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Next entry: I’m not buying this coincidence story Previous entry: People of the 5th Congressional district in NC, please boot embarrassment Virginia Foxx out

WNBA’s Mystics say no to ‘kiss cam’ because it might capture two women kissing

EconomyLGBTSports

Sports teams usually cater to the fan base. In the WNBA, if you are in the front office of the Washington Mystics, the rule is you make sure your base doesn't exist in the stands. Guess it’s easy when you think, as one reader put it, “two women in love is analogous to aborting a fetus.” (OutSports):

“We got a lot of kids here,” Sheila Johnson, the Mystics’ managing partner,  said when asked last week at a game. “We just don’t find it appropriate.”

The article goes at length to show what they don’t find appropriate is people of the same-sex kissing, talking to fans, management and players. One of the Mystics’ players predictably compares being gay to abortion:

“We wouldn’t broadcast on our Jumbotron about abortion issues because of the religious and political conflicts it would cause,” said Lindsey Harding, the team’s point guard. “It’s a similar, sensitive subject. We don’t want to put anything out there to turn down certain fans.”

This is outrageous. Unfortunately, what's also disappointing (but not surprising) is that this thinking is governed by the bottom line on a couple of fronts. From the WaPo piece.

This is a seminal, scary time for women's professional sports. Ten years after Brandi Chastain's ab-crunching moment in the women's World Cup ushered in a new era of empowerment, less than half of the LPGA Tour's 29 events have secured sponsorship for next year. Though attendance numbers are up in Washington, the league can barely pull in an average of 8,000 people per game and many of its arenas hold 20,000.

It's understandable that a financially shaky league is outright terrified it could alienate a chunk of its fan base if two same-sex people shared a chaste kiss on a video scoreboard.  

Apparently the lesbian fan base is irrelevant and kept in the closet,  based on the fear of the unknown and need for cash; the league counts on sponsorship from anti-gay Exxon/Mobil. But sadly, the league is not the only entity looking the other way.

As Cathy Nelson, the Human Rights Campaign's vice president, said in a phone interview, "Sheila and the Mystics have been nothing but supportive in our mind, showing up at all our dinners, events, even bringing the whole team once."

Why is it acceptable to HRC that Mystics fans are purposely closeted by the organization? It's not supportive, that's for sure.

The dilemma here is do you ask a league to risk its survival on a guessing game about public tolerance over innocent same-sex bussing at a game?  What if they are wrong —when will they know it's acceptable to a sufficient number fans to turn the camera onto a lesbian couple during a game? It's safe to say that the league is always going to be under the financial gun and fighting to stay afloat, so what is the magic metric that needs to be reached? I'm not convinced that this policy is driven solely by financial concerns, but it's not fair to portray the policy of hiding a strong fan base of women because of their sexual orientation or gender presentation (which you know is in an issue in the mix).

 

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Posted by Pam Spaulding on 01:00 PM • (40) Comments

SLC used to have a WNBA team and it was fairly well supported.  But the PR people were absolute idiots.  I tried to get them to do a half-time thing with a young lady who was from my Elks Lodge who’d beaten 200,000+ other girls in her age group in the National Hoops Contest (free throws, 80+ straight).  We offered to pay transportation and lodging etc., for a little two-minute demo.  Not interested even though she’d been on the front page of the SLC Tribune.  Eventually, through incompetent management, the team moved/was sold.  Feh.  I’m still pissed off about it.

The young lady in question was in the women’s NCAA Sweet Sixteen this year, by the by.  Feh.

Comment #1: Magis  on  07/29  at  01:24 PM

“Is this dangerous?”

...well, it’s self-evident, isn’t it?...

Comment #2: MikeEss  on  07/29  at  01:26 PM

From what I understand, there are gay players in the WNBA. Any bets as to how long it takes them to speak out on this?

This sounds to me like they are saying “We don’t want gay people to be fans of our team and come here and spend their money so that we can remain a viable sports team.”

