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Women: Not the ones being babies here

Feminism

Update: Sabotabby has a great list of rules for female bloggers who wish to get pats on the head from misogynist male bloggers.

Okay, so this is amusing.  Some asshole scolds blogger PhysioProf for unladylike foul language, threatening to deprive Physio of a husband for behaving in such an unladylike manner.  Jill points out the error in Tim Blair’s reasoning, which is that the language Blair thinks is reserved for men and men alone was being used in this case by a man.  Blair resorts to mining the comments to find commenters he’s sure are women cursing to make his larger point, which is that a) that language isn’t for the ladies and b) feminists are women who need to be spanked and then grounded for using words reserved for men. 

Funny, but you know, the whole thing gave me some insight that should have been obvious, but wasn’t until now.  I’ll admit, I was always confounded by the idea that women shouldn’t curse, that certain words are reserved for male-only company.  You’d think that was a fading idea, but the hostility that cursing female bloggers get demonstrates that a lot of people still hold that belief.  It just never made sense to me, until reading this exchange---the taboo against women cursing is another instance of women being understood in our society as children, and children are a class restricted from the use of naughty words.  Blair doesn’t even try to hide that he thinks of women as children, using the childish descriptor “pottymouth” and fantasizing about how men as a group can punish the child-women by depriving them of treats, in this case a white wedding.  It all makes sense now!  In that worldview, getting married is for women like Santa is for children, a treat dangled over the head in exchange for good behavior.

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Posted by Amanda Marcotte on 12:12 PM • Permalink

Ah, that happily-declining subset of the Australian male. Arsehole.

Comment #1: pseudonymous in nc  on  08/03  at  01:59 PM

NOBODY YOU’D WANT TO MARRY WANTS TO MARRY A POTTYMOUTH.

There, I fixed it for him.

Comment #2: Jennifer  on  08/03  at  01:59 PM

Five minutes in my company would give this poor man the vapors.

Comment #3: Abra  on  08/03  at  02:00 PM

Fuck him.

Oops, I guess I’ll never get married now! Except I am.

Comment #4: athena  on  08/03  at  02:02 PM

I’ve suddenly realized why I get so offended when a man will swear in front of me, then get all apologetic about it.

Thank you. Dunno why it took this to make me understand the underlying cause, but it did.

Comment #5: Ali  on  08/03  at  02:02 PM

Funnily enough, my father used to say the same thing.  Yet, here I am, marrid to a perfectly wonderful guy.

Comment #6: Antigone  on  08/03  at  02:06 PM

And the comments, that is one sad group of guys.  They need to clean some lawn chairs.  That puts things in perspective.

Comment #7: Flying Fox  on  08/03  at  02:07 PM

a) that language isn’t for the ladies and

b) feminists are women who need to be spanked and then grounded for using words reserved for men.

Raise a hand to THIS feminist, Timmy-Boy, and I will break your f**king arm.

In what century is THIS bozo living anyway?

Comment #8: Terry C, Obama/Clinton 08  on  08/03  at  02:10 PM

Blair doesn’t even try to hide that he thinks of women as children, using the childish descriptor “pottymouth” and fantasizing about how men as a group can punish the child-women by depriving them of treats, in this case a white wedding.

What an a**hole!

Comment #9: Terry C, Obama/Clinton 08  on  08/03  at  02:11 PM

“Nobody wants to marry a pottymouth”?  What is it, 1950?

Comment #10: Notorious P.A.T.  on  08/03  at  02:13 PM

Frankly, I love the pottymouth I married.  Anyone can make “I love you,” sound charming, but a woman who can look at me in adoration while sighing, “You are such a stupid fuck sometimes” is a woman I know I can laugh and grow old with.

Comment #11: Bradley  on  08/03  at  02:21 PM

So true.  We still laugh at the time, in a Montego Bay airport bar, she looked at me and said “You drunken ass!”

Of course, I was.

Comment #12: Cougarhutch  on  08/03  at  02:28 PM

There’s a corollary too, which is: only the powerful are responsible enough to traffic in obscenity. Is that what “civility” has been about this whole time?

Comment #13: va  on  08/03  at  02:31 PM

Presents dangling overhead makes me think of a piñata - and an interesting idea for the ultimate male-bashing (albeit non-work-safe) party event.

