contraception”, which abstinence-only mostly was about—-denying that contraception was effective.  Sometimes they did this with overt, factual lies, like claiming that condoms have small holes in them, that contraception fails more than it does, or that marriage was better protection from HPV (and therefore cervical cancer) than condoms.*  But even when they were forced against their will to provide correct information about contraceptive failure rates, they engaged in broader lies, what Douthat would call “values”, no doubt, but are verifiably false: that women don’t get horny, that men have no self-control, that abstinence prevents heartbreak, and that contraception doesn’t prevent heartbreak.  We were so busy dogging antis for their factual lies that we very rarely engaged this last lie, which is a pretty big one. Abstinence-only programs were big on suggesting that contraception was not only not a factor in minimizing emotional fallout from one’s adolescent romances imploding, but that it made it worse.  If you think about how big a lie this is, it’s stunning—-at the end of the day, they’re suggesting that your adolescent love affairs will cause less emotional damage if you get an STD or unintended pregnancy.  Or, I guess the claim was without contraception, you won’t do it, but that’s also a giant whopping lie, as the vast majority of human history demonstrates, as does our teenage pregnancy rate today.  The truth that the sex-phobes are trying to squish is that contraception does help protect you emotionally, because your body is you, and bad things happening to it can be emotionally devastating. 

Anyway, Douthat’s argument is a classic incoherent one: Abstinence-only is irrelevant, so we should get to have it.  Or, that Alabama should teach their kids not to use condoms, but those hippies in Berkley can do what they want.  At its core, this “local control” argument is fundamentally about arguing that women and children are property, as you can see with the “leave it to the states” crap with abortion.  And that if men in Alabama want to force their women to have babies, but men in New York are softies who want to give the women a little more power, then that’s a state-by-state decision.  But at all costs, we should avoid suggesting that women themselves have rights.  That’s crazy talk. 

And it’s the same discussion with “local control” over the “right” to lie to children in order to convince them not to use contraception.  It presumes children are property, and that different states should be able to dispose of children how they see fit.  But I don’t think children are disposable!  A child in Alabama should have the same right not to get an STD as in New York.  And that’s what is at stake.

Of course, Douthat denies this, suggesting—-using really poor logic—-that abstinence-only doesn’t effect teenage pregnancy or STD rates.

Predictably, the rare initiatives that show impressive results tend to be defined more by their emphasis on building social capital than by their insistence on either chastity or contraception. A 2001 survey published by the Alan Guttmacher Institute, for instance, found that “most studies of school-based and school-linked health centers revealed no effect on student sexual behavior or contraceptive use.” The exceptions included an abstinence-oriented program with a strong community-service requirement, and a comprehensive program that essentially provided life coaching as well as sex ed: participants were offered “academic support (e.g., tutoring); employment; self-expression through the arts; sports; and health care.”

Note that this is prior to abstinence-only education becoming the functional law of the entire country, pushed on schools by the Bush administration, and based mostly on texts put together by Christian organizations that have very little respect for basic reality.  But honestly, I’ll be the first to say that for most kids, choices are made from values and culture, due to influence from parents, religion, and peers.  But Douthat is being dodgy—-“very little” impact on teen pregnancy is still impact.  A “very little” bump in the teenage pregnancy rate can mean tens of thousands of girls nationwide.  And it’s really rich to suggest that kids who are straight up told in school that condoms don’t work aren’t going to remember this lie when they’re doing what kids do, which is finding excuses to go without condoms. 


What Douthat is trying to deny and avoid is that after years of telling kids that condoms don’t work, some of them are beginning to behave as if they believe condoms don’t work, and the result is a rise in teenage pregnancy and abortion.  As someone who claims abortion is life-taking, you would think that Douthat wouldn’t write off this uptick as meaningless, as he does—-a 3% rise in teenage pregnancy means many thousands more abortions.  If he actually thought that was baby-killing, he’d be demanding comprehensive sex education in every school and condoms in every bathroom.  But if he was motivated by hostility towards sex and women’s liberation, he’d write this incoherent piece trying to defend a system that’s raised the percentage of teenage girls who get pregnant every year by 3%.

But I think my favorite lie he tells when trying to conceal how likely it is that abstinence-only education causes this is the “blame it on Clinton” gambit.

In reality, the numbers show no such thing. Abstinence financing increased under Bush, but the federal government has been funneling money to pro-chastity initiatives since early in Bill Clinton’s presidency. If you blame abstinence programs for a year’s worth of bad news, you’d also have to give them credit for more than a decade’s worth of progress.

Sure, if abstinence-only looked the same under these administrations.  But it didn’t!  The Clinton initiative, while shameful, was a relatively small amount of money that went to various programs here and there, but was not intended to replace comprehensive sex education.  The Bush administration required every high school in the country to replace comprehensive sex education with abstinence-only, on pain of getting this huge funding cut. Many states were so devastated by the rising teenage pregnancy rate that they finally said no to the money, which is nearly unheard of in federal grant-giving. 