Comment #3: Mark  on  07/29  at  01:32 PM

Amanda Hess at the Washington City Paper has a post up about this, and I think she makes a good point—if KissCams at sporting events were to start showing same-sex couples just as they do opposite-sex couples, it would eliminate the traditional KissCam homophobic joke: turning the KissCam on two men in the crowd and provoking audience laughter as they either blush awkwardly or make some big goofy show of protest. http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/blogs/sexist/2009/07/27/mystics-kisscam-would-be-too-gay
Personally, I think KissCams are creepy in general and put people in an awkward position (being shown on it is a fear of mine at ballgames). But if they’re going to do it, for goodness’ sake, show same-sex couples too!

Comment #4: Caro13  on  07/29  at  01:33 PM

It is acceptable to HRC because Sheila Johnson is a billionaire and they want her money. That group doesn’t seem especially interested in promoting gay rights if it gets in the way of their attending cocktail parties and hob nobbing with the Washington elite.

Comment #5: DC Fem  on  07/29  at  01:34 PM

Pam, Pam, Pam, don’t you know the truth? If an image of a same-sex couple kissing appears on a screen, Jesus swoops down from Heaven and chops the screen to little bits with a hatchet. And then kicks a puppy, for fun. Given that, the Mystics’ decision is common sense - who wants to reassemble the Jumbotron after every Kiss Cam?

I would have posted this sooner, but I had to put my computer screen back together, and take my neighbor’s puppy to the vet.

Comment #6: Jeff  on  07/29  at  01:35 PM

Caro13 - has the Kiss Cam ever tried that and inadvertently settled on an actual gay couple, who then kissed?

Comment #7: Jeff  on  07/29  at  01:38 PM

Jeff—I don’t know, but I think that would be great! Hahah. How much do you want to bet that the camera operators would nervously cut away as quickly as possible.

Comment #8: Caro13  on  07/29  at  01:42 PM

“From what I understand, there are gay players in the WNBA. Any bets as to how long it takes them to speak out on this?”

There are probably gay players and, I bet, lots of gay fans of the NBA too.  So why is it a WNBA team that’s getting all weird?

As far as the gay players go, I wouldn’t be surprised if they try to keep a low profile in order to not lose whatever they already have…

Comment #9: MikeEss  on  07/29  at  01:47 PM

<blockquote>do you ask a league to risk its survival on a guessing game about public tolerance over innocent same-sex bussing at a game?</blokquote>

These protestations remind me of all the restaurant owners and their business groups whining about no-smoking laws.

~75% of people don’t smoke, yet restaurants were terrified of banning smoking.  They had all these rationalizations about how these 25%ers drank more and ate desert and spent more money than the other 75%, and how they simply couldn’t afford to alienate them.

What happened?  Once restaurants went non-smoking, some smokers stopped going, and others left early without ordering after-dinner drinks and dessert.  But the 75% who didn’t smoke more than made up for it.  Suddenly going out didn’t mean you and your clothes would come home reeking of smoke.  You could enjoy food b/c there wasn’t smoke clogging up the experience.  Restaurants saw their revenues GO UP in the following year.

They were losing revenue by catering to a minority.

I think the same sort of thing is happening here.  We have a minority of people in this country who hate our freedoms—>they want a theocracy that follows what they believe and don’t think anyone who would be shunned by their church should be allowed out in public.

Too fucking bad.

Most Americans don’t feel that way.  If showing an occasional lesbian couple kissing causing the fundy women’s bb supporters to stay home (and, really, how many of them are there?) GOOD.  Those bigots should stay home, where they can pray for Rapture to come take them away.

But what will it take to make a business take the chance?  Restaurants were throwing money away catering to smokers, and it took a city ordinance to force them to change.

Comment #10: Caren-Sun-blocking Creator of Animorphic Pancakes  on  07/29  at  01:53 PM

If they are worried about negative reactions to people kissing, they ought to get rid of the kiss cam.  After all, there are people out there who are offended by hetero kissing, too.