Comment #14: RepubAnon  on  08/03  at  02:31 PM

These assholes think by spouting this ridiculous crap, that they believe because it’s been pounded into their heads since childhood, all females will become shrieking hysterics, you know, because of our harmones, the idea of being punished by NO WHITE WEDDING is disgusting and hilarious.  But, hey, I live in Texas, I’m used to this stupid crap. And honestly, much worse.

Comment #15: cebm  on  08/03  at  02:32 PM

I feel sorry for people who can’t appreciate it when someone sighs to them that they’re fucking hot. Not that anyone ever would say that to them.

Comment #16: junk science  on  08/03  at  02:34 PM

Tim Blair seemed to enjoy the hell out of pottymouthed women back in the late 1980s.  Blair’s current missus swears like a pirate with the clap. He gets off on this sort of trollery, which is pretty sad, considering the guy is in his 40s.

Comment #17: bargal20  on  08/03  at  02:35 PM

I wonder if it is the vulgarity/profanity or if it is as the first poster said being an arsehole. Frequently that guys only profanity is about being a bigoted, misanthropic asshole. So when one of those guys sees or reads a woman using foul language they project their own nasty motivations and subtext on the woman.
So the same people that have been dumping shit on others for so long are just trying to avoid getting a little bit dumped back on them.
Or more succinctly arsehole.

Comment #18: Buzzcook  on  08/03  at  02:49 PM

He just moved to the new digs at the Telegraph and is trying to drive traffic. Don’t help him out.

Comment #19: Phewkit  on  08/03  at  02:54 PM

Guys like Tim Blair probably don’t like women farting in front of them either.  Not ladylike, you know.  No burping either.  Oh, and no loud laughing.  They hate that.

A perfect, dainty, feminine woman should strive to act like a doll at all times.  Never an in-the-flesh human being, just a doll.

Comment #20: Cat Ion  on  08/03  at  03:02 PM

Make sure you run all possible post topics by Phewkit first.

Comment #21: Auguste  on  08/03  at  03:04 PM

The most interesting part is that he manages to turn scolding a man for being unladylike into an attack on feminists for, apparently, needing men to say feminist things for them.

Comment #22: Jesse Taylor  on  08/03  at  03:14 PM

A man? On Feministe? False advertising, at best.

Comment #23: Auguste  on  08/03  at  03:26 PM

Dirty girls are better girls, but smart mean one are the best.
I think the douche wants all women to speaks like his mother spoke or when spoken to more like it. As boring and uninteresting as that would be I agree with Buzzcook as well, but I think it is a mix of a number of things.
There is a reason in Australia that the women flock to the ports when a US Navy ship comes in. (whispers: American men treat women better.) wink wink
Besides he is just some Australian ass clown who cares what a homophobic sheep molester rants about?

Comment #24: Nix  on  08/03  at  03:37 PM

i’m reminded of what my business partner said about
her husband, her ex-husband, and her plans never
to remarry:

“two fucking douche-bags in one life is enough”

maybe i’ll tell her i found another live one for her.

Comment #25: daveminnj  on  08/03  at  03:41 PM

Cursing is absolutely about blunt power. including sexual power but power generally, the power to startle, to command attention albeit “rudely.” It wasn’t for nothing that Patton said that an army without profanity could not fight its way out of a piss-soaked paper bag.

Comment #26: Bruce  on  08/03  at  03:42 PM

I think Tim is just a sensitive fellow who isn’t cut out for all this rough talk and bawdiness.

Someone really should fetch the dear lad a fainting couch.

Comment #27: Dan  on  08/03  at  04:06 PM

Pah. Don’t make the mistake of thinking Timmy’s blog carries any authority or reflects any general local attitude (let alone be representative of Australian males - overreaction much?) On a good day, he conducts himself like a grumpy eight year old, and this last spiel is entirely within character.

Remember that the right wing commentariat are a little hard up for stuff to complain about down here, and Timmy has gone trolling for inspiration yet again. Why the paper he works for allows him to publish such crap (even by their standards) is beyond me.

Comment #28: Chas Dean  on  08/03  at  04:16 PM

It’s funny how the right-wingers always manage to get things exactly backwards.

You want to know what’s really creepy? Someone — male or female — who doesn’t swear when it’s appropriate and/or funny.

Comment #29: Dan, Grand High Emperor of Bananas Foster  on  08/03  at  04:23 PM

Amanda, that’s tim blair you linked to. Why? He’s a worthless scumbag.