Functionally, what Douthat is arguing is that if someone steps on your little toe and then someone else comes along and crushes your foot with a sledgehammer, the first guy hurt you just as badly.  It doesn’t compute.  If Douthat wants to quote the Guttmacher, he should look at the extensive research they put in to looking at why pregnancy rates declined in the 90s. The research on this shows that the most important factor in the declining birth rate was improved use of contraception, followed by a greater willingness to use abortion and a small dip in the amount of sexual activity, because kids are delaying first intercourse.  But anti-choicers shouldn’t take credit for that last one! As Mark Regnerus’s research shows, the kids most likely to delay first intercourse are the very kids who are least likely to be told to abstain until marriage—-atheists, Jews, and mainline Protestants waited the longest.  Evangelical Christians had sex at younger ages.  The abstinence message in religion is actually linked to younger intercourse, probably for the mundane reason that kids who don’t get respectful sex education aren’t equipped to delay sex until they’re ready by fooling around.

It’s absolutely true that most kids’ decisions are based on culture and family values. I agree—-which is why I can’t help but repeatedly point out that anti-contraception values lead to younger sex and more pregnancy.  But what you hear in school has a small influence on your decisions, and the funny thing about pregnancy is it only takes one time.  One time when you don’t have a condom and you think about how you heard in school that they don’t work anyway.  Plus, sex education in schools helps send signals about larger community values.  Comprehensive sex education signals, for instance, that girls are valued for their minds and their health, not just as life support systems for reproductive functions.  And we know that girls that feel valued are more likely to make future-oriented choices. 

*One of the biggest problems with this claim is that it’s situated in a culture that fetishizes female virginity.  Very few women who wait for marriage marry men who did, as anyone who grew up around evangelical Christians could tell you.  But they’re encouraged to think the ring protects, but as their husbands have had sex before, they’re probably going to give them HPV.  The virus is so common, remember, that all women are assumed to have it and get annual screenings for HPV-caused cancers.  And that includes virgins-when-married.

 

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Posted by Amanda Marcotte on 10:54 AM • (63) Comments

Here in Ontario we have, for some reason, a parallel publicly-funded Catholic school system, which I went through. The sex ed curriculum was part of religion class.  In Grade 9 we were given an 8 1/2 x 11 sheet of paper with a drawing of a sperm and an HIV virus on it.  The sperm was the length of the paper, the virus only about a centimetre across.  At the bottom of the page it said:

“If a condom can’t stop you from getting pregnant, how do you think it’ll stop you from getting AIDS?”

Also featured in that class were the “you can get pregnant through your bathing suit”, “birth control pills don’t really work and will give you cancer” and “if you have an abortion you’ll probably die” handouts. 

I was lucky - I’m naturally cautious and nerdy, so when I started to get sexually active I went to the public library and looked up how to use condoms in Sex for Dummies.  The girl who sat next to me in Grade 9 religion wasn’t so lucky.  She got pregnant that year and dropped out of school. 

15 years later it still makes me so angry.

Comment #1: KristinMH  on  02/01  at  12:33 PM

Amanda, you had too much comedy gold to choose from, but there was also this nice bit in Douthat’s column:

If the federal government wants to invest in the fight against teenage pregnancy, the funds should be available to states and localities without any ideological strings attached.

Funny how he didn’t apply this principle to the Bush era abstinence-only ideological madness that wreaked amazing harm of the kind you document.  Federal funding for abstinence only and nothing else. 

Typical wingnut double standard: When I’m in power, I get everything I want and I get to keep my jackboot on your neck.  When you’re in power, awww, can’t we just get along, with diversity ‘n all?

Comment #2: Unree  on  02/01  at  12:45 PM

KristinMH, you can thank my grandmother-in-law for that curriculum. I’m so sorry, but if it helps, all her grandkids are atheists & secular humanists.

If I recall correctly, the Catholic School board is a hold-over from the days when the only schools in Ontario were run by the church, and unfortunately, their existence is enshrined in the Canadian constitution. This in despite of their funding being a human-rights violation. Fund all, or fund none.

Anecdotally at least, the pregnancy rates in Catholic schools are astronomically higher than in public schools. Public-school sex ed from the time period you reference was okay, and included demos of things like the sponge & foam. I wish it could spend more time on healthy interpersonal interactions surrounding sex, but I’m just an optimist that way.

Comment #3: tikitik  on  02/01  at  12:50 PM

We just reverted control of sex ed curriculums down to the county level, because state legislature didn’t want to have the abstinence-only fight. On the one hand, it is a quiet overturning of abstinence-only mandates, which I appreciate. On the other hand, it pretty much ensures that counties with a culture of contraception will continue on the way they’re going, and counties where the female drop-out rate is twice as high as the male will too.

Comment #4: purpleshoes  on  02/01  at  12:58 PM

I have had sex with only one man in my life and he is now my husband.  I have HPV.  Where do you think I got that?  Maybe fundies would blame it onthe fact that we had sex before we were married.  If we had waited untilt he wedding night I would have been protected by the ring magic.

Comment #5: GumbyAnne  on  02/01  at  12:59 PM

To take your point to the next logical level, Unree, the argument is, “When you’re in power, can we at least keep our teenage girls pregnant, but when we’re in power, all your adolescent uteruses belong to us!”

Comment #6: Amanda Marcotte  on  02/01  at  01:00 PM

Having graduated from high school only four years ago, I went through the Bush-era abstinence-only sex ed. We were indeed told that condoms are porous and totally let sperm and viruses through. The speaker told us all about how various birth control methods don’t work, and concluded with the statement, “The only sure way to prevent pregnancy is abstinence.” Technically true, but then, the only sure way to prevent a car accident is to never get in a car, but people still do it. And then you still might get hit by a car while you’re walking down the sidewalk, which I guess is the car-analogy equivalent of being raped and getting pregnant.