Comment #11: rea  on  07/29  at  01:58 PM

has the Kiss Cam ever tried that and inadvertently settled on an actual gay couple, who then kissed?

Boy, I can imagine this might be mighty awkward for two same sex platonic friends who enjoy attending sports matches together.

If they are worried about negative reactions to people kissing, they ought to get rid of the kiss cam.  After all, there are people out there who are offended by hetero kissing, too.

Or, you know, two platonic friends of any sex who enjoy watching sports together.

The WNBA’s shoddy treatment of gays is nothing new.  I haven’t and won’t be supporting them.

Comment #12: bomberE  on  07/29  at  02:03 PM

I’ve always wanted to fool the kiss cam. A couple years ago, I went to a baseball game with my brother and his girlfriend. I said that if the kiss cam landed on them, me and my brother’s girlfriend should kiss. Didn’t happen, unfortunately.

There’s really no sane reason to exclude same-sex couples from the kiss cam at sporting events. Anyone who is uncomfortable with two lovers giving each other a little smooch should probably stay home.

Comment #13: Emily  on  07/29  at  02:33 PM

the league counts on sponsorship from anti-gay Exxon/Mobil.

When did Exxon/Mobile become anti-gay?  I mean, I don’t remember them being particularly pro- or anti- anything focused on the bible agenda.

This is a seminal, scary time for women’s professional sports. Ten years after Brandi Chastain’s ab-crunching moment in the women’s World Cup ushered in a new era of empowerment, less than half of the LPGA Tour’s 29 events have secured sponsorship for next year. Though attendance numbers are up in Washington, the league can barely pull in an average of 8,000 people per game and many of its arenas hold 20,000.

I’m sorry, but so long as we have men’s and women’s sports, the women’s events are always going to come across as Sports Lite.  You’ve got a set of very young leagues encountering all the perils of starting a new franchise that male-dominated Major League Baseball and Basketball and Football encountered, but with significantly crimped growth potential.

After all, back when sports was originally on the rise, your options were baseball or nothing in the spring, basketball or nothing in the winter, and football or nothing in the fall.  Now you’ve got year round men’s league, high budget, fully professional sports sucking all the oxygen out of the marketplace.  Women’s sports are struggling the same as American Pro Soccer and Arena Football and the rest of the second string sporting events.  It just begs the market-based question - how many people honestly want to go to see a WNBA game if they can just as easily watch a regular NBA game (or an NFL game, or a MLB game, or hockey)?

Get top tier women into men’s sports and you’ll get female athletes on TV.  But until then you’re never going to overcome the long head start men’s athletics already has on you.

Comment #14: Zifnab  on  07/29  at  02:44 PM

I read this post to my boyfriend, who pointed out that not only is it homophobic and alienating to the fan base, but lesbians kissing is a time-tested way of attracting male fans to any sort of product. Not that that isn’t wildly problematic in its own way, but if it’s the bottom line they’re worried about, women kissing isn’t the worst tactic to employ.

Comment #15: Lauren O  on  07/29  at  02:59 PM

Lookeeseehere….

8,000 average attendance isn’t bad.  It’s as good as most AAA baseball teams.  They make decent money.  They need to stop pretending they are going to be as big as the NBA someday and concentrate on what they have.  It’s a good sport and highly watchable.  They need to take care of their audience and stop trying to convert the regular NBA fans and, instead, make new WNBA fans.

I’ve been to games, they’re fun.  No, it’s not a dunk fest but it good hustle by serious athletes.  And, the ticket prices are totally outrageous like the NBA.  Yes the audience has a lot of female couples.  So?  Mystics, get your head out….

Comment #16: Magis  on  07/29  at  03:20 PM

aren’t totally outrageous

*writes 50 times on the blackboard, preview is our friend.*

Comment #17: Magis  on  07/29  at  03:22 PM

Oh please.  Kids have more flexible notions than people give them credit for ... unless that is exactly the issue here!