Comment #30: flashheart  on  08/03  at  05:02 PM

My parents almost never swear. I don’t find anything creepy about this; they grew up in blue collardom, aiming to middle class, and at the time they were growing up, the ambitious would consider swearing to sound uneducated. Plus, they had years of setting a good example for younger siblings and their own children to discourage it.

OTOH, neither they nor my husband have any trouble with my habit of finding profanity to be the only way to fully voice my political opinions on some things. The only person, in fact, to ever try to get me to stop swearing was a co-worker. I made it clear that if she shoved a swear jar at me again, I would tell her where to shove it, because I have no problems with my use of coarse language.

But as for being ladylike-- I read British writers and *real* Ladies can do some really superb cursing.

Comment #31: Samantha Vimes  on  08/03  at  05:11 PM

My wife and I thought about starting a swear jar.  Put a quarter in the jar for every vulgarity, at the end of the day buy a small island somewhere near Greece…

Comment #32: Bradley  on  08/03  at  05:17 PM

Flashheart, linking =/ approving, as the content of the post would indicate.

Comment #33: Amanda Marcotte  on  08/03  at  05:35 PM

My husband of 17 years appreciates my creative use of invective.

My sons, apparently, too.  One of the eldest’s friends cussed in front of me and got all embarrassed about it.  I shrugged and said “No big.  I swear like a sailor myself.” The eldest did a spit-take and exclaimed “Mother!  You would IMPRESS a sailor.”

So fuck Timmy-boy and the rest of the miserable, feeble-minded, pencil-dicked shitstains who think they’re going to tell me how to talk. 

I get more action snarling “Fuck me now” than I do cooing “can we make love?” He ought to try it sometime.  He’d be less inclined to faint when encountering a dame with a mouth on her, then.

Comment #34: Maggie  on  08/03  at  05:44 PM

It’s simpler than that: cursing means that you aren’t capable of constructing a meaningful argument without resorting to “shock” language.  Male or female, this represents a profound lack of intellectual capacity on the part of the person who insists on cursing.

That doesn’t mean that the occasional foul word isn’t called for; it does mean that a post filled with cursing (as the one Blair linked to was) is a sign of a weak intellect.

And yes, that means that people like Duncan Black (Atrios) swim in the shallow end of the intellectual wading pool.

Comment #35: James Robertson  on  08/03  at  06:23 PM

You what I say to all this nonsene? Fuck it.

Comment #36: Southern Beale  on  08/03  at  06:38 PM

James: Oh just fuck off with that stupid bullshit. There’s nothing “shocking” about that sort of language. It’s just very blunt and to the point. It doesn’t mean that the person using it is stupid, or there’s a lack of “intellectual capacity”. They’re just words. And no, there is no cursing/intellectual reciprocal relationship.

Some of the dumbest people I’ve ever met would run away from any “curse” word put in front of them.

BTW. I agree with the people who say that a woman cursing isn’t ugly at all. In fact, the sort of emotion expressed in that way I personally find very attractive (as in my wife who can curse up a storm)

Comment #37: Karmakin  on  08/03  at  06:41 PM

It’s simpler than that: cursing means that you aren’t capable of constructing a meaningful argument without resorting to “shock” language.  Male or female, this represents a profound lack of intellectual capacity on the part of the person who insists on cursing.

No.  That’s the argument prudes like to put out there, but it simply isn’t true.  The well-used profanity can be especially effective.  Granted, overuse can blunt its impact, but that’s not an argument against profanity; that’s an argument against repetitive language.

Comment #38: Bradley  on  08/03  at  06:42 PM

I get more action snarling “Fuck me now” than I do cooing “can we make love?”

Good point.  It’s much sexier when a woman says “fuck me” than “fancy some coitus, old chap?”

Comment #39: Bradley  on  08/03  at  06:45 PM

What Bradley said.  Every word.

Comment #40: Maggie  on  08/03  at  06:45 PM

Oh, hah.  Lookit the simul-posting.  I’m agreeing with Bradley’s thoughts on profanity, of course.