Fortunately, I didn’t really absorb the message about condoms being useless, but the three couples I knew who got pregnant apparently did.

Comment #7: Triplanetary  on  02/01  at  01:08 PM

Maybe if fundies weren’t completely bugfuck nuts and stopped obsessing about sex their kids wouldn’t have sex so early.

Comment #8: Entomologista  on  02/01  at  01:13 PM

Back in 2007, I had an “exchange of views” on a pro-abortion/anti-choice blog (ie, the political position of the blog was against providing contraception and against safe legal abortion) and one response in particular has typified for me the moronic thinking of the pro-abstinence crew:

Me, arguing for prevention of abortion via sex education/provision of contraception:

In 2001, in the US, the pregnancy rate for women aged 15-19 was 79.5 per 1000 women, and the abortion rate was 22.8 abortions per 100 pregnancies (that is, out of every 100 teenagers who got pregnant, 22.8 of those pregnancies were aborted).

In 2001, in the Netherlands, the pregnancy rate for women aged 15-19 was 8.7 per 1000: the abortion rate was 4.2 per 100 pregnancies.

So, you prefer the higher abortion rates in the US caused by denying teenagers contraception? Interesting.

Incidentally, with regard to under-15 sex:

In the Netherlands, the number of abortions performed on girls under 15 was 0.3% of the total number of abortions carried out in the Netherlands that year - just over 100. (Given that a girl under 15 ought never to carry a baby to term, it seems likely that these 100 abortions on girls under 15 in 2001 represents nearly the total number of under-15 pregnancies in the Netherlands that year - I could find no statistics at all on under-15 births.

In the US, in 2001, the birthrate for girls 14 or younger was 3.9 per thousand. The abortion rate for girls 14 or younger was 4.1. The pregnancy rate was 9.2. Out of a population of 1,982 000 (total number of girls aged 14 in the US that year) 18,280 of them became pregnant, 7,781 gave birth, 8,130 had abortions, and 2,370 had miscarriages.

The Netherlands has 1/20th of the US’s population, and if they had the same teen pregnancy rate as in the US, they would have had about 914 abortions, total. They had 102.

You prefer the US system? You need to explain why you think it better to have a higher abortion rate…

Pro-abstinence-education moran:

Yes, there are teenagers who have sex, but that number is much smaller than television and the movies would lead you to believe. And since teenagers cannot be legally accountable for their actions, it is stupidity itself to encourage abortions without parental notification or consent. But we’ve had this argument before and you lost it then, as well.

In case you missed that; the moran is arguing that it doesn’t matter what the figures are in the US for teenage pregnancy/abortion, because there just aren’t that many teenagers having sex, soo…

Comment #9: Jesurgislac  on  02/01  at  01:22 PM

Did anyone grow up and receive sex education in Alabama? I’m sure Douchehat doesn’t quote any folks from Alabama in his article but I’m curious because Alabama is home to a Trojan’s condoms factory. (Well, unless Trojan outsourced this work to a foreign country) I’d like to know what they teach in the school district where parents are employed by a condom manufacturer. Do they tell those kids that condoms don’t work?

Comment #10: DC Fem  on  02/01  at  01:31 PM

I was bored one day so I ran the numbers on abstinence-only education and teenage pregnancy rates, using numbers from SIECUS for the former (dividing that by the number of pupils per state to get a per-pupil number) and Guttmacher’s latest study for the latter. I didn’t find much of a correlation (it was a positive correlation, as we on this blog would expect, but the R-value was 0.11 or so). So while your point that everyone ought to have access to comprehensive sex ed is a good one, the data actually kinda agree with Douthat here - there really isn’t much correlation between abstinence-only education and teen pregnancy.

Now what I didn’t find were any statewide numbers on comprehensive sex-ed funding, nor did I have the patience to break it down by district. If anyone out there has a place where I could find those numbers I’d be happy to crunch those.

Comment #11: Jeff  on  02/01  at  01:31 PM

Tiktik, good to know who’s responsible.  wink

Speaking of high rates of pregnancy in Catholic schools.  there were at least two or three girls in every grade of my high school who had babies and stayed in school while parenting.  More dropped out or were home-schooled, and who knows how many had abortions.  When I was in grade 12 a grade 9 girl went into labour and had her baby in the school gym.  And they were afraid telling us about contraception would encourage us to have sex.

Comment #12: KristinMH  on  02/01  at  01:54 PM

That moronic response to Jesurgislac’s post also missed the other key point—children don’t stay children. I wasn’t having sex in high school, but that didn’t make my comprehensive sex-ed course useless. I really needed that information a few years later, in college! If you don’t teach comprehensive sex-ed in high school, then when the hell are adults supposed to learn about contraception?

(Yes, yes, I know, they aren’t. This is a stealth run at Griswold, using the squickiness people feel at the idea of their kids having sex as a cloak.)