We were in Provincetown some years back, and our boys noticed more same sex couples holding hands while walking than they see at home.  They know such couples in their daily lives, and wondered aloud why they don’t walk hometown streets like this (although they do kiss at New Years’ Parties and election parties in our neighborhood homes).

When I explained that they may not feel comfortable holding hands at home, my younger guy, then about 8 years old, launched into a tirade about how outrageous and unfair and ridiculous and anti-American etc. that it was that married people couldn’t just be married people like their parents are married people in public when they were legally married! 

They were loud about this, and I felt a bit uncomfortable ... until the two men in front of us turned around and beamed warm smiles at them, and then walked happily along, arms around waists.

Sounds like the WNBA lives in dread fear of Katy Perry fans - or LUKCMOs (lesbians until kiss cam moves off)

Comment #18: Ms Kate  on  07/29  at  03:25 PM

”two women in love is analogous to aborting a fetus.”

Well, the two are the same in the eyes of the law ... BOTH ARE LEGAL.

Deal with it.

Comment #19: Ms Kate  on  07/29  at  03:26 PM

@Lauren O:

I was thinking the same thing.

@Zifnab:

About Exxon-Mobil’s anti-gay stance, here is an example: http://www.diversityinc.com/public/2980.cfm

Comment #20: gwrthryfel  on  07/29  at  03:31 PM

Pam left out the part of the WaPo article which pointed out that most of the loyal fan base of WNBA is made up of lesbians and hetero dads with daughters.  The worry is that the dads don’t want to have to deal with explaining that particular fact of life to their young daughters.  My own view is that it would be a perfect time to discuss same-sex couples, since they are certainly evident in the arena without being shown on the jumbotron. There might even be couples there who are in the closet of their own choice and wouldn’t be too happy about involuntary outing.  The team owners are afraid of offending anyone over something so trivial and unrelated to their sport as the Kiss-Cam.  I don’t blame them for not taking on a cause instead of concentrating on promoting their sport to the widest possible audience.

My favorite Kiss-Cam moment at an NBA game was the time it focused on one couple who were smiling but clearly didn’t want to kiss each other.  fFter several seconds, the woman mouthed “He’s my boss!” while pointing to her companion.

Comment #21: MiddleageLiberal  on  07/29  at  03:34 PM

Wait, wait, wait.  Let me make sure I’ve not lost the plot here…

Ten years after Brandi Chastain’s ab-crunching moment in the women’s World Cup ushered in a new era of empowerment…

Am I reading that right?  Are they saying that the moment of empowerment was Chastain taking off her jersey, rather than, say, her team winning the World Cup?

I’d be happy to be wrong here, but I suspect that I should have a *headdesk* at the ready.

Comment #22: damnedyankee  on  07/29  at  03:49 PM

“My favorite Kiss-Cam moment at an NBA game was the time it focused on one couple who were smiling but clearly didn’t want to kiss each other.  fFter several seconds, the woman mouthed “He’s my boss!” while pointing to her companion.”

May favorite was the “couple” that had been picked out, but they weren’t with each other and were pointing to the people they HAD come with on either side of them but the camera never moved one way or the other.

Comment #23: Mark  on  07/29  at  04:23 PM

I’m stringently anti-Kiss Cam, but I am anti-PDA, so there’s that.

Actually, I’m anti- because it’s used as a lazy comedy device at games.  It’s always used to find the 900-year-old couple in the crowd or to embarrass the teenagers sitting next to each other at the game.  And as to the question of inadvertently catching a gay couple kissing, the camera operators always look for a specific type of couple (obvious hetero couples sitting next to each other & obvious heteros sitting next to each other), so probably not.

Comment #24: bouj  on  07/29  at  04:27 PM

Damnedyankee, I think that’s just an iconic image to refer to. Like The Babe pointing at the wall rather than him trotting to home base after hitting the ball over the spot he’d pointed to. It was, after all, immediately following the cup-winning goal. But I’d have to say winning the cup was not the empowering moment in of itself. The women’s team had, after all, brought a cup home already in 1991. What was empowering was that everybody noticed in 1999.