Comment #41: Maggie  on  08/03  at  06:47 PM

It’s not a matter of being an argument prude - cursing just demonstrates verbal limits.  If you can’t make a point without cursing, you probably aren’t making the point with cursing.  The whole point of curse words is to be something you pull out in extremis - if you speak or write that way regularly, you lack the ability to communicate your ideas.  Whether you want to accept it or not, a not insignificant number of people will tune you out as soon as you start swearing.

If your goal is to actually communicate your ideas, limit the cursing.  If, on the other hand, all you care about is “preaching to the choir”, then go ahead - swear.  Most people who might have considered your point will tune it out as soon as you start swearing.  You can call that their problem all you want, but it’s your point that’s being lost.

Comment #42: James Robertson  on  08/03  at  06:49 PM

“It’s simpler than that: cursing means that you aren’t capable of constructing a meaningful argument without resorting to “shock” language.  Male or female, this represents a profound lack of intellectual capacity on the part of the person who insists on cursing.”

I disagree. I think frequency of swearing is mostly an indicator of cultural conditioning and personality, rather than any indicator of intellectual capacity. Swearing conveys certain emotions, just like other words do - sometimes people attempt to use emotional appeals in lieu of rational argument, but that is also a tactic (sometimes the smartest tactic), not necessarily a sign of lack of intellect (and there are many ways to use empty words instead of argument that don’t involve swearing.)

In any case, phrasing his criticism via the: “no one wants to marry a pottymouth” line was puerile, condescending, and just plain fucking bullshit.

Comment #43: Brandon  on  08/03  at  06:51 PM

It’s simpler than that: cursing means

So, o wise one whose mere word itself is a Spinozan proof: what does the immediate resort to ad hominem mean?

Comment #44: Hussein G. Bergeron  on  08/03  at  06:55 PM

I swear in my everyday life, but I don’t swear much at work because I, personally, think it’s unprofessional.  Plus a big part of my job is to appear unflappable, which I wouldn’t be able to do if I swore as much as I do in regular life.

The fun part is, when I do swear, I get a HUGE reaction.  Like, “OMG, Mnemo said the f-word—this must be a really big issue for her to do that!” And people rush around to do things for me because I signaled the seriousness of the situation by swearing.

I don’t think a single one of them has thought that I was being unladylike but, then, I work in an industry where people make the jerk-off motion during staff meetings when it’s warranted, so being ladylike (or gentlemanly) is not exactly prized.

Comment #45: Mnemosyne  on  08/03  at  06:58 PM

It’s not a matter of being an argument prude - cursing just demonstrates verbal limits.  If you can’t make a point without cursing, you probably aren’t making the point with cursing.  The whole point of curse words is to be something you pull out in extremis - if you speak or write that way regularly, you lack the ability to communicate your ideas.  Whether you want to accept it or not, a not insignificant number of people will tune you out as soon as you start swearing.

I think-- and I’m pretty sure George Orwell, who wrote some of the most compelling arguments in the English language, would agree-- that the phrase “not insignificant” represents a much more destructive linguistic habit than the use of profanity as an appeal to pathos.

Cursing only demonstrates the verbal limits of those who have a limited vocabulary, much like the use of hasty generalizations indicates an individual’s trouble with logical argumentation.

Comment #46: Bradley  on  08/03  at  06:58 PM

but Amanda, everything he does is done for attention and no-one takes him seriously. You should reserve your ire for people who think.

Comment #47: flashheart  on  08/03  at  07:09 PM

There is a reason in Australia that the women flock to the ports when a US Navy ship comes in. (whispers: American men treat women better.) wink wink
Besides he is just some Australian ass clown who cares what a homophobic sheep molester rants about?

Yes, thank you, Nix. You ignorant, bigoted fucknozzle.

Comment #48: bargal20  on  08/03  at  07:20 PM

Forget the pottymouth.

Tim Blair has a puttybrain...as in sillyputtybrain.

Comment #49: The Oracle  on  08/03  at  07:22 PM

It’s not a matter of being an argument prude - cursing just demonstrates verbal limits.  If you can’t make a point without cursing, you probably aren’t making the point with cursing.

Strictly speaking, this doesn’t make any sense. If I make an argument like “A = B; B = C; ergo A = C”, that’s just as true put that way as it would be if I said “transitive property, muthafuckers!”

The simple fact is that we call it “adult language” because adults use it, often to describe adult concepts or communicate levels of emotion or significance that children shouldn’t be exposed to. And, conversely, someone who objects to harsh language when the expression of harsh emotion is intended is not an adult, but rather, a child. Like you, James.

