Isn’t this analagous to an ad that tells men that they can use condoms to make funny balloon animals?

One of the many things that creep me out about the Yaz commercial is that it uses a song by Twisted Sister (no sub-text there, right?)

I have one criticism of Haskins’ criticism of the nuvaring ads—they’re selling the idea that, rather than take a pill every day, you switch your ring (or whatever) once a month.  They’re taking for granted that most women who might be interested in nuvaring would probably already know what birth control is.  It’s sort of the same way that a beer ad might market itself on the quality of “tastes great!  less filling!”  - people generally already know what beer is and why you might want to drink it.; the company is selling you on certain qualities of the beer itself.

Also, I’d like to trot out another anecdote from my trip to India.  Ad seen on the back of a bus in the middle of Bombay:  “Worried about last night?  Ask your pharmacist for [whatever the Indian version of Plan B is].”  I thought it was pretty shocking that even in a society which is far more sexually conservative than we think American society is (Indian film censors don’t even allow kissing!), they can actually allude to the fact that women might be sexually active and not want to have a child.

While you could read this as the advertiser’s squeamishness about mentioning birth control, more likely it’s just the advertiser’s attempt at brand differentiation.  Birth control ads are not so much about getting women to start using birth control.  (Women are smart enough to pretty much figure out on their own that they don’t want to get pregnant.)  Rather, they’re probably mostly about getting women on one method to switch to another—or getting women on one pill to switch to another.

Since there’s not a lot of difference in efficacy among different birth control brands (thank goodness—they’re all pretty effective!), the advertisers have to pitch their brands in lifestyle terms.  The lifestyle differentiations may or may not be genuine.  (It isn’t like one brand is dramatically better than the others at acne prevention, or menstral regulation, or ease of use.)  But then again, Coke and Pepsi don’t taste so different either—the trick is to make the consumer attracted to a particular brand image.  That way, the customer on one brand might go to her doctor and ask her for a new brand.

That may not be the way activists would like to see the advertising work—but it’s the way that makes money for the companies.  And that’s the whole reason they advertise in the first place.  (And, incidentally, this profit-seeking, brand-differentiating advertising may be good for birth control usage as a whole—because it makes the whole enterprise into a comfortable, mainstream product.  Which may mean that a 17 year old is more comfortable walking into Planned Parenthood and asking for birth control in the first place.)

What? Is Upstairs at Eric’s getting a 25th anniversary re-issue?

Muscular pain and diarrhea are not particularly rare, either. It all comes down to how much is too much for the individual. Feeling a little off for one day, but functional for anything within reach of a toilet and not requiring lifting objects heavier than I am used to lifting - I don’t see that as a big deal, certainly not medication worthy (I have a desk job). I consider myself fortunate, but I have always assumed that most people have a few inconvenient and short-lived symptoms, and only a few are really incapacitated by headache or cramps. Sometimes the cramps might be due to endometriosis, treatable by several means. Promoting medicalization of menstrual symptoms beyond the few percent who have severe symptoms - strictly a marketing move. I don’t want to see inappropriate people on OCP - smokers, older women, people with history of excessive blood clotting. Some people may have other birth control means, and shouldn’t feel that they “need” to switch to hormonal means.

I wouldn’t say “disobediant woman” so much as “woman I don’t like”.

I dunno, Dave, of all the pop catalouge, what would you pick for a birth control pill commercial?
(i’m sure many women have looked upon Dee Snyder and thought “thank god i’m not fertile”)

/absolutely no Enya while walking on a beach in the sunset. none/

Perhaps several women under florescent lights, in a cube farm, working with spreadsheet software to something by The Cramps?

For what it’s worth, there is pretty conclussive evidence for the bowel issues, headaches and cramps.  As I occationally suffer from each of these, I looked to ensure I wasn’t imagining the connection from the seeming relation in myself, especially as the symptoms are not constants - some months nearly debilitating headache/cramps/constipation/some combination and other months not a hint of any of them.
I didn’t keep links though.  Sorry.

the bowel issues, headaches and cramps.

As NancyP said, the issue is not that a lot of women have some sort of symptom that goes along with their period.  It’s the rather small number of women who have such severe symptoms that they cannot function in their everyday lives without being medicated for premenstraul symptoms. 

I have a few hours, or maybe most of a day, worth of medium-level menstrual cramps on the first or second day of my period.  The pharmaceutical industry would really, really like me to believe that this means I have some horrible pathology which requires me to ask my doctor for some really exciting drugs.    Except I’m not a moron, and I know that all I really need is a B-complex , an an Aleve, a good night’s sleep, a few square meals,  and maybe a little TLC (cup of tea, chocolate, video night on the couch, what have you).  I don’t need another scrip to fill every month. 

Women who have debilitating pain, such that taking care of themselves and maybe popping an OTC painkiller doesn’t meet their needs?  They should talk to their doctor and find a way to deal with whatever the issue is - if that means going on something like Yaz, well, OK then.  But trying to pathologize all women, even the ones who experience common and non-severe side effects like moodiness or a minor backache?  That’s just fucked up, sorry.

I remember a Roseanne Barr (as she was then) stand-up special ages ago (late 80’s I think) that claimed to be sponsored by an anti-Midol with the tag “For that time of the month when you’re allowed to be yourself.”

It’s a fascinating thing, because it’s clear the marketers are afraid of offending audiences with the unholy suggestion that women take the birth control pill mainly so they can have sex without those all-important “consequences”.

Granted, I’m an industry insider (one who’s never worked in “Women’s Health” and who is very much against DTC) but I don’t think this marketing ploy is necessarily or solely to avoid pointing out the large majority of women who use hormonal contraceptives do so to prevent getting pregnant. Remember, when DTC ads started, quite a few of the insurance plans did not cover contraception for women (even some of the plans that covered abortion didn’t cover contraception) and some still don’t cover contraception. They will, however, cover the same meds when prescribed to treat a diagnosis such as acne and, now, PMDD.