Sucks that the women’s soccer league didn’t survive. It was far more entertaining to watch than the sad-sacks who play in the MLS. Much better to watch the best women in the world play a finesse game than watch some of the worst men in the world try and play the power game.

Comment #25: Sarcastro  on  07/29  at  04:47 PM

If they are worried about negative reactions to people kissing, they ought to get rid of the kiss cam.  After all, there are people out there who are offended by hetero kissing, too.

I have no problem with what straight people do in private, so long as they act gay in public.  I shouldn’t be forced to think about them having sex, and it isn’t right for them to flaunt their lifestyle like that.

In all seriousness, not a fan of the kiss cam myself, I have issues with making couples act cute with each other in order to prop up some popular romantic fantasy about what twu wub is.  Two people can be in love without being put upon to produce some PDA.

Comment #26: Godless Heathen  on  07/29  at  05:04 PM

On soccer: What Sarcastro said.
And I agree with Godless Heathen; I wouldn’t have any problem with straight people if they didn’t flaunt their sexuality in public.

Comment #27: lonespark  on  07/29  at  05:54 PM

The article goes at length to show what they don’t find appropriate is people of the same-sex kissing, talking to fans, management and players.

They don’t female fans talking to their female players?

And wouldn’t one (albeit regressive) solution be to tell the employee who is operating the kissing cam to just not show same-sex kissing on the scoreboard? This whole thing is as stupid as not even fielding a team because they might all just explode into one big, gay orgy on the field.

Comment #28: I Heart Puppies  on  07/29  at  08:01 PM

Sarcastro:  OK, I’ll buy that.

Also, I have an antipathy for MLS that doesn’t go to their gameplay.  It has more to do with the fact that there’s a big goddamn soccer stadium going up in Chester, a nearby urban center that’s in such dire economic straits that it doesn’t even boast a single grocery store.  The stadium’s going up on the taxpayer dime with the usual bullshit promises of urban revitalization as a happy side effect.

Said promises are shown to be bullshit by, among other things, the exit ramps being built to take people directly to the stadium, bypassing downtown Chester entirely.

Comment #29: damnedyankee  on  07/29  at  08:33 PM

When I lived in Massachusetts, I had a lesbian friend who supported the local WNBA that played in Hartford/Springfield. She came right out and said that over 80 percent of the players were gay; as were the majority of fans. She hung out with the players and said it was an ‘open secret’ but that everyone kept it hush-hush to avoid alienating sponsors and non-gay fans. The fact of a mainly gay league would be hard to sell she (and others) thought; so they were content with the stealth aspect.: get people to see the game and like it. And this was western Massachusetts; with the lesbian capital of the northeast, Northampton, Massachusetts. If they were afraid there, I can only imagine the fear in some other cities.

Oh, and that 8,000 fans figure is a bit misleading. I was told that as many as 1/3-1/2 of the tickets ‘sold’ were comps; which is, in my mind, okay as the key is to get the fans in the door.

The odd thing is that when I moved here to the south, I had a father actually tell me that he didn’t want his daughter to play basketball as the sport was filled with, you know, ‘them.’ He preferred soccer and I was trying to get her to think of ice hockey. I guess the ‘secret’ is out more than the WBNA realizes.

Comment #30: caliban  on  07/29  at  09:23 PM

He preferred soccer and I was trying to get her to think of ice hockey.

Of course! The perfect solution! Lesbians will never figure out they can join soccer teams!

Comment #31: Lauren O  on  07/29  at  09:48 PM

Gosh, we wouldn’t want to offend the average American by showing two women kissing…

(At this point, I was going to find a link about how popular lesbian themes in (straight, male-orientated)porn were, but I figured it was not a good idea to do that at work.  I think we know the answer to that one.)

Once again the friggin’ professional Church Ladies get to set what everyone else is expected to live by.  This “kiss-cam” sounds trite and intrusive, but, goddamit, it should be trite and intrusive to all equally.