Whether you want to accept it or not, a not insignificant number of people will tune you out as soon as you start swearing.

A not insignificant number of insignificant intellects, surely. Quite frankly no one takes people like you seriously. If you’re too timid to face language like “fuck”, then you have nowhere near the intellectual courage to face reality.

Comment #50: Chet  on  08/03  at  07:58 PM

This Tim Blair person doesn’t know when to quit:

http://blogs.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/timblair/index.php/dailytelegraph/comments/such_language/#commentsmore

Comment #51: Maggie Fox  on  08/03  at  08:11 PM

It’s simpler than that: cursing means that you aren’t capable of constructing a meaningful argument without resorting to “shock” language.

In the same sense, of course, that fucking your spouse madly on the hall floor the moment you get home means you are unable to talk to them about how your day went.  The very idea that people might have both gonads and brains, invective and logic is INCONCEIVABLE.

Comment #52: Phoenician in a time of Romans  on  08/03  at  08:28 PM

It must be confusing not to be able to see the world except through bifurcations all the time.  The Reich wingers must sometimes feel dizzy keeping up with their own dichotomies of rightness and wrongness, goodness and evil.

Comment #53: jennifer cascadia  on  08/03  at  08:40 PM

Amanda, I think you’re essentially right in your analysis, but i think I think) that there’s another, deeper element, though. (After all, why the prohibition against certain words in the first place? Why is shit dirty but dirt not dirty? Why are they called ‘swear’ words or ‘curse’ words?)
I think the answer is similar to why men are scared of sex, why sexual morality is so heavily charged while the other stuff (lying, stealing, sassing your parents) isn’t--it’s that it’s magic.
There’s a fear of women ‘swearing’ or ‘cursing’ that goes back to the time when people thought it worked.
Wouldn’t that be nice--!

Comment #54: pbg  on  08/03  at  08:44 PM

That Tim Blair shit was totally fucking hilarious!! What a ridiculous goofaloon! BTW, every time someone trots out the “you must be inarticulate and have a limited vocabulary if you swear so much” shitbaggery, it makes my entire motherfucking day! HAHAHAHAH!

Comment #55: PhysioProf  on  08/03  at  08:44 PM

The right often likes to use an opponent’s language as an excuse not to engage. “Oh dearie me, you’re being vulgar. I’m afraid I’ll have to focus on your language rather than the strong arguments you’re making, and bow out of the conversation—because you’re being ever so rude, of course. Not because I can’t actually debate with you over the facts themselves. Heavens no. If only you weren’t being so vulgar—then we could really discuss things.”

Comment #56: annejumps  on  08/03  at  09:04 PM

I hope nobody thinks I’m some kind of asshole for saying this, but this entire fucking conversation has put the biggest shit-eating grin on my face.

Comment #57: Bradley  on  08/03  at  09:23 PM

Thanks Amanda. Up to now there’s never been a deconstructist around when I needed one.

Comment #58: Harry Bergeron  on  08/03  at  09:28 PM

My favourite moment in wedding planning: My soon to be wife looked up from planning the buffet and said, “Fuck it, they can find the food.”

Comment #59: Patrick  on  08/03  at  09:28 PM

I think-- and I’m pretty sure George Orwell, who wrote some of the most compelling arguments in the English language, would agree-- that the phrase “not insignificant” represents a much more destructive linguistic habit than the use of profanity as an appeal to pathos.

Well said, bravo.

(fuck yeah!)

Comment #60: Auguste  on  08/03  at  10:35 PM

I think-- and I’m pretty sure George Orwell, who wrote some of the most compelling arguments in the English language, would agree-- that the phrase “not insignificant” represents a much more destructive linguistic habit than the use of profanity as an appeal to pathos.

So much fucking win.

Comment #61: sabotabby  on  08/03  at  11:33 PM

James, a person who thinks you’re stupid because you use a curse word is telling you more about his intelligence than the pottymouthed person.  Or really, lack of it.  I mean, you have to be pretty fucking stupid to rely on cues like curse words to determine if someone is being smart or not, because if you could analyze an argument on its merits, you wouldn’t need to do that.  But it’s okay.  Maybe you can get a remedial course on reading comprehension and get past your cheats and coping mechanisms.