The ads about decreasing periods are directed towards woman already using hormonal contraception who are really sick and tired of dealing with their periods.  This appeals to a lot of women so it’s an annoying but good marketing strategy to take away market share from competitors.

I think everything you’ve said applies quite well to media portrayal of ‘PMS’, but not so much for Yaz. Yaz and Yasmin were designed to treat the severe forms of PMS, and the commercials reflect that for brand differentiation.

I was on Ortho Novum for 4 years and having a great time when all of a sudden I started going nuts every month. Irritability was a nice way to put it, but a more accurate description was “mood swings so bad that I frightened myself”, and which thankfully went away the moment I started bleeding. That, with the swollen boobs and insane bloating made the week before my period miserable, and accordingly I switched to Yasmin (which had other frightening side effects and got off of that quickly).

Incidentally, once I switched to a diaphragm (ie, got off hormones) the mood/insanity issue went away. The boobs, nausea, and insane bloating, not so much.

I’m not sure how they could effectively describe hormone-induced insanity in a commercial, but there are times when PMS is severe enough and I’m glad that someone made a Pill to help with that.

It’s so tempting that even women I know on the pill—-which cures PMS, doesn’t it?

Except for those times when it causes PMS and depression.  It took me three or four Pills to figure out that triphasic Pills (the ones with varying levels of hormones) were pretty much guaranteed to kill my sex drive and put me into a medium-serious depression.  Now Mircette (a monophasic Pill) is my new best friend in the whole damn world.  It doesn’t even give me mild PMS like Alesse (another monophasic) used to.

I had some major PMS from about 14 to 18 (gee, a growing teenager having wild hormonal swings?  Say it ain’t so!) but I pretty much grew out of it.  When my depression was still untreated, I would actually be in a BETTER mood the week before my period, because hormones aren’t something that act exactly the same way in every single person.

I get the lovely pre-menstrual bowel issues, but I have cranky bowels to begin with (IBS and lactose intolerant) so I suspect the people prone to that are the people who have existing issues with their digestive system.

Oh, and this has been scientifically tested and really works:  if you do have mild to moderate PMS problems, make sure you get at least your RDA of calcium (1200 mg) every day for the whole month.  When I make sure to do that, my cramps are cut in half and I have a lot fewer of the other issues, too.

(Severe PMDD should be under a doctor’s care, because suicidal thoughts are bad even if they’re “only” caused by your hormonal fluctuations and not a full-time clinical depression.)

I have found that I consistently have a tendency to serious mood problems (small things triggering really over-the-top negative emotions) on the *last* day of my period, which isn’t PMS by any definition. This can be magnified to a horrific extent by certain birth control pills (while taking Ortho-Cyclen, I became suicidal; I went on Prozac, because my psychiatrist couldn’t figure out that there was a connection to my BC pills, and was fine except during my period. When I tried to kill myself because my boyfriend yelled at me for getting the wrong tomatoes, on the last day of my period, I finally made the connection, and went off those BC pills.)

I also used to get terrible headaches before my period. Those went away on BC, and now I guess I’ve aged out of them.

I believe that the concept of PMS, a *pre-*menstrual syndrome, has often been conflated with the things that a lot of women suffer *during* their period. I’ve never seen good evidence that a huge number of women suffer symptoms *pre*-menstrually, but there are a lot of problems that seem to occur with great frequency to women who are actually menstruating. Which, considering that for many it is extremely painful, makes sense. No one is at their best when they’re in pain.

Maybe there’s newer, better evidence that PMS isn’t a social construct that has the dual functions of medicalizing a normal (if not particularly pleasant) part of life and giving women an out for their undesirable-in-women (but very human) emotions?  If you know of it, leave it in the comments.  My Googling didn’t turn up any scientifically rigorous studies to read.

Amanda, it looks like there are some studies answering your query:

This is from 2004:

The management of adverse premenstrual symptoms has presented a difficult challenge for clinicians. However, based on numerous well-designed research studies over the last decade, we now have diagnostic criteria for the severe form of the syndrome, premenstrual dysphoric disorder, and a variety of evidence-based therapeutic strategies. This review presents a comprehensive, practical description of what the clinician needs to know to diagnose and treat adverse premenstrual symptoms at all levels of severity. Diagnostic criteria are described in detail, including a discussion of the distinction between premenstrual dysphoric disorder and premenstrual syndrome (PMS). The rationale for including prospective symptom calendars as a routine part of the diagnostic evaluation of severe symptoms is presented. The differential diagnosis of cyclic symptoms, including depression and anxiety disorders, menstrual migraine, and mastalgia, and an approach for the management of each of these problems are presented. A treatment approach is recommended that matches the treatment to the degree of problems the woman is experiencing. Serotonin reuptake inhibitors are the treatment of choice for severe symptoms, and most women with PMS/premenstrual dysphoric disorder will respond to intermittent, luteal phase–only therapy. Ovulation suppression should be reserved for women who do not respond to other forms of therapy. The role of oophorectomy is limited, and guidelines for its use are presented.

This is from 1990:

To establish a quantitative method for the diagnosis of premenstrual syndrome (PMS), a simple prospective inventory, the calendar of premenstrual experiences, was constructed. The validity and reliability of this instrument were assessed by administering it throughout two consecutive ovulatory cycles to 36 rigidly screened women with PMS and to 18 controls. To establish concurrent validity, scores on behavioral items were correlated with simultaneously obtained scores on lengthier, well-validated psychiatric inventories designed to measure depression rather than PMS, the Beck Depression Inventory and the Profile of Mood States. The results showed that the calendar of premenstrual experiences luteal phase score distinguished PMS women from controls correctly in 104 of 108 cycles, with a 2.8% falsenegative rate and no false positives when used for two consecutive cycles. An upper limit follicular phase score was observed beneath which all PMS and normal control subjects fell, suggesting that a higher score is not consistent with PMS. Correlation coefficients of calendar item scores with Profile of Mood States scale scores were 0.58 for tension, 0.51 for depression, 0.46 for anger, 0.61 for fatigue, and 0.57 for confusion (P<.0001 for all correlations). The correlation of the- calendar depression item with the Beck Depression Inventory score was 0.56 (P<.0001). The test-retest reliability of the calendar given in the same phase of two consecutive menstrual cycles was high (r=0.78, P<.0001). We conclude that this instrument is a valid, reliable, and practical PMS inventory, applicable to clinical and some research settings.