Comment #13: Llelldorin  on  02/01  at  01:55 PM

My experience would support the idea that a huge part of what sex ed in schools does is set up the ‘culture’ in which people think.  In my school (public school in Ontario, up here in Canada), mandatory sex ed was a grade-nine thing, which lasted one week.  I was sick for four out of those five days, so when I got back, I saw the handouts and then had to write the test.  Though I remember vaguely charts from the local health unit detailing all the different STDs you could get, and I was told some of what went on in class discussions (apparently, our teacher could rattle off the nutritional info on a teaspoon of semen because she was asked every single year), I basically missed all formal sex ed.  Since everyone else had had something like that, though, and since I was hanging out with a fairly sex-positive group of friends, I absorbed most of the practical knowledge around.  I walked out of highschool thinking sex-only-with-condoms, abstinence works but so does being careful, and never try to give a blow job in a hot tub because the chemicals get up your nose.  No formal education, but a lot of fairly open conversations with well-educated girls my own age, and an open internet connection.  It didn’t stop us from getting drunk and horny at parties, but it did mean we knew how to deal when we did, and that seems like a pretty good knowledge base to go out into the world with.

Comment #14: fluffster  on  02/01  at  02:01 PM

I’m a relatively recent American high school graduate—5 years ago—and I can affirm that, at least in Florida, the state of sex education in public schools was horrendous. We had a “health” class which taught the biology of sex…and literally nothing else. Not even lies about condoms and oral contraceptives; birth control wasn’t even mentioned (typical high school movie scenes like the one in Never Been Kissed were baffling to me). We had a pretty high in-high-school-or-immediately-after pregnancy rate. At the time, I was not even close to being sexually active, but man I was I ever grateful to the Internet and the public library a few years later when I was considering having sex for the first time. And there are plenty of teenagers without access to that kind of information outside of school, for a variety of reasons.

Comment #15: Menshevixen  on  02/01  at  02:06 PM

The idea that virginity saves you from heartbreak as a teen is absurd, as any teenager, virgin or not, could tell you.

Comment #16: blondie  on  02/01  at  02:27 PM

“We federalize the culture wars all the time, of course — from Roe v. Wade to the Defense of Marriage Act.”

Interesting. I was not aware that human rights were cultural. Thank you for educating me Douthat.

Comment #17: Ladyshalott  on  02/01  at  02:28 PM

the data actually kinda agree with Douthat here - there really isn’t much correlation between abstinence-only education and teen pregnancy.

“Useless, but doesn’t make things all that much worse” isn’t exactly a ringing endorsement of Douthat’s preferred policies.

Comment #18: rea  on  02/01  at  02:30 PM

rea @#18: the data certainly don’t say “abstinence-only works,” but I read Douthat’s point as “abstinence-only doesn’t actually do anything.” I’m in agreement there that blaming abstinence-only for the uptick in teen pregnancy isn’t supported by the data. But again, I didn’t crunch the data for comprehensive sex-ed, so I couldn’t say if the other half of Douthat’s point - that comprehensive sex-ed doesn’t do anything either - is actually true.

But yeah, that exceedingly mild positive correlation is hardly a good thing for abstinence-only advocates.

Comment #19: Jeff  on  02/01  at  02:52 PM

Maybe if fundies weren’t completely bugfuck nuts and stopped obsessing about sex their kids wouldn’t have sex so early.

But then they’d have to come up with some totally different reason to be creepy obsessive nutjobs about their kids and sabotage their lives.

If you can’t spitefully fuck up your kid’s lives in compensation for your own inadequacies, whose life CAN you spitefully fuck up in compensation for your own inadequacies??

Comment #20: Dan  on  02/01  at  03:05 PM

If you can’t spitefully fuck up your kid’s lives in compensation for your own inadequacies, whose life CAN you spitefully fuck up in compensation for your own inadequacies??

I just spit Pepsi on my keyboard, very funny

Comment #21: John Rove  on  02/01  at  03:11 PM

I don’t remember much about my high school sex ed, except that it came way too late.  I know we briefly covered STDs and condoms, but were strongly discouraged from having sex.  The problem was that most of us in the class were already having sex.  I have a lot of issues with popular teen magazines, but one great thing about them is that they teach about safe sex.  I started reading Seventeen when I was about 11, so I at least knew about condoms and STDs when I started having sex.  My high school waited until junior year, which was too late for some people.

Comment #22: bananacat  on  02/01  at  03:13 PM

Jeff, that’s way oversimplifying things.  It’s true that religion and parenting affect a kid’s choice whether or not to delay sex or use contraception more than school, but the numbers also show that kids exposed to anti-sex messages in those contexts have sex at younger ages and use less contraception.  Having those lies reinforced in the school environment may have a minor overall effect, but that doesn’t mean no effect—-a 3% bump is nothing to sneer at. 

But the minor uptick is the focus, when the focus should also be on the plunge downwards of teenage pregnancy rates since the 50s, and a huge plunge downwards in the 90s.  You know, right when the children of the people who first got comprehensive sex education introduced to them started to become adolescents.

The point is that acceptance or non-acceptance of fact-based, sex-positive discussions of sexuality can create cultural change.  Douthat isn’t wrong that this is a fight over culture.  But we’re fighting for an overall culture that promotes health and rights, and every brick in the structure matters.

Also, if you lie to kids about shit in school, they pay less attention overall to what you have to say.

Comment #23: Amanda Marcotte  on  02/01  at  03:17 PM

“If you can’t spitefully fuck up your kid’s lives in compensation for your own inadequacies, whose life CAN you spitefully fuck up in compensation for your own inadequacies??”

I thought that was why we’re in Iraq and trying to go after Iran, right?...

Comment #24: MikeEss  on  02/01  at  03:20 PM

The irony is always that those that want to teach sex-ed are forcing their “loose” values/morals on unsuspecting “good, church-going” children.  In contrast, those on the side of the bible-condom (abstinence) are “not” trying to force their values on children.