Comment #62: Amanda Marcotte  on  08/03  at  11:35 PM

Flashheart, if I don’t link to someone because of what he might think, I’m letting his feelings control my actions, no?  I don’t want to live in fear that I give some asswipe a cheap thrill or limit myself because of it.  What he feels is immaterial to me.  I was using his sorry ass to make a point.

Comment #63: Amanda Marcotte  on  08/03  at  11:39 PM

It’s simpler than that: cursing means that you aren’t capable of constructing a meaningful argument without resorting to “shock” language.  Male or female, this represents a profound lack of intellectual capacity on the part of the person who insists on cursing.

Similarly, using a hammer to put nails into a board proves that you just aren’t capable of using a screwdriver.

Comment #64: Dan  on  08/04  at  12:01 AM

It’s not a matter of being an argument prude - cursing just demonstrates verbal limits.  If you can’t make a point without cursing, you probably aren’t making the point with cursing. 

You know who was a totally limited writer and, presumably, speaker? Geoffrey Chaucer.

Comment #65: Auguste  on  08/04  at  12:02 AM

I’m a little torn on this subject.
I was raised with the very middle class notion that rude words are a sign of weak vocabulary. That even very mild ones like “darn” and “gee” were blasphemy and shouldn’t be used. (I once heard my mother react to a kitchen fire with “Oh my!” and put it out. Her response, “Anything stronger would have been a waste of time.")

As an erotica writer, I’ve learned a well-placed “fuck” is a joy to behold.
An over-indulgence blunts their individual and collective impact.

Consider, Gone with the Wind. 4 hours. 1 profanity. When it’s used, it carries a lot of weight. Then consider Dogma. 2 hours. Non-stop vulgarity. By the end, your ears are numb.

Curse words are words of power. They’re meant to exercise the speaker’s power over the hearer. “Fuck you!” is telling the other person they are weak, womanish and you’re going to penetrate them, figuratively at least, because you are stronger. Damning someone is literally calling the wrath of your/their deity upon them. Excremental words equate the hearer, or the subject under discussion, with waste.

The one thing anyone with an ounce of feminist conscience learns is that men fear female power. They especially fear female usurpation of male power. Women cursing is an usurpation.

Comment #66: Angelia Sparrow  on  08/04  at  12:15 AM

Sixty-five comments and nobody has said precisely what I have come to say:

Fuck that shit.

Comment #67: Orange  on  08/04  at  12:16 AM

It just never made sense to me, until reading this exchange---the taboo against women cursing is another instance of women being understood in our society as children

I think the operative stereotype is something else—not the child, the Lady.

Woman as the one whose manners, politeness, and civility tame the savage beast that is Man, turning him from brutish to cultured and humane.  Men provide defense and strength, women provide nurture and culture, and voila, the heterosexual bond becomes the structuring unit of civilization.  The cursing woman threatens—at least as much as prudes and doofuses like Blair understand it—the whole program.

The bit about cursing disproving intelligence is tired.  Why does cursing seem “stupid”?  Because both are linked to people who do hard, stressful physical labor, rather than being refined by genteel leisure.  People who curse are sneered at because of a condescending and class-marked presumption that they are bodily, animalistic, impulsive.  IMHO cursing/civility doesn’t map to stupid/smart except by way of poor/rich.

Comment #68: FlipYrWhig  on  08/04  at  12:38 AM

Of course, as I composed my magnum opussy there, many more people made my same point about class.  Good thing I have a large class-marked vocabulary, so I can carefully choose the ideal word to express my feelings of frustration.  Fuck.

Comment #69: FlipYrWhig  on  08/04  at  12:42 AM

James Robertson:

It’s simpler than that: cursing means that you aren’t capable of constructing a meaningful argument without resorting to “shock” language. Male or female, this represents a profound lack of intellectual capacity on the part of the person who insists on cursing.

If you’re going to lecture people on what makes a good argument, try not to do it with one of the most ridiculous strawman arguments in the book.

The only people who honestly believe that smart people don’t swear are people who don’t know any smart people. QED.

Comment #70: Dan, Grand High Emperor of Bananas Foster  on  08/04  at  02:02 AM

It’s so cute when y’all stomp your tiny feet and whine “fuck that shit, I’m not dumb.”

Pathetic.