and:

From 1998:

We sought to examine the diagnosis and treatment experiences of women in the United States who reported having been diagnosed with premenstrual syndrome (PMS) by a physician. A survey of 220 women, randomly selected, ages 26-56, who subscribed to a woman’s health newsletter and reported being given a diagnosis of PMS by a physician was conducted. Subjects reported (1) they sought medical help for 5.33 +/- 6.23 years before receiving a diagnosis, (2) they sought help from 3.75 +/- 3.22 physicians for PMS symptoms, (3) they thought the majority (71%) of physicians they used were not adequately informed to diagnose and treat them, (4) only a minority (23%) of physicians used a symptom chart, currently the only way to confirm a PMS diagnosis, when determining their diagnosis, and (5) only approximately 1 in 4 (26%) physicians provided them with a helpful treatment. Seventy-six percent of subjects reported that a PMS diagnosis resulted from their own suggestion, with an agreement by the physician. Eighty-one percent reported that the initial suggestion of PMS came from a non-medical source. The most commonly recommended and used treatments were vitamins, exercise, and diet modification. Current treatment satisfaction was 15.6% not very satisfied, 48.8% somewhat satisfied, and 35% very satisfied. Satisfaction was higher if natural progesterone or hysterectomy with oophorectomy was included as a treatment, although a high percentage of satisfaction was seen with several treatments. Data indicate that physicians from whom most of the women sought care between 1974 and 1994 failed to recognize, diagnose, or treat their PMS using the standards and protocols published in the medical literature.(ed)

RE: the idea that these ads are brand ID driven… I dunno, seems there is a marked difference in the way contraception and virility meds are marketed to men versus to women. (One potential virility med for women was derisively called the “Barbie Drug”)
I use the example that is creepiest to me, the SMILIN’ BOB commercials where every ad has Bob in some symbolic job or rite that is a visual pun for sex. The worst was where he was the office Santa, building a harem of the office assistants while his wife stood demurely by him, grinning like a valium addled hockey mom.
Gruesome, gruesome commercials.
I agree fully with Amanda that the majority of times the “PMS” label is quite a load of Shite. I as a man have experienced the vast majority of those symptoms myself, and would NOT be surprised to learn that just about everybody had cyclical periods of discomfort (oops, bad pun) throughout their lives.

P.S. I would appreciate a little warning. I almost fried my computer with coffee watching that Sarah Haskin video… Fargin’ hilarious!!!

haha, I’m protestant but I totally told my mom I was on the pill to control cramps.  When I was 23.  Because I’m a wimp.  It does have other helpful effects though.  When I got out of a long term relationship and was figuring on a long wait before my next sexual encounter, my doctor and I decided it was best for me to stay on the pill for those other benefits.

Except for those times when it causes PMS and depression.

Yup.  I can’t use hormonal birth control; it makes me crazy.  And I didn’t find it stopped cramps when I was on it; it turned my intermittent moderate cramps into a constant, slightly milder cramp, which was not an improvement.

The right-wing demonization of the birth control pill has made me more reluctant than I once was to hate on ads that present the pill as a fun fashion accessory.  Even so, they make me uncomfortable.  It’s a drug—a very safe one as drugs go, but still a drug, and some women cannot tolerate it.

I believe that the concept of PMS, a *pre-*menstrual syndrome, has often been conflated with the things that a lot of women suffer *during* their period.

Yup.  I think a lot of people use the term “PMS” euphemistically.

Opop, you’re right but it’s also true that “moodiness” hasn’t, as far as I can tell, been proven to haunt women who are about to menstruate.  “Before” your period, by the way, is any time you’re not having your period.  So for some people, they never have to deal with a woman’s anger. She’s “moody” because she’s PMS-ing.  You know, all the time.

Yeah, this is exactly my experience. I have never had any PMS symptoms, yet have gotten accused of it many times over the years. I’m not likely to put up with bullshit, and when I’ve argued with a guy to the point where he knows he’s wrong and he can either admit it or start personally attacking me, they always go for the bitch/PMS tactic. One even got it confused with actual menstruation and told me I needed a tampon. I had a big lollerskates over that one. After tracking the causes of my moodiness and irritability, I tend to find it’s when people piss me off. I definitely agree with your blaming the second shift for some of that - I’m not busy enough for it to exhaust me, but some of my most consistent periods of being irritable have come from playing housework chicken or being disrespected for obviously sexist reasons.

Well, we never speak frankly about sex on mainstream tv.  And we use euphemisms for other stuff, including menstrual products and laxatives. 

I think these commercials are more of the same, and it’s not good, but since when is advertising a social good?  I think there should be more condom ads on tv.

I did see a Mirena ad I thought was pretty good.  It didn’t talk about sex.  It just assumed you’d be having it.  It was all about whether you wanted to have a baby, emphasized the decision was reversible… I personally cannot wait to get an IUD, since both of my children are the result of daily-pill screwups.  They’re great, but I don’t want anymore.

Looking at that symptom list makes me realize a good number of those can be symptoms of hormonal issues, or of depression.  And yeah, pills can cause severe depression in some people, including my mom, and alleviate it in others.

Yaz and Yasmin were designed to treat the severe forms of PMS, and the commercials reflect that for brand differentiation.

I have to say I don’t agree with this.  Looking at that Yaz ad, what I see is the pharmaceutical equivalent of the archetypal ad for gatorade designed to make people think that the product will enable you to leap tall buildings with a single bound.  Zap those annoying premenstrual blues away!  It seems to be directed at all menstruating women, not women with a particular set of abnormal/pathologized symptoms.