What Turdblossom2 fails to mention is the statistics of those in the abstinence-only frame of mind may slightly delay sexual activity, but are worse about protecting themselves during intercourse.  Or that rates of teen pregnancy tend to be higher in Christian-fundie areas. 

There is some truth to abstinence-only not being the sole fault, however, couple that with inaccessibility to birth control, plan B, etc. and lack of a sympathetic adult to talk to and what does that leave us with? 

What’s great, though, reading the column are the comments that overwhelmingly call out Turdblossom2.

Comment #25: avoidswork  on  02/01  at  03:34 PM

The abstinence-only folks are usually the same ones who think “Duck and cover” will protect you from a nuclear bomb.  Magical thinking is always fun, but we need reality in the classroom.

Comment #26: Blue Jean  on  02/01  at  03:45 PM

Yet another article by Douthat wherein he obsesses about the sexuality of teenage girls.  I don’t know about y’all, but I’m seeing a pattern here.  How long before he shows up on republicansexoffenders.com?

Comment #27: DonnaDiva  on  02/01  at  03:47 PM

I find Douthat rather troubling ever since the “chunky Reese Witherspoon” story. Either he’s a massive closet case or an Ed Gein wannabe (hopefully minus the murdery bits); either way, his attitudes towards sex are manifestly unhealthy.

Comment #28: BrianX  on  02/01  at  03:58 PM

Amanda @23: yeah, I realize it’s quite the oversimplification. I’m an engineering researcher, that’s what I do. But there’s still a value in that analysis, and it’s in saying that abstinence-only isn’t causing the uptick teen pregnancy. Like I said, though, I’d like to get numbers for comprehensive sex-ed and see what effects it has. You’re right to say that it’s the overall cultural change that’s the important part, but it’s probably more the case that culture gives rise to abstinence-only, and that AO didn’t really change the culture at all.

DonnaDiva @27: About three years, as long as there isn’t a switch to comprehensive sex-ed before then, because then the girls will get on the pill and thus Mr. Douthat wouldn’t be able to get it up.

Comment #29: Jeff  on  02/01  at  04:02 PM

Also, if you lie to kids about shit in school, they pay less attention overall to what you have to say.

Yeah, this is exactly right.  In elementary school, my teachers explained to me that if I so much as touched a match or lighter, my house would burst into flames and my entire family would die.  They told me that any candy that wasn’t in an individual wrapper would turn out to be a deadly lookalike drug.  One teacher literally told me that if I glanced at a solar eclipse, I would go instantly an permanently blind.  By the time I got to high school “health” class, I realized that I had to account for an exaggeration factor, and that drinking one sip of alcohol, smoking a single cigarette, or kissing a boy before marriage probably wouldn’t kill me, get me pregnant, and shame my entire family all at the same time.

Comment #30: bananacat  on  02/01  at  04:02 PM

It was mentioned in a comment thread at Balloon Juice that he wrote a memoir about attending Harvard and admitted that if a girl said she was on the pill he was instantly turned off the idea of having sex with her.  According to Wiki he is married and it says “he and family live XXX” which may mean they have children.  (I pity them, if that is so.)  He is definitely a piece of work.

Comment #31: PurpleGirl  on  02/01  at  04:07 PM

That’s a good point—given that Douthat has an anti-contraception fetish, how much should his sexual issues drive our national discourse?

Comment #32: Punditus Maximus  on  02/01  at  04:17 PM

“That’s a good point—given that Douthat has an anti-contraception fetish, how much should his sexual issues drive our national discourse?”

I agree, but let’s face it, the national discourse is driven by a series of people with sexual issues.  Rush Limbaugh?  Maureen Dowd?  Half (or more) of all Republican politicians, with a handful of Democrats sprinkled in for flavor?

Douthat is a douche.  But we have so many douches littering America’s political landscape, what’s one more?

The people who understand can filter out his bullshit.  The people who don’t basically can’t be helped, unless somehow the Republican Party gets some sense of sanity back.  And that doesn’t appear to be likely any time soon.

And don’t forget, as long as there is a solid set of SCOTUS justices who are devoted to using their rulings to dictate our private behavior, we can eliminate all the idiots like DouchHat and ultimately it won’t matter.  We’ll get the Gilead they want whether we want it or not…

Comment #33: MikeEss  on  02/01  at  04:38 PM

What really bugs me is the number of parents who either don’t teach their kids anything about safer sex and contraception (and dispel the lies the schools are teaching) or reinforce those lies at home.  What is wrong with people?

Comment #34: keshmeshi  on  02/01  at  04:39 PM

I agree, but let’s face it, the national discourse is driven by a series of people with sexual issues.

Well, yeah, but everyone has sexual issues.  If we made being completely healthy in these matters a requirement for public speaking, you’d only be hearing crickets.  And they’re lousy sex educationists.

But let’s face it - whenever I see someone ranting about Teh Teenagers having Teh Sex, I strongly suspect them of diddling some dewy-eyed intern somewhere.

Comment #35: Phoenician in a time of Romans  on  02/01  at  04:58 PM

I tried to locate an article on it and couldn’t but I recall hearing an interview on the radio a few years ago with some health expert who compared the rates of unplanned pregnancy and STDs in the US with those of countries like Sweden.  She said what they found was that, unsurprisingly, the rates were much higher in the US up to about age 25 or so, at which point they leveled off to be on a par with more enlightened countries.  The conclusion was that it was due to a combination of maturity and self-research and that it was unfortunate that America, generally speaking, was doing such a disservice to our young women. 