Comment #32: Phoenician in a time of Romans  on  07/29  at  11:36 PM

Q: “Is this dangerous?”

A: Yes.  After seeing that photo, I was immediately struck by an overpowering urge to divorce my wife and gay marry two gay rodeo clowns and a goat.  Just think of what that photo could do if you played it in a stadium.  For one thing, we’d run out of goats.

(It always amazes me about how the “pro-family” crowd is all about loving, monogamous relationships… unless it involves two people of the same gender.  Then it’s all about how politely they can freak out about the gay, loving monogamous relationships be damned!)

Comment #33: PostScript  on  07/29  at  11:46 PM

Well, Pam, you’re from Durham (aren’t you?) so I suspect you already know this…

Lindsey Harding, the Mystics player quoted, used to play for Duke.  She was recruited by Gail Gostenkors, who was an out-of-the-closet lesbian, who has since moved on to Texas.  (I don’t know Lindsey’s sexual orientation.  I think she had a boyfriend at Duke, though.)  Duke’s main rival, North Carolina, is coached by Sylvia Hatchell, who has gone out of her way to emphasize her born-again credentials, and to emphasize that there are no lesbians on the UNC women’s team. 

After Gail Gostenkors left Duke, Duke hired Joan McCallie as the head coach.  At her introductory press conference, McCallie emphasized her commitment to family… 

Those of us who are Duke fans, and who really didn’t care about the sexual orientation of the players, wondered about that….

Comment #34: James  on  07/30  at  01:16 AM

“Sucks that the women’s soccer league didn’t survive. It was far more entertaining to watch than the sad-sacks who play in the MLS. Much better to watch the best women in the world play a finesse game than watch some of the worst men in the world try and play the power game.”

I’ve got a lot of respect for the women who play (tackle) football. They’re pretty much paying to do so, as I understand and all work day jobs. Our localish team, the West Michigan Mayhem are actually playing for a league title this weekend.

The local paper did a feature last year about a D tackle who played a week and a half after giving birth to her daughter.

I’ve gone to a couple of games, though not this year as they moved from playing in Kalamazoo to BFE. The Mayhem have a decent level of football going on. They’ve got a QB who can throw consistenly, which is kinda of a dividing line in the sport.

Comment #35: witless chum  on  07/30  at  01:17 AM

MiddleageLiberal—yeah, it’s not exactly a secret here in Washington that lesbians are a major, major segment of fans attending Mystics games. That makes this move even more idiotic than it already appears. Unbelievable!

Comment #36: Redshift  on  07/30  at  02:47 AM

BTW, this would be the same Sheila Johnson who just endorsed Republican Bob McDonnell (who got his law degree from Regent University and is closely associated with Pat Robertson) for governor of Virginia.

Comment #37: Redshift  on  07/30  at  02:53 AM

FWIW, I have seen the kiss cam at NBA games settle in on a pair of (presumably straight) men in that, oh so clever, “ha ha you’re a fag” sort of way. Although more recently, such displays usually consist of the opposing coach/player and one of the referees, or two opposing players, etc. Really standard idiotic homophobic behavior, not exactly shocking from the NBA.

Comment #38: Crusty Dem  on  07/30  at  04:34 AM

I wouldn’t say that lesbians are a major market segment for the WNBA; based on what I’ve seen at games, I’d say that lesbians are about the ONLY loyal market the league has. So, yes, Washington Mystics, please ostracize about the only people who are putting money in your pockets. Good plan!

A side note: I went to a minor league baseball game last year on what turned out to be Greek (as in college fraternity) Night. The couples cam locked in on two youngsters, and as if on cue, the two stood up and simulated doggy-style (maybe anal!) copulation. Funniest half-second I’ve every witnessed.

Comment #39: The Pantomime Princess Margaret  on  07/30  at  12:05 PM

Hah!  I guess they had a different version of “Greek” in mind.

Comment #40: MiddleageLiberal  on  07/30  at  03:30 PM
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