I probably don’t have much to add.  Just that that pathologizing of what is normal for most women during various parts of their cycles is infuriating—stop telling me that I have some Dreadful Syndrome, and just give me advice (or products, we are talking about advertising) as to how best to mitigate the hormonal changes that give me cramps and take away my appetite.

As to the irritability thing, it’s interesting.  I’m not any more irritated by, say, my coworker’s endless rambling about her three-year-old; I just don’t have the patience to hide it as well.  Whether it’s a biological or sociological thing, I don’t know.  It’s just interesting PMS is used to demonize women who don’t put up with B.S., which leads back again the pathologizing of women and using social pressure to bring them back into line when they do something that doesn’t fit the ideal.

Though I have to ask, does anyone else have difficulty with words before or during her period?  I always “lose my nouns.”  I can visualize, say, a toaster, but it takes me a few seconds of babbling—“you know, the thingy you put bread into”—to finally grasp the right word.

I’m with you Opoponax, I have a day at most of pain and general malaise. 3 Advil, while not good for my liver, do wonders for my abdomen. I do like how my breasts get a little bigger, though. That’s something I wouldn’t trade

The one and only time I went on the pill, I had such a horrible reaction to it (5 pounds in 3 days, depression so severe I thought about hurting myself, vomiting constantly throughout the day) that I frigging THREW the package into the fire and stopped taking them. Felt immediately better when I stopped them. I didn’t take the pill to get rid of period crap, anyway. I took it so I would’t get knocked up. Plain and simple.

And as far as referring to those “symptoms” as…well…“symptoms, I think that’s just another mode of making women feel like their period is THE WORST THING EVER OMFG1!11!, and “oh poor BABY you have THE CURSE” instead of a normal bodily function that for the most part signifies a healthy, functioning reproductive system. I never have a problem with those things that happen before I get my period anyway because, shit, it means I’m not pregnant.

I also enjoy pancakes. NON SEQUITUR.

Symptoms aside, I’ve actually thought that a fair amount of women actively embrace the idea of “PMS” because they can use it to remind the world that they put up with a lot of shit in life, and for a few days a month, that just ain’t gonna fly anymore, so watch the fuck out.  It’s used to keep women contained, define them as bitchy and body-not-mind, passion-not-reason, yes, but I think for some women it also can become a way to authorize—and naturalize—subversion, albeit temporarily.

Oh yeah, there’s a serious hormonal component to IBS.  My anecdote is that my IBS got 90% better when I switched from the pill to NuvaRing (not dumping the hormones directly into my touchy belly and keeping the level constant rather than spiking once a day) and used the latter continuously (more with the constant level of hormones).  Of course, this means that my doc gets all worried because I gained a couple of pounds since I did this - um, hello, don’t you think a couple of pounds is better than recurrent nausea?  Especially since I can eat more things than bread now?

I as a man have experienced the vast majority of those symptoms myself, and would NOT be surprised to learn that just about everybody had cyclical periods of discomfort (oops, bad pun) throughout their lives.

Yup.  Insofar as mood changes do correlate to the menstrual cycle (not to having one’s period, but the reproductive cycle as a whole, which I have to say wouldn’t really surprise me, in an anecdata sort of way), I tend to refer to irritability in my male friends as “your man period”.  Mostly as a reversal joke, but again, men have hormonal cycles, too.  We just don’t really talk about them.

I get uneasy when people complain about drug companies/Teh Medical Establishment “pathologizing” non-life-threatening women’s health issues, such as those related to periods and pregnancy.  The typical way I hear people countering such marketing is by claiming that minor unpleasantness is “natural” or easily dismissed as “a minor inconvenience”...implying that women should just put up with it.  I don’t really care that my killer cramps and nausea are mere “inconveniences” in the big scheme of things.  If I can take a perfectly safe medication to get rid of them, I’m damn well going to, and I can’t say I mind if marketing tells me such things are available.  This BS gets even worse over pregnancy; I could have punched the pharmacist who told me that I shouldn’t take the medication I’d been recommended for the “inconvenience” of morning sickness unless I “really couldn’t handle it”.

I think the way Amanda puts it (“feeling achy or having diarrhea are considered problems themselves worth treating in men.  Why don’t women just get to have a headache and take an aspirin?”) is eminently sensible; I just wanted to add that knee-jerk resistance to prescription medicine is not a helpful reaction to the generalizations made by the marketing.

How can people honestly say *if* you’re going to have sex?  It’s actually *when* you’re going to have sex.

Two comments, from the belly of the pharma industry…

“You know, plus it gives drug manufacturers one more excuse to obscure the fact that yes, women use contraception for contraception…”

I think you’re overlooking the profit motive here.  The goal of Big Pharma is to come up with drugs that you take every day for the rest of your life.  If the pill is for contraception, then there’s no need to take it if you’re not in a sexual relationship and don’t expect to be in one any time soon—if you start needing the contraception, you can use other methods for as long as it takes to get the pills to take effect.

But if you’re taking it to control PMS, then you take it daily regardless of whether you need the contraception…  which of course means MORE sales.  Follow the money.

Similarly, as Ol Cranky says above, there are cases where insurance does not cover contraception but does cover PMS treatment.  Again, follow the money: insurance coverage means more sales and less patient price-sensitivity, at least among those who are lucky enough to have insurance.

DD

The typical way I hear people countering such marketing is by claiming that minor unpleasantness is “natural” or easily dismissed as “a minor inconvenience”...implying that women should just put up with it.

On the other hand, there really is no reason to pay more to go on a special Holy Shit You Are One Fucked Up Ho birth control pill when you could just take an aspirin like normal people. 

Most women who experience typical menstrual side effects do not need a prescription drug to “cure” them. 