Comment #71: Eric, Rejector of Memes  on  08/04  at  03:43 AM

I curse like a sailor, and men like Tim Blair won’t marry a pottymouth like me. Oh, how terrible! The world is ending! Well, all I can say to Tim Blair and his ilk is FUCK OFF ASSHOLE AND KISS MY ASS. OMG, my punishment is that I won’t get a white wedding. What the fuck should I do now! What next? Do I have to bring a fucking vial of chicken blood along on my wedding night to stain the sheets so that I can proove that I’m worthy of of a fucking white wedding in case one of these motherfuckers want to forgive me for my pottymouth ways? Go fuck yourselves! When 99.9% of the male population stops swearing than I will to. Go lecture them! Until than, fuck off asshole!

Comment #72: virago  on  08/04  at  03:51 AM

Hey, how’s it going, you bunch of cunts?

I think it’s great that you cunts don’t get hung up on a few fucking cuss words. You ladies are alright with me, motherfucking-A!

We need to liberate ourselves from this male hegemony where words like cunt are laden with violence and disrespect and fucking motherfucking shit like that.

Fuck, fuck, fuckety-fuck, fuck, fuck fuck.

Who’d have thought? Gonads and brains? Cunts and commonsense!

Carla Cuntwobble

Comment #73: Carla Cuntwobble  on  08/04  at  06:12 AM

Patrick wrote: “My favourite moment in wedding planning: My soon to be wife looked up from planning the buffet and said, “Fuck it, they can find the food.””

Lordy. So cute. Woman say the darndest things.

Comment #74: Trog  on  08/04  at  06:29 AM

I love Ms. Cuntwobble’s assumption that swearing by necessity means expressing contempt for women.  That seems to be the latest theme at Tim’s place, i.e. feminists are so dumb that by swearing they are unwittingly endorsing hatred of women because swearing necessarily means calling people cunts and bitches.

(Yeah, I know I shouldn’t try to reason with these people but it is fascinating how their deeply ingrained desire to believe in women’s childishness colors their views to the point of total idiocy.)

Comment #75: Maggie Fox  on  08/04  at  08:04 AM

As an older man, I clearly remember when foul language from a woman was an indication of ‘loose morals’. Things have changed in fifty years, and the connection between words like ‘fucking’ used as an adverb to amplify the degree of some characteristic (i.e., fucking awesome) and anything remotely sexual has been severed. ‘Fuck’ comes out of my mouth like a verbal bullet every time my arthritic hands cause me to drop something on the floor. Sexual connotation? None. I think this generally reflects our cultural usage in the 21st century.

I would bet that there is at least a vestige of this when men castigate women for using profanity. Conservatives, particularly, still see women as people who can serve tea at 4pm with aplomb, rather than as people who have the same ambitions, talents and emotions as men. Fuck them.

Comment #76: RandyMacon  on  08/04  at  08:35 AM

feminists are so dumb that by swearing they are unwittingly endorsing hatred of women because swearing necessarily means calling people cunts and bitches.

Only a complete prick would think something like that . . .

Comment #77: rea  on  08/04  at  08:40 AM

It’s so cute when y’all stomp your tiny feet and whine “fuck that shit, I’m not dumb.”

Pathetic.

Not much for reading comprehension, are you?

Comment #78: Bradley  on  08/04  at  08:54 AM

James, give up the lame argument about cursing and “weak intellect” or “limited verbal skills.” I’ve been a professional editor and writer for over 20 years working mostly in academic, scholastic, and professional publishing. I can marshal a vast array of semantic weaponry with which to smite and bedevil my hapless antagonists, a veritable cornucopia of expressive and emotive verbiage. Yet I frequently employ profanity when it is appropriate to the affective tone of the situation. I’ll wager my vocabulary is considerably larger than yours, although I’m a bit abashed to make such a self-aggrandizing claim. So fuck off, asshole.

Comment #79: jjcomet  on  08/04  at  09:19 AM

Duh....we want you to curse in bed, not in public.

Comment #80: Easycure  on  08/04  at  09:46 AM

“Duh....we want you to curse in bed, not in public.”

Duh...If you can’t handle a woman cursing in public, than you can’t handle a woman cursing in bed. The fact that you take a man’s freedom to swear or say whatever the hell he wants in public for granted, but expect a woman to limit her swearing for your private entertainment says a lot about you. That would be a red flag to avoid fucking a man like you in the first place because it tells women that you would suck in bed anyway. Who wants to fuck a guy who can’t get it up unless a woman talks dirty to him, but faints dead away at the thought of her saying fuck in public? I doubt any self-respecting woman would.