I think that rather than just comparing trends in the US, any research on the efficacy of sex ed programs should also compare us with other countries who seem to be doing a better job at it.

Comment #36: DonnaDiva  on  02/01  at  05:12 PM

I think that we should publicize Douthat’s fear of contraception, because it would encourage a lot more people to use it.  Imagine a pill that could not only prevent pregnancy, but also prevent creeps like Douthat from hitting on you.

Comment #37: bananacat  on  02/01  at  05:32 PM

A few weeks ago I was yelled at by a family friend because I gave his 14 year old daughter a box of condoms, EC, a notecard with a few sex ed websites on them, instructions on how to clear her internet browser, and very honest, forthright answers to the 90 minutes’ or so worth of questions she had.  Well, I think I was only yelled at the for the condoms since I threw away the EC box after she swallowed the pills so her dad couldn’t have known about that.  She’s “too young” to be having sex so what does she need condoms for, he asked me. 

I agree with him entirely, really.  Hearing about 14 year olds having sex makes me feel uncomfortable too and hopefully our conversation helped her find the agency to say no in the future because she really didn’t want to do it that one time.  Somehow, hearing “just say no” for her entire life didn’t help her actually say no because, as catgirl eloquently pointed out, she’s been told hyperbolic bullshit from adults for so long that she doesn’t even listen to it.  When someone wanted to have sex with her, she didn’t believe her “no” because she didn’t have any personal, empowering reason to not want to do it, so she said “yes” instead. 

I’m absolutely not the person teenagers should talk to about sex, either.  I’m too feminist, too opinionated, too preach-y.  There’s a reason I’m not a teacher and it’s because other people are way better at age-appropriate discussions of sex than I am.  This is the not the first time, or the second, or the third, that I’ve had to re-educated some teenager about condoms not actually having holes in them and I’m getting very pissed off about it.

Comment #38: stubbles  on  02/01  at  06:08 PM

When I took junior high sex ed classes in Indiana about, oh, twelve years ago, they told us that birth control pills sorta kinda worked, but we would get fat if we took them. Obviously the subtext was “And if you’re an overweight woman, you might as well just kill yourself,” but this was a pro-life community that didn’t explicitly encourage that kind of thing. Anyway, I guess it was okay to tell us that birth control pills worked because as everyone knows, fat women are unfuckable and thus probably won’t get pregnant. I tested this oral contraceptive/unfuckability hypothesis later on and found it faulty. However, while conducting my experiments, I discovered that sex is awesome, especially on the Lord’s day.

Comment #39: pajmahal  on  02/01  at  06:26 PM

I’m absolutely not the person teenagers should talk to about sex, either.  I’m too feminist, too opinionated, too preach-y.

It sounds like you’re the perfect person that teenagers should talk to sex about.  They don’t need someone to talk to them in an “age appropriate” way, because that usually comes off as condescending or reduces down to “don’t do it”.  They need to hear the facts in a straight-forward way, because whether we like it or not, it’s their bodies and their choices and we have to give them all the information available so they can make the best choices for themselves.  And it sure would be nice if society in general would trust them to make the right choices; we just might be surprised when they do something right.

Comment #40: bananacat  on  02/01  at  06:32 PM

‘… the funds should be available to states and localities without any ideological strings attached”

So where is Douthat’s columns condemning the Hyde and Stupak amendments?
I cant seem to find them

”… as you can see with the “leave it to the states” crap with abortion …

Aye, “leave it to the states”, but with federal laws against “partial birth” abortions, crossing state lines for an abortion, a fetal life amendment to the fed constitution, etc etc

See also Lincoln’s Cooper Union speech, “they wont let us leave them alone”

Comment #41: jefft452  on  02/01  at  06:58 PM

Jeff, my point is that just because abstinence-only education’s impact is insignificant compared to the impact of the larger culture doesn’t mean it doesn’t have some impact.  The 3% bump in teenage pregnancies is, from what I glean from Guttmacher’s people, probably due in part to abstinence-only education.  Which is to say that most of the teen pregnancy rate is still attributable to other causes, but then you have the 3% on top of that. 

More to the point, I think that many years of comprehensive sex education from the 60s on has lowered the teen childbirth rate, and the very narrow focus on abstinence-only “working” or not working distracts from that.

Comment #42: Amanda Marcotte  on  02/01  at  07:00 PM

I think I can offer a useful perspective on what conservatives really think about this issue: upper middle class and wealthy conservatives who send their kids to pricey private schools do not put up
with that “abstinence only” bullshit when it comes to sex education. The classes are comprehensive and very detailed and completely without the “condoms have holes in them and birth control pills fail” propaganda.

Comment #43: Tyro  on  02/01  at  07:09 PM

It presumes children are property, and that different states should be able to dispose of children how they see fit.

Its amazing, reading Nixonland, how much of the 60s culture wars was about “parental control.”

Comment #44: bay of arizona  on  02/01  at  07:59 PM

The truth that the sex-phobes are trying to squish is that contraception does help protect you emotionally, because your body is you, and bad things happening to it can be emotionally devastating.

Question: Is getting pregnant a “bad thing happening to your body”?