Now if you can’t get out of bed due to cramps or a backache?  If   If you have horrible IBS flareups and spend 3 straight days in the bathrom?  Bloating so bad you can’t button your pants?  Go to the doctor.  Tell her/him what’s up.  The two of you can probably work through it, and if you end up on Yaz, then great.

The only reason the commercials exist, as far as I can tell, is to convince otherwise normal women that they need a drug they probably don’t need.  With the added side benefit of convincing the 95%  who do not experience abnormal period pain that there is something wrong with them if they so much as stare longingly at a burrito.

Well, provided aspirin works, sure.  My cramps were never bad enough to keep me from going about my day, but OTC medicine didn’t make a dent in them, either.  I acknowledge the problems involved in marketing drugs, especially in this context - I guess my point is that there shouldn’t be some arbitrary degree of suffering that’s “enough” to justify a woman saying “this sucks, I’m going to the doctor”.

I guess my point is that there shouldn’t be some arbitrary degree of suffering that’s “enough” to justify a woman saying “this sucks, I’m going to the doctor”.

Why not?  That arbitrary point exists for everyone, even for medical situations that are not gendered in the way periods are.  I had pretty bad allergies this morning, and because of the change in the weather have been expecting a cold.  I spent a few minutes this morning whether my sniffles merited a decongestant, or whether I should just remember to take my vitamins and get lots of rest and let the allergies do their annoying allergy thing. 

And, yes, allergies are another of those “should I sit it out, or see a doctor, or take something OTC, or what?” arbitrary grey areas.  I could probably get a scrip for allegra if I wanted one.  At this point my allergies usually aren’t bad enough to inspire me to tell my doctor about it.

I was going to write this longwinded whatever about estrogen levels during a woman’s cycle. Suffice to say, it’s interesting to me that a woman’s hormones spike at ovulation, not at menstruation, and that her hormone levels are generally at their lowest right before menstruation begins.

But I have previously maintained that every woman on the pill should loudly and proudly proclaim that she uses it for birth control, even if she is using it for cramps or acne or mood swings. Just put it in people’s faces. Don’t let anyone make you ashamed for being a sexual creature, even if you’re not sexually active! Don’t let yourself be painted as one of the “good girls” because they’re only putting you on that pedastle so they can knock you down later, it’s not because they love you.

/absolutely no Enya while walking on a beach in the sunset. none/

I don’t know.  You could make a pretty good tampon ad with “Orinoco Flow.”

(ducks)

also—I’m in total agreement with Opo—if you have horrible IBS or bloating so bad you can’t button your pants, you should be going to the doctor and the two of you should figure this out. You shouldn’t be getting your marching orders on your own health issues from a commercial, especially when the commercial is being intentionally vague about the drug’s purpose.

Briefly (sorry about that):

1) Read the FDA letter carefully. Amanda’s initial suspicion was spot-on.

This isn’t so much about the noble FDA fighting to protect consumers from the Big, Bad Pharma; it’s about the FDA deciding that women may not to be exposed to [fairly accurate] OCP ads seeing how women 1) are quite dimwitted, and 2) are easily distracted by shinny objects and pigeons [not kidding, I’m almost quoting !].

2) The author of the Salon article is clueless:

a)She misses the point of the ad. [The ad’s message: “Our OCP brand is birth control Plus.”]

b) She likely doesn’t bother to read the FDA letter. [Presumably, Bayer was hoping no one would pick up on the very significant difference between PMS and PMDD— but, what do you know, the FDA did! “. PMDD is mentioned in the, you know, actual ad. Also, the FDA letter mentions the PMDD ad, um, mention.]

c) She misreads the FDA’s action. [The FDA isn’t doing this to stop Big, Bad Pharma from advertising birth control pills as a lifestyle choice rather than, um, birth control. It’s doing it to stop OCP ads on TV.]

d) Just like the Lords of the FDA, she thinks that women are utter morons.

Why not?  That arbitrary point exists for everyone, even for medical situations that are not gendered in the way periods are.  I had pretty bad allergies this morning, and because of the change in the weather have been expecting a cold.  I spent a few minutes this morning whether my sniffles merited a decongestant, or whether I should just remember to take my vitamins and get lots of rest and let the allergies do their annoying allergy thing.

Not saying everyone should be medicated - like you said, everyone makes their judgement call about what you can deal with and what you can’t.  Certainly not saying you should take a commercial’s word about what medication is the solution if you decide you can’t.  What annoys me is pressure I’ve encountered to NOT take medication because a gendered complaint is “just an inconvenience”, which I’ll bet I wouldn’t hear about allergies.

Why not?  That arbitrary point exists for everyone,

Exactly. For every individual one. YOU don’t mind sitting around all day with bad sinuses and itchy eyes. Well, I do. So I’m takin’ my meds, and you’ll pry ‘em out of my cold dead hand. I’m not interested in “toughing out” my discomfort. I want to be alert and focused and not fucking sick all autumn.

That is what the poster you’re arguing with is talking about: she’s not comfortable with establishing some standard based on HER comfort level, or her doctor’s, or the FDAs, for what other women are supposed to suck up.

Also, if you are smart enough not to take your “marching orders” (as MP so eloquently put it) then why isn’t anyone else?

Why do you think women who aren’t you are too stupid to know whether they actually suffer once a month or not?

I’m glad that Amanda mentions Tavris. That book is one of my favorite books ever written about feminism. It’s sort of the all-purpose go-to-guide whenever someone starts arguing for a scientific basis for patriarchal gender roles.

If anyone here hasn’t read it, they should.

Mightyponygirl: It depends on the hormone. LH, FSH, and estrogen peak about a day before ovulation, but progesterone peaks, on average, exactly one week before your period and is the presumed cause of ‘PMS.’

Oddly enough, I have found that in me low progesterone levels cause me problems. I have a mild case of luteal phase defect (low progesterone that makes my period come on too soon and potentially impedes implantation and causes miscarriage) and started supplementing with progesterone cream. When I do, my monthly nausea and burning boobs of death are much better/less annoying. Which, for the record. goes away about day 3 of my cycle, thank everything above.