Comment #81: virago  on  08/04  at  10:21 AM

woohoo! I don’t have to worry about ever getting stuck being married.

Comment #82: NancyP  on  08/04  at  01:01 PM

Sorry to tell you this, kids, but none of Marcotte’s “logic” is based on fact or history. There’s nothing in Blair’s blog to support her juvenile, self-absorbed paranoia. Ever. Read his posts then ask youselves why you’re so willing to believe her.

Comment #83: Gary from Jersey  on  08/04  at  01:17 PM

Gary, you have no idea how awesomeI find it that you begin your response to a post about the infantilization of women by calling those you disagree with (a great number of whom are women) “kids.” Even as you try to disprove Amanda Marcotte’s point, you illustrate it perfectly.  You, sir, are a feminist hero.

Comment #84: Bradley  on  08/04  at  01:22 PM

Not to mention ‘juvenile’.  Well done Gary.

Comment #85: Carolyn  on  08/04  at  01:51 PM

Duh....we want you to curse in bed, not in public.

And you’re only supposed to dress slutty for us, and only ever want to have sex with us, and never speak to other men. How else will we be reassured that we own you?

Comment #86: junk science  on  08/04  at  01:52 PM

Sixty-five comments and nobody has said precisely what I have come to say:

Fuck that shit.

From a t-shirt I saw in NY years and years ago: Fuck You, You Fucking Fuck. I am considering having this put on my gravestone.

Comment #87: mothworm  on  08/04  at  02:55 PM

You folks are reading too much into this. Blair’s post was laughing at the NYT’s miscalculation in putting the article in the color section, and the angry response that provoked - which the “right on” NYT should have known was going to result. The conclusion that Blair expects women to be barefoot and pregnant and obscene but not heard is so wrongheaded, you’re just making clowns out of yourself. Try and get the Zeitgeist before you shoot the messenger, folks.

Oh, and, uhm… “fuck”. See? I’m making an effort to get the Zeitgeist at this site.

Comment #88: AC  on  08/04  at  05:55 PM

Tim Lambert at Deltoid has an image of a cartoon piñata he uses everytime Tim Blair comes up.  Tim Blair is not bright.

Comment #89: Pinko Punko  on  08/04  at  09:34 PM

“Tim Blair is not bright.”

Oh, well if you say so, that settles it.

Comment #90: AC  on  08/05  at  02:54 AM

Ok, I went to the link and, gals, Tim Blair is just joking with us. See? It’s a joke...get it?
No? Me neither.

Comment #91: ShelbyWoo  on  08/05  at  04:56 PM

Don’t get it? Must be the smaller brain size.

Comment #92: Marquis de Sadesack  on  08/06  at  04:35 AM

I have an admitted aversion to cursing except in extreme serious cases (i.e. Getting hit by a car) because I grew sick of the casual cursing among my childhood classmates and many adults in my childhood neighborhood along with the fact that it was almost always foreshadowed impending acts of physical violence...something I wanted to avoid as I was getting into enough fights merely for my Chinese-American background and for being extremely short and young for my grade level back then.

Nowadays, though I rarely curse myself, I have no problems with close friends I know very well as I know they don’t mean it.  Unfortunately, when I hear strangers cursing and getting worked up, especially when it is directed at me while I was minding my own business, red danger warning flags tend to go up in my head that I may have to prepare to defend myself from the unprovoked anger of some angry miserable cranks who are seemingly too often inclined to blame his problems on complete strangers. 

Moreover, I’ve seen a recent tendency among an extreme handful of undergrads to use profanity on academic essays where their use was inappropriate.  Those undergrads certainly cursed up a storm after I marked their essays “incomplete - do over” along with a notation stating that casual use of profanity in academic essays is unprofessional in the academic context unless they were addressing a profanity related topic and/or were quoting profanity-laden sentences germane to the topic being addressed.  It also didn’t help that some of their socio-economically privileged parents joined in attempting to intimidate the instructor and me into passing them.  Thankfully, despite their profanity-laden bluster, the instructor backed me up when we stood our ground and effectively told them to fuck off without the necessity of saying it as such.

Comment #93: exholt  on  08/06  at  01:58 PM
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