Comment #45: Uhura, The Black Gurl  on  02/01  at  08:02 PM

Question: Is getting pregnant a “bad thing happening to your body”?

Well, I know I’d be worried…

Comment #46: Phoenician in a time of Romans  on  02/01  at  08:06 PM

Getting pregnant when you don’t want to be pregnant or have a child? That’s absolutely a bad thing happening to your body. And I say that as someone who’s pregnant at this very moment. Honestly, as much as I want the future child, I’m still wouldn’t call pregnancy good.

Comment #47: Av0gadro  on  02/01  at  08:34 PM

Question: Is getting pregnant a “bad thing happening to your body”?

I’d be psyched! I’d already be counting all the money I was going to make on basic cable.

Comment #48: felagund  on  02/01  at  08:57 PM

Fortunately, I didn’t really absorb the message about condoms being useless, but the three couples I knew who got pregnant apparently did.

I went to high school in the early 90’s in San Francisco. I was part of a group of students to work for free condom distribution at our high school. Much to my fourteen year old, sexually inexperienced, rather shy, chagrin I became known as Condom Girl. And while we did encourage girls to go to Planned Parenthood to get other forms of birth control to double up we ALWAYS used the correct failure rates. Our program talked about why condoms usually fail, incorrect use, but we didn’t try to scare them with false data or playing up the failure rate. Only one girl got pregnant in my class of 1000. We paid special attention to getting girls to speak up for themselves. We discussed everything from pausing before sex to say,“Let me put this condom on you first” to flat out saying “You can put the condom on and we can have sex or you can go home.” But inside the health ed classes they always prefaced everything with “The only way to protect yourself 100% is abstinence.” While also focusing on how you could be one of the small fraction of a percent that make up condom failure even when used correctly.

That led to an unexpected consequence for me. Girls and some guys started to come out of nowhere to ask me all kinds of questions. As I started having sex and became more comfortable in sharing information (mostly I stopped blushing all over) more kids came to me throughout my four years in high school asking for all kinds of information. I started to feel like Phoebe Cates’ character in “Fast Times at Ridgemont High.” And of course, I also got the slut label. The main thing I learned from all of this that seems to allude the abstinence only crowd is if you lie or exaggerate you lose all credibility and they stop listening to you. It’s condescending to teach abstinence only and they stop listening to you. And most importantly teens are PEOPLE.

Comment #49: shakahi  on  02/01  at  09:04 PM

Oh sorry Amanda already made my point at #23. And with fewer words.

Comment #50: shakahi  on  02/01  at  09:13 PM

Suppose you are the ideal student that the ab-only crowd envisions—you only get your knowledge of sexuality from them, and you act, over time, exactly in the way they say they intend to encourage.

So they don’t teach you about contraception, or really much besides the bare-bones mechanics of reproduction (and a well-tended sense of shame), because they figure greater understanding of these things will encourage you to do the nasty before you get married, and they want you to wait until you’re married.

So you wait until you’re married—and then what? Knowledge about contraception etc. spontaneously enters your brain, like in Dollhouse?

Even on their own terms—that sex should wait until marriage—they fail. If you came into marriage with only the preparation for sexual expression you got from an ab-only curriculum, you’d be unable to function as an adult in an adult role.

One more reason, I expect, why states that are biggest supporters of ab-ed tend to have the highest divorce rates.

Comment #51: Molly, NYC  on  02/01  at  09:49 PM

Even on their own terms—that sex should wait until marriage—they fail. If you came into marriage with only the preparation for sexual expression you got from an ab-only curriculum, you’d be unable to function as an adult in an adult role.

Correct. It’s a feature, not a bug.

Comment #52: Babieca  on  02/01  at  10:12 PM

One of the things you get from abstinence-only is learned helplessness. Everyone is going to fail. So no wonder kids don’t have the self-esteem they need to take care of themselves properly.

Comment #53: paul  on  02/01  at  11:12 PM

Abstinence education is of a piece with the whole zero-tolerance approach that school administrators seem so fond of. Often it’s fear for their own skins that motivates it for non-sexual behaviors (one big lawsuit can bankrupt a modest-sized school district) but the modality fits, so sex ed becomes indistinguishable from D.A.R.E.

Comment #54: weirdnoise  on  02/02  at  12:04 AM

You know, in theory I think a whole, healthy reproductive health curriculum would cover all aspects of sexual life, including continuing pregnancy and giving birth, the role of breastfeeding, et cetera, without trying to scare people into keeping their pants on because Babies Are Scary. I feel like straight-forward information about pregnancy and childbirth is enough to convince you that you don’t want to do it on a whim - the more interactions I had as a teenager with women who’d given birth and breastfed, the more impressed I was with how important it was to choose to reproduce because you were ready, for whatever value “ready” might have in someone’s individual life.

That’s very different from “you stay a virgin or you become a syphilitic teen mother immediately”, needless to say.

Comment #55: purpleshoes  on  02/02  at  01:14 AM

I went to high school in the Clinton years, so we didn’t do the abstinence things.  My sex-ed in health class was fairly comprehensive, with a print out of various types of contraception and their real failure rates.  Of course, sex-ed in health class was like ... a week in freshman year.  Dozens of girls had babies anyway. 