Exactly. For every individual one. YOU don’t mind sitting around all day with bad sinuses and itchy eyes. Well, I do. So I’m takin’ my meds, and you’ll pry ‘em out of my cold dead hand. I’m not interested in “toughing out” my discomfort. I want to be alert and focused and not fucking sick all autumn.

Exactly.  Which is why I think Allegra commercials are dumb.  You have bad allergies and want to do something about it?  Go to the doctor.  The two of you will work it out.  All the commercials do is get people thinking there is something wrong with them when, honestly, if it wasn’t bad enough to remember to tell your doctor about at your last physical, you probably don’t need a scrip.  Pick up some OTC Claritin or Benadryl Allergy at the drug store and move on with your life. 

That is what the poster you’re arguing with is talking about: she’s not comfortable with establishing some standard based on HER comfort level, or her doctor’s, or the FDAs, for what other women are supposed to suck up.

1.  I wasn’t aware that we were arguing. 

2.  I don’t think anyone’s supposed to suck anything up.  I think that the way prescription drugs are marketed to the average joe is ridiculous, and probably intended for somewhat nefarious purposes .  And, no, I don’t think all women (or all anyone) except me are dupes.  Marketing affects me, too.  Hells yea does that nuvaring say, to me, “oooh, convenient…  I should look into that…”  I try to make reasoned choices about what drugs to take,  but it’s difficult, and pharma advertising makes it a lot more difficult by encouraging people to self-diagnose and pathologize themselves.

My pet peeve is the yasmin commericial where they show a bunch of girls, most trying to be sneaky, saying or writing ‘yasmin’ without mentioning what the hell it is for. *oh noes don’t mention birth control out loud, write it on my hand*

I have struggled with debilitating menstrual symptoms my entire life; the writhing in pain can’t get out of bed type.  When I finally went on birth control however it was for good ol’ fashioned baby prevention, occasionally being able to get out of bed during my period was just one hell of a perk.

If I went cold turkey on my sex life tomorrow it would be a long debate whether I would stay on bc or not especially when I’m due at the clinic in a couple weeks and planning on asking for a seasonale script.

You have bad allergies and want to do something about it?  Go to the doctor.  The two of you will work it out.  All the commercials do is get people thinking there is something wrong with them when, honestly, if it wasn’t bad enough to remember to tell your doctor about at your last physical, you probably don’t need a scrip.

I, for one, had no idea there was prescription allergy medication at all until I saw—guess what?—an Allegra commercial. I don’t *have* annual physicals, my copay for visits is still more than I can afford regularly and I only just got the insurance this year (first time in SIX YEARS that I have been covered). Hell yes I would have mentioned the allergies to my doctor if I’d had one. 

When I finally did get to the doc, you’re damn right the first thing I said was, look, I have these awful allergies, what is your take on Allegra? Because I only saw the NP, not the doctor, and I only saw her for about 4 and a half minutes. I could have used all of those minutes laying out my symptoms and still just get a “eh, that’s allergies”, or I could bring up what I knew and get the damned stuff.

I agree that ideally, we’d market birth control pills as such: don’t want babies? take these. We’d have access to doctors who had time to speak with us and hammer out Sound Medical Solutions. I would also like free abortion on demand and a pony.

I realize that lots of people think of prescription meds as somehow “overkill,” like heroin instead of caffeine. But this just isn’t so, for many many many many things. Drugs we need prescriptions for here are not only OTC but cheap as fuck in other countries. It’s just that their docs aren’t For Profit, so there’s no $$ incentive to keep 85% of effective shit behind the prescription wall.

It’s used to keep women contained, define them as bitchy and body-not-mind, passion-not-reason, yes, but I think for some women it also can become a way to authorize—and naturalize—subversion, albeit temporarily.

Absolutely.  Every culture has a time where the people who are oppressed get some “free time” to act out (think about May Day revelries back in jolly ol’ England) before they get back to their day-to-day lives.  I’ve seen some people say that the menstrual hut in subsistence cultures isn’t there because women have bought into the idea that they’re filthy during their period (or at least not entirely).  It’s also there because that way a woman gets a goddamn break from the grind once a month and gets to go sit and talk with other women without worrying about her chores.

“PMS” gives a lot of women who otherwise would never speak up about anything an excuse to do so, and then they can go back to being sweet and Total Woman because, gosh, she just can’t help her hormones!

Damned thing keeps eating my posts.

Sigh. I realized, a moment after posting, that my whole irritation is because I regard advertising as shitty and damaging BY DESIGN, therefore I see no reason in demanding it improve itself…that would defeat the whole purpose.

If it wasn’t misleading and nefarious, it’d be a PBS special.

That aside, I am a “better living through Science” type who views the whole, “I can totally take this pain” philosophy as being a bit nuts. I do not see the value in maintaining a screaming headache or abdominal cramps for one second longer than it takes to find the appropriate cure. And if one can be reasonably certain of preventing same? All the better.

DAMN. It ate the second half of my post.

er…it was something like: I realize the debate is whether people are being overpathologized. But I guess my point is, if you have allergies that is a pathology, and I do not quite understand the outrage at someone advertising that their product addresses symptoms that most people find somewhat problematic. I do not know anyone who suddenly “decided” they had allergies based on a commercial. Possibly I know smarter-than-average (or just less hypochondriacal?) people, but given my own general denseness I doubt that.

This is not to undermine at all the idea that **women** are pathologized for having **emotions** but the two are separate problems.

hypatia writes:

If I went cold turkey on my sex life tomorrow it would be a long debate whether I would stay on bc or not especially when I’m due at the clinic in a couple weeks and planning on asking for a seasonale script.

I realize that anecdote does not equal data, but I *heart* my Seasonique scrip. (It’s like Seasonale, but instead of a placebo week, you get a week of low dose hormones.)  Two days of half-assed cramps and mild malaise once every three months?  WAY better than the 28 days of rage, followed by 10 days of pain and crying I used to have.

“I use the example that is creepiest to me, the SMILIN’ BOB commercials where every ad has Bob in some symbolic job or rite that is a visual pun for sex. The worst was where he was the office Santa, building a harem of the office assistants while his wife stood demurely by him, grinning like a valium addled hockey mom.
Gruesome, gruesome commercials.”

Did you hear about the founder being sent to prison for fraud? http://www.wcpo.com/news/local/story.aspx?content_id=da4ca689-d4ec-4a85-bd81-568828d852c9

http://www.columbusdispatch.com/live/content/health/stories/2008/01/16/enzyte.html

I hated watching late night tv due to the constant barrage of those crap ads. Thankfully when the founder was arrested 99 percent of the ads disappared. The other companies also had most of their ads booted off and we are talking directly claiming to enlarge your manhood by making it thicker and longer.

I swear they need to revamp the ad laws. If a commercial says scientificaly proven or some other misleading comment that makes someone think there was a scientific study done then the company making the product needs to be shut down.

Does anyone know off-hand what the difference is between the US and Canada when it comes to rules for drug advertising?  Up here I see print ads for birth control pills, and there’s plenty of stuff on TV for OTC medicine, but the wacky “side effects may include a list longer than my arm” TV commercials seem limited to american networks.

Advertising for prescription drugs is a recent innovation down here, and the drug companies don’t make money by advertising in Canada, AFAIK.

my copay for visits is still more than I can afford regularly and I only just got the insurance this year (first time in SIX YEARS that I have been covered). Hell yes I would have mentioned the allergies to my doctor if I’d had one.

It would be unlikely that many of the prescription drugs you see ads for on TV would be affordable without health insurance.  Not to mention that the drugs are still available by prescription only.  You still have to pay the copay to see the doctor and get the prescription. 

And, I’m sorry, but a world where people take their medical concerns to a physician and listen to that person’s advice on what the proper course of action ought to be, rather than storming into a doctor’s office demanding a certain drug they saw on Teh TeeVee, would be a much healthier world.  To say the least.

I realize that lots of people think of prescription meds as somehow “overkill,” like heroin instead of caffeine. But this just isn’t so…

You are going to have to stop putting words in my mouth, right now.  I don’t think prescription meds are bad, or dangerous, or anything of the kind.  I just think that if you’re not sick enough to see a doctor and mention a particular complaint, you’re not sick enough to need anything you can’t get over the counter.  People without health insurance cannot afford things like Yaz, Allegra, Ambien, Cialis, etc*.  Seeing a commercial for a prescription medicine does not improve your access to said medication. 

Drugs we need prescriptions for here are not only OTC but cheap as fuck in other countries.

Yes, and the reason for this is twofold.  Firstly, a lot of other countries have medical systems that work significantly differently from ours.  There are very few things you actually have to have a doctor’s prescription to get, and instead you report to a pharmacist, tell her/him your symptoms, and they will give you what they think is appropriate.  In those countries, the pharmacist takes on the “prescribing” role of the doctor.  You can’t just grab a handful of whatever, bring it up to the clerk at the register, and leave.  Said countries also are unlikely to have pharmacies as part of a larger supermarket or big box store, and especially unlikely to sell many medications in stores that don’t employ a full-time pharmacist.  The second reason is that some countries don’t have any particular regulatory system for anything.  You can get whatever you want with very few obstacles, but if you didn’t know that your blood pressure medication doesn’t react well with antidepressants, well, that’s your problem. 

* Yet another reason I hate pharma advertising is that often the most heavily advertised drugs are unlikely to be cost-effective even with health insurance, and likely to be in the period where there is no generic version yet available.  Going into the doctor and asking for ZYRTEC actually does most people who are trying to pinch pennies less good than going in and saying, “I have really bad allergies, can you prescribe me something?”, because in that situation the doctor is more likely to say “Oh, sure, here’s a scrip for Generic Allergy Thing X,” (or even, “You know, your symptoms don’t sound that severe.  Has Benadryl helped at all?”) and the patient is more likely to listen and not counter with, “But I saw this commercial for Allegra - can’t I have that?”

And, I’m sorry, but a world where people take their medical concerns to a physician and listen to that person’s advice on what the proper course of action ought to be, rather than storming into a doctor’s office demanding a certain drug they saw on Teh TeeVee, would be a much healthier world.  To say the least.

It would also be a much healthier world if doctors were allowed to spend more than 15 minutes at a time with their patients so the patients could actually take their medical concerns to a physician and have them listened to rather than being rushed out the door because, hey, time’s up, we’ll talk about your allergies next year!

You’re also assuming that (A) everyone sees the same doctor all the time and (B) that everyone’s insurance covers an annual checkup where people can talk about their concerns.  G.‘s employer-provided insurance—the only plan they offer—has a $1,000 deductible and doesn’t pay for your annual physical.  He usually goes and pays out of pocket anyway, but plenty of people will decide to save that $150 (plus fees for any tests the doctor requests) until they’re actually sick.

Eliminating advertising for prescription drugs won’t solve a damn thing if our current medical system stays exactly the same.  That’s why people are getting annoyed with you—you don’t seem to realize how many assumptions you’re working from, like that everyone gets an annual physical where they can discuss concerns with their doctor.  If we eliminate all prescription drug advertising, you’re still only going to be able to spend 15 minutes with your doctor, and s/he may well bolt out the door before you can ask what alternatives there are out there for your allergies, because the drug s/he prescribed last year didn’t really work, but you didn’t feel like spending $150 to come in for an office visit for a different prescription.

“Firstly, a lot of other countries have medical systems that work significantly differently from ours.”

Yeah universal health care. Another reason why drugs are cheaper is that the drug companies are limited in their profits so they cannot overcharge. Most drugs should only cost 30 dollars for a month instead in the us several hundred dollars are charged. Drug companies in the US get away since they have made people swallow the bull that the drug companies are responisble for new drugs when in reality they just reformulate existing drugs developed by universities.