I think the most useful thing was a seminar that may have been laced with abstinence overtones, but not in a religious way.  More in a, “If you’re not ready for sex, you shouldn’t have sex” way.  And I totally get behind “abstinence education” in that regard.  Knowing when to say no and how to say no with confidence.  I don’t think all teenage girls don’t want sex, but I do think a great many feel pressured into it.  And because of that I think it’s important to equip young women with ways to respond in that situation, to have confidence to say no even if he’ll break up with her, to demand respect, demand condoms, etc. etc. etc.  And free vibrators.  Every 16-year-old should get a free vibrator with a sentimental pink booklet.  Like when you’re 9 and you get the free pads and at 11 we got free deodorant. 

Anyway.

The abstinence set go about it all wrong.  You don’t tell people they can’t have sex.  That doesn’t work.  See, my mother is so pro-sex it’s weird and uncomfortable.  When I was 5 she told me about masturbation.  Why?  I dunno.  When I was 9 or so she started showing me where she kept the condoms.  Why?  I dunno.  When I was 11 she told me what oral sex was.  Why?  I dunno.  She also decided to tell me around this time that if I ever got pregnant she would make me have the baby and she would raise it.  And all this condom-showing continued for a very long time.  And then it was, “When you finally have sex, I want you to tell me all about it.”  (Did I mention it was uncomfortable?  Yes.)  She told me this a bajillion times too.  And in the end, when I told her I was asexual (at age ... 22?) she cried and screamed and threw a fit.  Did I have sex?  No.  My brother got similar treatment and he didn’t have sex til he was ... 25, I think.  And he indulged my mom and told her and she told EVERYONE.  I bet he’ll never ever have sex again. 

The end.

So you see, don’t tell kids not to have sex.  Tell your kids that not only do you want them to have sex but you want them to have lots of sex from a young age, tell them all about your sexual habits with Dad, and then demand details when they do have sex.  I almost guarantee they will not have sex for a long, long, long time.  If ever.  (And my mom’s Catholic.  She told me she only got married to my dad so she could have sex, but I think that was somewhat of a lie that she told in a fit of rage.  She also would rage at me that all my friends only got married to have sex, since they were “no sex til marriage” types like her.  She did this to try to make me feel inadequate for having not had sex.  I don’t really understand my mom.  She’s sorta nuts.  Sorta really.)

Comment #56: BonAppetit  on  02/02  at  12:04 PM

my mom’s Catholic.  She told me she only got married to my dad so she could have sex, but I think that was somewhat of a lie that she told in a fit of rage.

My mother was also Catholic, she told me that half of the women who graduated with her from Notre Dame Girls School, San Jose, CA in 1954 married so they could find out what sex was all about, so your mother was being quite truthful on this occasion.

Since we already knew about the mechanics of sex, my sister and I were exhorted about the social effects in different ways by our Mom.

When I was dating a fellow drama student in HS, Mom would remind me that her father was a Navy Veteran, and, more ominously, “He has a shotgun, you know.”

My sister would be reminded about the Planned Parenthood and how she could get contraceptives without Mom’s consent or knowledge whenever they drove by it, much to Sis’s chagrin.

I don’t really understand my mom.  She’s sorta nuts.  Sorta really.)

I would keep my distance from her, emotionally and physically, a nice card for birthdays and holidays would be appropriate.

Comment #57: Dark Avenger Guardian Chow Mein  on  02/02  at  12:39 PM

It occurred to me during the midst of the Bristol Palin scandal that conservatives don’t really care that much about teen sex, as long as there is an implicit shotgun wedding as a consequence. What they object to is sexual autonomy. They object to sex without the ability to coerce women into marriage.

Comment #58: CBrachyrhynchos  on  02/02  at  02:47 PM

I always think of my 8th-grade science teacher when this subject comes up. This was Michigan in ‘92 or ‘93 or so. We had pretty good sex ed, as I recall, that covered various BC options. He made the point to say that pulling out should not be used as bc because “you’re feeling pretty good right about then and you aren’t going to want to stop.” This from a very jolly, grey-bearded grandpa-ish man. While we all were hugely icked out at the time, it certainly stuck with me and, I hope, with my classmates.

Comment #59: Shiny  on  02/02  at  02:53 PM

I started reading Seventeen when I was about 11, so I at least knew about condoms and STDs when I started having sex.  My high school waited until junior year, which was too late for some people.
Comment #22: catgirl

This. If it wasn’t for Sassy I don’t know if I would have made it through that time. And, despite my mom’s best efforts to turn me into a fundie - I didn’t have sex until college. But I was knowledgeable about what to expect, etc.

Comment #60: Danica Lefse Queen  on  02/02  at  09:17 PM

Has everyone seen this poll yet?  (pulled from Kevin Drum’s blog)

http://www.motherjones.com/files/images/Blog_Poll_Republicans_January_2000.jpg

Republicans apparently are in favor of banning contraception, despite what Dana says.

Comment #61: Crissa  on  02/02  at  09:37 PM

We had pretty good sex ed, as I recall, that covered various BC options. He made the point to say that pulling out should not be used as bc because “you’re feeling pretty good right about then and you aren’t going to want to stop.”

Or as Billy Connelly put it (IIRC) -  “When my bum wants to go *this* way, it’s going to take a team of wild horses to make it go *that* way. Not the fucking Pope waving his finger at me.”

Comment #62: Phoenician in a time of Romans  on  02/02  at  09:51 PM

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Comment #63: wuwei  on  02/07  at  06:08 AM
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