The drug industry in the states is a sham.

No company is going to advertise a birth control pill with the message that it prevents pregnancy.  All bc pills do that.  They want you to pay more for their proprietary formulation, so they’re going to stress something that differentiates their pill from the generic stuff. 
Like when a company advertises a food product - does it say, eat this! It will keep you from starving to death!  Duh, we know that.  Tell us something that makes it better than peanut butter on crackers, would you?

i have never been given something to control my cramps. ever. the one time i complained about them, i was given shit by the doctor for over 10 minutes; he ranted and ranted about “hysterical pain” and called my a hypochindriac. which was, in general, the reaction i got from all my doctors until a little over a year ago.
if you are diagnosed with fibromalgia, it seems doctors quite believing you.

and, sadly? neither vicodin nor oxycodon help me with menstral cramps. but Midol does

Mnemosyne: “PMS” gives a lot of women who otherwise would never speak up about anything an excuse to do so, and then they can go back to being sweet and Total Woman because, gosh, she just can’t help her hormones!

YES. I’d never thought much about PMS at all before I went to university and met this very conservative Christian student (who believed that women shouldn’t lead/preach etc.) who kept going on about it and acting as though all women suffered from it. For her, I think PMS served as a ‘proof’ of women’s inferiority as well as an easy excuse for her to use when she wanted to act ‘rebelliously’.

I became seriously skeptical of PMS after reading ‘Once a Month’ by Katherina Dalton, the person who is said to have coined the term. That book is highly disturbing - it promotes the idea that all women suffer from PMS (at all times, pretty much) and that men are better at telling whether women are suffering from it than women themselves.

Considering the number abstinence-only education is doing on young women in this country,

YES, BIRTH CONTROL PILL ADS NEED TO TALK ABOUT BIRTH CONTROL.

People need to know about the effectiveness and possible side effects/risks, because they’re not getting it in class. They don’t need more hazy, non-specific discussion about symptoms. Drugs that treat “symptoms” (like Claratin) are not generally thought of as daily regimen drugs.

Now, the whole “are women really so stupid that they would only take the BCP when they had an acne breakout or a cramp?”

I dunno, you tell me. I DO know that I’ve heard teenagers describe all sorts of stuff as “preventative birth control” that’s a one-way-ticket to knockedupville, because they’re so afraid of getting seen buying a pack of condoms, or asking their parents for a visit to the doctor to get a prescription, that they’re willing to put bleach up in their nootch after sex because they think it will kill the sperm, since no one is going to give you stinkeye at the local wal-mart if you’re buying a bottle of bleach. So I bet there are a lot of people out there that think you can take one BCP right after sex and you won’t get pregnant (confusing it with Plan B).

Right before I get my period my boobs get huge.

However, this co-worker and I would get into arguments because he is an idiot and a chauvinist asshole of the Nice Guy® type, and didn’t know how to read a map or he insisted on doing the math or anything that I could do better because he had a penis dontchaknow?  Anyway, he woud always condescend to me after I won an argument by saying: “Aw, poor you, your probably PMSing pretty bad”, until the last time I tod him, in front of people, that he is also bad in math when I’m not on my period.

All studies to the contrary aside, I am convinced I get moody or irritable right before my period. But I’ve also noticed that whatever I get upset about is something that bothers me all the time anyway. It’s just normally it’s a small irritation that I can shunt aside. So instead of treating or trying to suppress my irritation, I make a mental note of whatever it was that set me off and look at again when I’m in a better mood. Sometimes it really is a small thing, and I let it go, the same way anyone might get snappy when tired or stressed. Other times, I decide it’s something that needs to be dealt with and I resolve to bring it up with whoever pissed me off in a constructive way, rather than continue to simmer. I actually find it really useful and helpful to my emotional health.

I also find that I feel a little run down during my period. Given that my period these days is two days of ridiculously heavy bleeding and then it’s over (I’m not a teenager or on the pill - just been on a non-hormonal IUD for a while), it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out why I might feel a little drained. I just give myself permission to take it easy, not go to the gym, sleep in, whatever. Why should I go full-throttle all the time?

Except for those times when it causes PMS and depression.

Yep.  Yasmin GAVE me PMS (or I guess I should call it PMDD now - it was quite severe). I had never had a single PMS symptom before taking it, then bam! every single one on that list. At certain times of the month, I would cry over having made a typo (I am not exaggerating).  It also made me gain 20 pounds in 3 months and looking back I realize I was depressed (though not severely) the entire 2 years I was taking it.  When I stopped taking it, my PMS improved, but it has never gone away.

Then, years after stopping Yasmin, I stupidly decided to try Yaz, the lower-dose version.  It made me suicidally depressed, and the only reason that has let up even the little bit that it has in the nearly year and a half since I stopped taking it is because I went back on the microgestin that worked pretty well for me before.  This isn’t even PMS, because it’s all the time, though worst right before and during my period.  I haven’t felt like myself since about a week after I started taking Yaz.  It has knocked my hormones totally askew (depression isn’t my only side effect, and I’m not the only woman it’s done this to, just google Yaz side effects).  I’ve spent thousands of dollars in the past year and a half to try and figure out what’s going on, and no one can tell me anything because no doctors I can find know anything about female hormone imbalances, except maybe in post-menopausal women.

I realize this is somewhat of a digression, because my problems have nothing to do with advertising.  But I feel like the advertising is part of a continuum of behavior by pharmaceutical companies and doctors where pharmaceutical companies don’t do sufficient testing or reporting of side-effects, doctors don’t pay sufficient attention to possible side effects and don’t advise patients of them, and also doctors buy into what the pharmaceutical companies say about their products—I wouldn’t have been given Yasmin/Yaz if they didn’t believe the companies that they were the hot new awesome thing that was great for everybody.  The pharmaceutical companies are advertising to doctors, too, not just to patients, and the doctors are nearly as prone to buying into it hook line & sinker as the patients are.